ZWO ASIAIR Pro + two ZWO ASI120MC-S Cameras

[KEJ]

Hi

 

Yesterday I received my ASIAIR Pro to go along with my AZ-GTI mount and various cameras.

It's worth saying that I am very new to the world of DSO.

 

Stage1

Imaging: Nikon DSLR

Guiding: ASI120MC-S (camera 1)

So, I had a quick run through in the kitchen(as it was daytime) after first backing up the SD card and updating the firmware on the ASIAIR.

Now, with the ASIAIR Pro cabled to the AZ-GTI, my ZWO ASI120MC-S(guiding) plugged into a guide scope and my Nikon DSLR(imaging) connected to WO Z61, I was ready to go.

Next I configured them in the App and it all seemed to work well and I could traverse to various objects on my kitchen ceiling that appeared to line up with the related objects as they would be positioned in the night sky.

I could take pictures and they would be copied to both the DSLR and my IPhone - all good so far.

 

Stage2

Imaging: ASI120MC-S (camera 2)

Guiding: ASI120MC-S (camera 1)

Next, (don't ask) as I have two ZWO ASI120MC-S cameras, I thought ok, lets try using them for both the imaging and the guiding.

So, I unplugged my DSLR, extended the Z61 and plugged one of the ASI120's into the scope Z61.

This time however, when I went into the App, it seemed to get confused, it detected each camera, but it would appear the App only lets you use one at a time.

So I could alter between using one for imaging and the other for guiding, but not both at the same time, which I obviously want to do.

 

Question

Has anyone come across similar issues and if so, how did you overcome them ?

 

Even wondering if the cameras firmware has a config file that I could rename it........I will have a further play this afternoon, but thought in the meantime I would ask the question on here, I have also emailed ZWO and dropped a question on the ASIAIR website.

Thanks in advance

 

ps: (don't ask) I had one ZWO ASI120MC-S that I bought a few years ago and recently when I recently got the WO Z61 that came with another ! along with a Meade DSI II I bought years ago and never used, all of which I now suspect will all be sold!!!

Edited June 17, 2020 by KEJ

[Robindonne]

Maybe try starting with one asi120 unplugged and the other connected one given a role as guider for example.   What happens when you plug in the second one?   Maybe it recognizes it better

[KEJ]

Thanks for replying.

I did try that, but I tried so many things, I might go back through in a more methodical order, could be something daft like you can overcome it by configuring the imaging camera first or vice versa!

I did also wonder if the cameras have a config file, simple text change(add 02) to name etc.

I know the ZWO ASI120MC-S is probably not the best camera in the world for DSO, but seeing as I have them, thought I would give them a go, my goto for the moment is the DSLR, but curious and want to overcome this issue.

 

I will set everything up again now and have a play.......watch this space.

Edited June 17, 2020 by KEJ

[Star101]

I dont have an answer but, As soon as I read the initial part of this thread I knew where you were going....two same camera's = confusion!

I have ASI1 and ASI2 on my SGPro. The ASI1 is my 290C cool and the ASI2 in the 183MM Pro. 

It would be good if it would use serial numbers or MAC address or some other unique addressing system.  And allow one to rename it as and when.

 

[stash_old]

As the ASIAIR is based on Indi there is no way you can,as far as am aware last time I looked, simultaneously  Image (not guide + image which is OK) using 2 camera's(even if they are not the same make) at the same time.

I do confess  not  to follow the ASAIR products in depth so maybe they have done something clever - but dont hold your breathe.

But if someone has found a way with ASIAIR or Indi please let us know. Or you could email(or forum)  ASI 🙂 with your problem.

The nearest I have found is to run Indiserver on 2 Rasp PI's and use something 2 instances of EKOS/Kstars or CCDCIEL. BUT mount cordination (plus other things) and other things become a problem .

Maybe @GINA found a way (Not ASIAIR) when digging deep into the code for the 2 camera set up (ALL SKY ?) 

Plus if the same type of camera cant be idenitfied via a unique serial number than Linux is always going to get confused and it means using something called UDEV rules to match position in a hub port - Dont know if ASIAIR allows that deep a change in its set up - probably!

But Astro software development is always very fluid - or maybe OAcapture might help.

OH forgot ASI comment on Linux using 120mm camera = quote " Our ASI120MM/MC camera is not compatible very well with Linux."  but I had assumed the newer USB3 version had solved this issue.

Edited June 17, 2020 by stash_old

[Robindonne]

I wonder if it will work in the end.  

1 hour ago, stash_old said:

simultaneously  Image (not guide + image which is OK) using 2 camera's(

As i read the problem its for guiding and maincam.  So even two different purposes gives problems using the same.  

[stash_old]

4 minutes ago, Robindonne said:

I wonder if it will work in the end.  

As i read the problem its for guiding and maincam.  So even two different purposes gives problems using the same.  

Yes I know -  I was just explainging the problem Linux has with camera's of the same make that cannot be uniquely identified by the Linux system even using UDEV rules https://www.thegeekdiary.com/beginners-guide-to-udev-in-linux/#:~:text= Beginners Guide to Udev in Linux ,node cannot be changed by Udev%2C... More  . Plus there is an historical problem with the USB2 version model 120mm.  If Linux cannot identify each 120mm then ASIAIR (aka Indi) hasn't a chance and will present the wrong camera .

So I reiterate to use 2 x  asi120mm ,1 x guiding, 1 x main image , Linux has to be able to consistantly assign the same address (ttyUSBx) to the correct camera.

The final solution is to plugin ,note the address of the device and connect to each camera manually - so plugin 120mm used as main image camera -note the address used - connect manually in the Profile and then plugin the 120mm Guiding camera and the same - a right pain in the backside.

If they can be identified then you would have to use UDEV rules and give each a new name - e.g. /dev/imagecam and /dev/guidecam - and use these device names in the profile. At least this way it should be a "once only" change and allow auto connect.

All this assumes ASIAIR Pro users have the same full access as Indi users do to the Command line /Root Priviledges - or the App (which I have never used - as I use full "RAW" Indi ) is more intelligent at working out this problem which I guess it isn't reading the initial details. Hence the suggestion to email ASI.

The use of "dual" imagine notes were for future reference as people normally ask about it 🙂

[Robindonne]

23 minutes ago, stash_old said:

Yes I know -  I was just explainging the problem Linux has with camera's of the same make that cannot be uniquely identified by the Linux system even using UDEV rules https://www.thegeekdiary.com/beginners-guide-to-udev-in-linux/#:~:text= Beginners Guide to Udev in Linux ,node cannot be changed by Udev%2C... More  . Plus there is an historical problem with the USB2 version model 120mm.  If Linux cannot identify each 120mm then ASIAIR (aka Indi) hasn't a chance and will present the wrong camera .

So I reiterate to use 2 x  asi120mm ,1 x guiding, 1 x main image , Linux has to be able to consistantly assign the same address (ttyUSBx) to the correct camera.

The final solution is to plugin ,note the address of the device and connect to each camera manually - so plugin 120mm used as main image camera -note the address used - connect manually in the Profile and then plugin the 120mm Guiding camera and the same - a right pain in the backside.

If they can be identified then you would have to use UDEV rules and give each a new name - e.g. /dev/imagecam and /dev/guidecam - and use these device names in the profile. At least this way it should be a "once only" change and allow auto connect.

All this assumes ASIAIR Pro users have the same full access as Indi users do to the Command line /Root Priviledges - or the App (which I have never used - as I use full "RAW" Indi ) is more intelligent at working out this problem which I guess it isn't reading the initial details. Hence the suggestion to email ASI.

The use of "dual" imagine notes were for future reference as people normally ask about it 🙂

I think this is an option for the category “thx for the suggestion we will look into it” at zwo headquarters! Maybe later

[KEJ]

Thank you all.

I did email ZWO/ASI yesterday and on the ASIAIR Pro product page asked the question(still waiting for it to appear).

 

Earlier

So,  I did once again try, but on the initial config page you can only make active one of the options(so pick main or guide) using the same camera.

Then once you are using the App, the same applies really.

I then tested my Nikon D800(FF) for imaging and ASI120MC-S for guiding and that seemed to work fine(indoors daytime test).

 

Yesterday

I tested my Nikon D3300(crop) for imaging and ASI120MC-S for guiding and that seemed to work fine(indoors daytime test).

 

 

Edited June 17, 2020 by KEJ

[Robindonne]

2 hours ago, Robindonne said:

I think this is an option for the category “thx for the suggestion we will look into it” at zwo headquarters! Maybe later

Sorry. I meant: thank you for the advice, we are talking about it!

[KEJ]

fingers crossed