Yet another new telescope question/help !

[Ptarmigan]

My 12" dob is about as light as one of this aperture can get (around 26kg in total) , ,

I don't think I'd fancy your 2 flights of steps and 100 yards

Me neither !

Actually, the two flights of steps and a short pathway are the problem, after that a Baldrick type crafty plan comes into operation, which Tiny has guessed ! Please can I have a motorised one of those ! cos my driveway is downhill and the lane is uphill !

Mind you, that all is just contingency for transient events, most of the time I am happy by my front door with a view from the NW round to the south for the regular things.

But that's another story, time for bed, more scratchings of the brain cell tomorrow,

thanks all , ,

[scarp15]

For a clearer understanding of the sense of scale, here are a couple of pictures showing my C8, which is set up on a fairly basic pre goto R.A fork mount and my former 12" 300p flextube. My C8 is a grab and go. I used 2" wide field e.p's with both scopes, such as a 27mm and 35mm panoptic.

[bomberbaz]

Lovecthe laser fitted on the c8, use that to get close and the telrad to finish off do you Iain.

[Tiny Small]

That is a grab and go? You must use the gym an awful lot.

[Ptarmigan]

The 300p goto is a 1 man job, its simple, trust me.

Could you perhaps say a few more words on that ? Sounds good but , ,

From the link given by YKSE

 "Tubus ca. 21kg - Montierung ca. 18,5kg" (shame we have to go foreign to find this info, cant UK vendors oblige ? )

I dont think I could carry both together assembled however,

21kg is probably just about ok to carry about lovingly clutched to my chest ! , but to thread into a delicate / confined / machined dovetail drive space (in the GOTO version) may require wifely assistance for micro-manipulation ??!

Ok in the evening but perhaps less so at 4am.

Although, thinking about that, I wouldnt be setting up at 4am, I would be taking down, so a simple one-man lift out would be easy/practical ?

iyswim.

Perhaps I need to find a demo-showroom, or maybe I'm making molehills

[bomberbaz]

The fitting on the goto is designed to help the slot together easily, I do it all the time in just torchlight and havent failed yet. Lets be honest though the wdight isnt the issue here either, its the size, the two parts are rather cumbersome, especially the base. I would recomend finding someone with one setup to try for size, the furthest I have carried is probs less than 100yd and you know you have carried it. Not trying to put u off as u will love the scope, the views would be worth the effort but just making you aware.

Hth, steve

[Ptarmigan]

The fitting on the goto is designed to help the slot together easily, I do it all the time in just torchlight and havent failed yet. 

,

Not trying to put u off as u will love the scope, the views would be worth the effort but just making you aware.

Many thanks, great info, good to know that they have taken care over this aspect of the design, one hears so much about other things ( bendy bolts in mounts and other places needing BobsKnobs etc ! )

and dont worry about putting me off (or encouraging me to go )

all input /suggestions /opinions /likes&dislikes all welcome from y'all

I have several Baldrick type cunning plans and

whatever I decide is my decision alone after contemplating all infos.

And despite modern litigeous society I wont be blaming anyone if something doesnt turn out to be "quite so so" :)

Anyway, you all have been very helpful and it is time I outlined my Baldricks

are you sitting comfortably , , ,

B1) Get a Nexstar 8SE and think about a light bucket later, easy peasy.

B2) Get a 300goto now and try it for size

      B2a) If it is good to portable, job done

      B2b) If it is too big to portable, re-assign it to special duties by the front door and buy an 8SE for portable  (or even a 6SE)

      B2c) If it is too big to portable, re-assign it to special duties by the front door and buy a 200 for portable use (?goto? probably not)

The problem with B2b and B2c

is that having got a 300 it would then be difficult to later justify a 350 or 400 for non-portable special lightbucket duties.

so I might then have to contemplate buying a 24" mirror set from JohnN !!!

B1 seems to be winning at the mo

[JulianFR]

Why would it need a new focuser? The skywatcher crayfords are perfectly reasonable. If you are not happy at a later date you can get an upgrade mod for much less than a new focuser. Having just installed this; http://www.365astronomy.com/dual-speed-110-microfocus-upgrade-kit-for-skywatcher-crayford-focusers-p-2484.html, I can say that my focuser has now gone from perfectly reasonable to very good indeed.

l have one of these Lacerta micro-focusers and it's been really good for me: effective, great value, easy to fit and an all round good option till I can afford a Moonlight-class focuser.

365Astronomy is a good company too.

[scarp15]

Lovecthe laser fitted on the c8, use that to get close and the telrad to finish off do you Iain.

Just a humble mostly unused finder scope. I use the telrad most of the time, now fitted on this scope with w 2" riser bar.

That is a grab and go? You must use the gym an awful lot.

Both the scopes are quite manageable, I do I guess keep fairly fit as I lug around quite heavy kit bags full of resource equipment I use for work. The scope on the tripod though is my 'grab and go'. Whilst I do not set it up as one, I can maneuver it a short distance in one piece.

ll

B1) Get a Nexstar 8SE and think about a light bucket later, easy peasy.

B2) Get a 300goto now and try it for size

      B2a) If it is good to portable, job done

      B2b) If it is too big to portable, re-assign it to special duties by the front door and buy an 8SE for portable  (or even a 6SE)

      B2c) If it is too big to portable, re-assign it to special duties by the front door and buy a 200 for portable use (?goto? probably not)

The problem with B2b and B2c

is that having got a 300 it would then be difficult to later justify a 350 or 400 for non-portable special lightbucket duties.

so I might then have to contemplate buying a 24" mirror set from JohnN !!!

B1 seems to be winning at the mo

The Celestron 8SE I notice is currently listed on offer at FLO.

[Ptarmigan]

The Celestron 8SE I notice is currently listed on offer at FLO.

Yes, I saw that, earlier today I was about to make a decision and reach for the phone,

then I realised that I couldnt see a phone number,

am I going blind or does our beloved sponsor not do that ?

[scarp15]

They do respond very quickly to email enquiries.  I did phone them once, although I cannot recall how I sourced the contact number. Best to email though.

[bomberbaz]

Bit of advice about the Nexstar, they have differing methods of setting the goto, people prefer different methods so be aware. I preferred the 2 star auto but that was me.

What ever scope you go for if it is a goto. if the scope doesn't include a level, buy a cheap spirit level and stick it in your bits bag. Getting the scope level makes a huge difference despite what people may say.

I have read on this forum and other astro ones that some users say leveling makes no difference to things. Now i may be wrong but I think if this was true that the manufacturers  would be using this as a selling point! I haven't seen anything like that yet on any of their websites etc. #getitlevel

steve

[ollypenrice]

Bit of advice about the Nexstar, they have differing methods of setting the goto, people prefer different methods so be aware. I preferred the 2 star auto but that was me.

What ever scope you go for if it is a goto. if the scope doesn't include a level, buy a cheap spirit level and stick it in your bits bag. Getting the scope level makes a huge difference despite what people may say.

I have read on this forum and other astro ones that some users say leveling makes no difference to things. Now i may be wrong but I think if this was true that the manufacturers  would be using this as a selling point! I haven't seen anything like that yet on any of their websites etc. #getitlevel

steve

I've never heard anyone claim that you don't need to level an alt-az mount. You do, as you say. It is part of the computer model of the sky stored in the mount. What you certainly will have read (possibly in my posts because I've mentioned quite regularly regarding pier design) is that German Equatorials don't need levelling, and they don't. Takahashi don't even put levelling adjusters on the tripods of their very expensive mounts and they do use it as a selling point. Their system, also found on some Vixen mounts, has you polar aligned to photographic accuracy in about two minutes without wasting time levelling. It is by far the best system available.

Regarding the scope choice, I find myself feeling boxed in by SCTs due to the long focal length. Not all share this feeling. Contrary to an earlier post a 2 inch back and good ultra wide EP makes a lot of difference but I still like to get a wide, wide field on many targets. On the other hand an Alt-Az 8 inch SCT is gloriously convenient to use visually. I de-forked our 10 inch SCT to try and use it for imaging and I heartily wish I'd not done so. A fork (or arm) SCT is so nice in Alt Az.

Olly

[Joves]

I agree. An SCT in fork-arm alt-AZ mode is a lovely visual instrument. I adore my manual alt-AZ refractors, which tend to get the most use, but when I dust off the SCT, I always have a lot of fun.

[bomberbaz]

read it on here several times olly and they were on about altaz mounts. Cannot remember who but it was when i bought the nexstar 8. 

[GuillermoBarrancos]

read it on here several times olly and they were on about altaz mounts. Cannot remember who but it was when i bought the nexstar 8. 

Alt-Az Mounts need to be acurately leveled, or you won´t be able to achieve precice GoTo alignment.

With EQ Mounts, when a Mount isn´t acurately leveled, you can compensate for it during the polar alignment process. Something that is not possible with Alt-Az Mounts.

[Ptarmigan]

"Alt-Az Mounts need to be acurately leveled"

You have omitted the word "Some",,Alt-Az need,,,

Some manufacturers do not offer a full implementation of the rigorous sperical geometries to define your local alt/az coordinates with the necessary stellar observations needed. They assume that the neophyte amateur astronomer is more familiar with spirit levels than (s)he is with the stars thus they think it is easier to substitute "leveling" as an input. But a defined(inputed!) local horizon is not required by the full maths with sufficient stars that would result in the

EDITeeek, not sure wha

[Ptarmigan]

Arrrgh ! pesky compuers ! Am I back in ? Try again :-

Some manufacturers do not offer a full implementation of the rigorous sperical geometries to define your local alt/az coordinates with the necessary stellar observations needed. They assume that the neophyte amateur astronomer is more familiar with spirit levels than (s)he is with the stars thus they think it is easier to substitute "leveling" as an input.

But a defined(inputed!) local horizon is not required by the full maths with sufficient stars that would result in the 3 orthogonal unit vectors needed (for the stars , ,  the planets are another ball game )

Levelling _partially_ defines one vector ( ie. the plane in which that vector resides) for the alt/az case, whereas polar aligning _does_define_ one of the needed vectors for the eq. case. Remember that an equatorial mount is just another man's(observer's) alt/az ( in that case Polaris becomes one of the needed stellar observations )

[Ptarmigan]

#getitlevel

Actually there are some clever 3-axis accelerometer chips about these days (much loved by amateur seismologists in California !) 'sbout time a clever alt/az got em in !

and rumour has it that some 'phones now have em inem, just lay your phone down on yer mount, shirly there must be an app for this ?! My daughter just needs to point her phone to tell me what is where in the sky, she used to enjoy me pointing things out , , I have become redundant, boohoo