First Scope Daughter and I

[hms_furious]

24 minutes ago, dd999 said:

Yes gotos can be manually controlled. The AZ Gti (or AZ GTe) mentioned above can be controlled by up, down, left, right arrow buttons on the phone or tablet app - or you can select an object and hit goto to take you there. 

Or you can go old school and manually move the telescope by hand to choose an object. 

If you do look at these mounts one piece of advice (from someone who has just bought one) if you feel you may want to move the telescope by hand as well as using the app in the same night - the AZ GTi may be a better choice. 

This is simply because the AZ GTi remembers its position. So if you align, start using the app to manually control or goto - but then decide to move it by hand to quickly point the telescope to something interesting you see - it'll remember where it was and you can pick up via the app from where you left off. So no need to do the realignment again. 

The AZ GTe doesn't remember where it was so if you do this you need to start the alignment again (about a 5-10min job) if you want to go back to goto mode. 

A lot of detail I know - but someone pointed this out on here before I bought, and was enough to convince me of the AZ GTi over the AZ GTe. 

I'll leave it to the dob experts for the other question. 

Embarrassing question, what does AZ GTi and AZ GTe stand for? I googled with no luck. 

[dd999]

Not embarrassing - these are just product names, which you may have seen when you Googled. 

The AZ part, I assume, stands for Alt-Azimuth (which is how the mount is moved, on two axis - horizontal and vertical). 

Another assumption is the GTi and GTe are product names rather than abbreviations for anything specific to astronomy - but I could be wrong. 

[bomberbaz]

Yes I reckon that answer is right too dd999.

Ben, I think the az gti will be perfect for your daughter tbh (oh and you 😅 ). A blend of science and technology will be great to stimulate the young mind along with the Turn left at Orion book which is on its way I hasten to add.

Steve

[AstroMuni]

On 26/06/2020 at 22:30, hms_furious said:

Thanks for your replies so far. The 200p was on my watch list. Always wonder of course if there is something better or different I should be looking at. What I don't want to do is buy and regret and wish i had something else. 

I dont know how tight your budget is, but set aside funds for buying good eyepieces. I started my hobby in a similar way to you and found out the hard way that eyepieces can cost a lot as compared to the scope 🙂

[DaveS]

A 130 P-DS on an AZ-GTi sounds a good option to me, plus the 130 P-DS is a good little imaging 'scope should you want to go in that direction at some point. Beware though, AP can be a slippery slope to a bottomless money pit.

But budget for some better eyepieces than the ones supplied, and also for a Cheshire collimating eyepieces.

Although the AZ-GTi can be operated via WiFi by the free Synscan software on a smartphone / tablet I found doing so a pain as my 'phone screen, even in red-light mode, was bright enough to affect my night vision. The Synscan handset might be worth looking at as a later addition.

[hms_furious]

Thanks again all. I love how this place is so friendly and helpful.

As far as I can see these are the two gotos that also have a decent manual option that have been recommended

https://www.rothervalleyoptics.co.uk/skywatcher-skymax-127-az-gti-wifi-telescope.html

https://www.rothervalleyoptics.co.uk/skywatcher-explorer-130ps-az-gti-wifi-telescope.html

The later being the wifi version of the scope that was recommended just above.

They are both 5" but one has a longer focal length (which I thought was the length of the telescope, however the 127 looks significantly stubbier that the 130 but it could just be in the photo). Presuming I am right on focal length, am I correct in saying that a longer focal length will give me a narrower field of view but a close magnification?

I linked to RVO only because they were both on that site, but is there something with a larger primary mirror with a GTi mount? The are very close to the entry-ish 130p and I like the idea of the tripod style grab and go but would like to consider something bigger?

 

The next size up on RVO is something like this https://www.rothervalleyoptics.co.uk/celestron-astro-fi-6-sct-wifi-telescope.html but surely there must be something closer based on something like a https://www.firstlightoptics.com/dobsonians/skywatcher-skyliner-200p-dobsonian.html with a wifi mount or is that just too rookie for these things - or too big?

Thanks again

[dd999]

The AZ Gti can only take the weight (also called payload) of 5kg - a 130ps is 4kg, so gives you an idea. The Astro Fi mount you mentioned looks to only take a weight of 3.6kg. There may be other WiFi based options that will give you the ability to carry heavier scopes (not that I have seen but others here may know) but if there were these would be a lot more expensive.

If for though you wanted a bigger scope, and say for example you wanted to move from the 130ps to the bigger 150pds - then you'll need a bigger mount. A bigger mount means more money. A 150pds on a EQ5 mount (bigger and more stable than a grab and go) and with a goto (hand controlled not WiFi through an app) will set you back around £750-£800 - so a lot more.

If though you wanted to try your hand at astrophotography - you'll probably need an even bigger mount, the HEQ5. Then a 150pds, with HEQ5 and goto, brand new will cost close to £1,000 (and that's without the camera!). Even on the second hand market you'll often pay around 70% or more of retail prices (depending on the condition) but bargains pop up from time to time.

Just some comparison's to show you how money chomping this little hobby is

Edited July 2, 2020 by dd999

[RT65CB-SWL]

24 minutes ago, hms_furious said:

They are both 5" but one has a longer focal length (which I thought was the length of the telescope, however the 127 looks significantly stubbier that the 130 but it could just be in the photo).

The reason that is appears 'stubbier' is because it is a Maksutov design and the 130 is the traditional Newtonian.

Mak's & SCT's are very good lunar and planetary 'scopes. A few of the downsides are:

1. a narrow field of view - you can still observe DSO's with them, but may not get the whole thing in the e/p.
2. the f/ratio is usually begins at around f/10 which is slow.
3. notorious dew magnets - a dew shield is a 'must have' accessory.
4. require cooldown before viewing. 

[DaveS]

The Skymax 127 is a Maksutov-Cassegrain design, which means it has a concave primary of relatively short focal length, and a convex secondary which has the effect of multiplying the focal length, giving a leng FL in a short tube.

Although the 130P is a good 'scope it has several shortcomings if you are thinking of putting a camera on it later, mainly to do with reaching focus with a camera. It also has a single speed focuser rather than the 2 speed of the 130P-DS.

By the time you get to a 200mm 'scope it's starting to be a bit of a beast for small mounts to handle, note that the AZ-GTi is only rated for 5kg payload which is why you're seeing it with small 'scopes attached. A GOTO mount that can handle a 200mm 'scope is going to be pricey.

Something like This 

Or for an Alt-Az goto

This 

 

Edit: Damn, I'm so slow at typing that two got in before me. My post still stands though

Edited July 2, 2020 by DaveS

[bomberbaz]

Lots of Az goto here Dan, all with handsets and including the 150i, bit more aperture for you

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/az-goto.html

The az goto wireless bunch are here

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/sky-watcher-az-gti-wifi.html

[hms_furious]

So in my typing typical indecisiveness I am still umming and ahing. 

I pretty sure I want this wifi mount

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/sky-watcher-az-gti-wifi/sky-watcher-az-gti-wifi-alt-az-mount-tripod.html

I like the control by smartphone option, tracking, option of manual movement and most importantly knowing what daughter is seeing. 

I know FLO have some bundles but what do you recommend? I know the mount limits the size but I am thinking of this as a good starter scope meets a good grab and go for the future. 

Ideally an all rounder would be ideal but I know my options may be limited.

Thanks again everyone 

[bomberbaz]

15 hours ago, hms_furious said:

So in my typing typical indecisiveness I am still umming and ahing. 

I pretty sure I want this wifi mount

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/sky-watcher-az-gti-wifi/sky-watcher-az-gti-wifi-alt-az-mount-tripod.html

I like the control by smartphone option, tracking, option of manual movement and most importantly knowing what daughter is seeing. 

I know FLO have some bundles but what do you recommend? I know the mount limits the size but I am thinking of this as a good starter scope meets a good grab and go for the future. 

Ideally an all rounder would be ideal but I know my options may be limited.

Thanks again everyone 

I use a 127mak on my AZ GTi, the mount easily manages with it and the scope is a decent all rounder. You can even use it for basic phone photography.  Oh and get the extension tube. 

[hms_furious]

Thanks Baz. Do you have any issues with dew? 

[bomberbaz]

4 hours ago, hms_furious said:

Thanks Baz. Do you have any issues with dew? 

Mak always attract dew, I use a homemade dew shield although FLO sell them too.

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/dew-prevention/astrozap-flexible-dew-shield.html