It's that time of the year again...... Expectations and AP

[garethmob]

Well iv noticed in nearly every beginner thread lately nearly every one mentions the aspiration of doing AP and I really don't want to sound off or anything but I think the media today and mags are not portraying how difficult AP actually is

With the small amount of kit iv got and had iv easily spent just on getting to where I am now £2000 with getting the wrong stuff, software, any extras and still haven't got a really decent image to my name (ok maybe be but it was a fluke) and that's not including the nights outside in frustration with nothing going right, clouding over, and the hours poring over software trying to get images to look less orange and more DSO like

And the real only cheap way is DIY with the barn door and that. The poor mans astrotrac or a eq 1 adding with a autoguider ( it's on the forum somewhere)

It just really frustrates me, as this is a fantastic hobby and with the thread mentioning Jupiter and a comet a few months ago still shows us amutors are still contributing to science, I don't want to put any one off and I don't think any one else does either

So I'd like to turn the discussion ver is there anything we can do?

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk so please ignore any spelling doodaaas I may make

[atmenterprises]

You're absolutely right. When I started in real AP, from stationary tripod and camera humble beginnings, I never realized the difficulty involved. There's a reason so few go into this hobby and stay - it takes perseverance and dedication. And cash. Having dropped at least $2,000 myself with nothing but a few Jupiter images, I think the average person may look at this as a point-and-shoot hobby when, in reality, it's very, very challenging.

I think the right thing is being done already on here, though. When someone has an EQ1 and a 1200mm dob and wants to do AP with that rig, folks around here are quick to point out that it's already a tough venture and, simply put, better equipment is needed to get results. There are some great exceptions to the rule on here, but I can't imagine trying to get good subs off subpar equipment. The new folks surely need to understand the following things:

1. It's a huge time investment if you want to get lots of subs from which to extract great photos.

2. It's a huge monetary investment. Stable mounts aren't cheap. And it only gets more expensive as you want bigger/better/faster.

3. It's a huge learning curve. Between accurate alignment to adjusting your exposures for the target to teasing the data out in processing, there are many learning paths to conquer.

4. It doesn't always work. How many nights do you stand outside for hours only to have nothing to show for your work?

[davesparx]

I've just started in AP as well. I started with a 200P on an EQ5 synscan and had a couple of lx modded webcams. I managed to get a couple of (what I was pleased with) decent webcam DSO images. They were terrible by most people's standards but what I saw on that laptop screen got me completely hooked....

I then had to buy........focal reducer for the webcam (that affected the inward focus and I couldn't get enough inward movement) so I then had to buy a low profile focusser. Then I needed a bahtinov mask to get good focus. Then a QHY5 guide camera and a finderscope...

That's now with a couple of images...I'm now quite a bit further down the road as far as expense is concerned, but.....

that laptop screen and what appeared......I suddenly saw the spiral arms of M51; something that I'd never have seen on my 200P, even in dark skies!

The list of 'stuff' is endless and I'm still only a third of the way through what I want to get.

Anyone else horribly addicted, too?

[swag72]

This is a tricky one to answer for a couple of reasons.

I do think that people need to be given a bit of a reality check when it comes to AP. As said, it is difficult, frustrating, expensive and time consuming to name but a couple of things. People see some of the images posted on here and think that these images are within their grasp, without ever realising the effort that goes into producing such images.

I do believe that if you want to achieve good images, you need the kit to do so. There are people who manage with less and advocate that you don't need all singing kit, but in all honesty, if you want to achieve good images, and I mean GOOD images, there is no way around it, you need to spend a lot of money. When I say alot of money I would budget for the complete kit, from the mount upwards, in excess of £3500 as an absolute minimum (Mount, scope, guiding, camera's filters, reducers and more).

The difficulty is that I have seen people on this forum be chastised for being negative to newcomers to AP when they say that this is the kit you need and this is how much it will cost. So with this in mind, I am always a little reticent to be totally and brutally honest for fear of putting people off. But on the other hand, without honesty and a bit of a relity check, people will not know what it entails.

A tricky one, to get the balance between encouragement and putting people off. I wish that people new to the hobby would take a look at the images produced on the imaging boards and say what they aspire to. If it is images produced by the likes of Olly and Peter Shah (to name but two excellent imagers - There are plenty more but I can't name you all) then surely we owe it to people to be honest about how you achieve that. It's not going to be with an EQ5 even (and there are plenty who recommend that for example).

Oh I could go on, but will stop now for fear of being looked upon as a Negative Nancy!! I think of myself more as a realistic having learnt through experience and still a long way from where I want to be.

[moogoomonkey]

When someone has an EQ1 and a 1200mm dob and wants to do AP with that rig,

My god! A 1200mm dob?? That's half the size of Hubble! If they have that sort of money then I'm sure they could afford a NEQ6?

[Welrod50]

I think it's good that people should know what to expect price wise and be reminded that they will not obtain 'Hubble like' images. I have spent rather a lot myself already and have a very modest kit, and I know full well what its limitations are. However, ambition is no bad thing and there are some folks posting in the welcome section this week, who may well develop the dedication, kit and wherewithall to use it and be posting superb images in 18 months time. So long as people are told honestly what it takes in time, effort and cash I cannot see a problem here, It isn't about putting folk off, its about helping folk and if there's one thing about this lounge I have come to realise since I joined, it is that it is a very very helpful and friendly place to hang about.

And yes, it is an addiction. There is always one more thing you absolutely cannot do without and the Mrs wont mind as it isn't really that expensive

You know where I'm coming from!!

Clear skies all......

[atmenterprises]

My god! A 1200mm dob?? That's half the size of Hubble! If they have that sort of money then I'm sure they could afford a NEQ6?

I meant 1200mm in focal length but you got me!!

[atmenterprises]

I...and if there's one thing about this lounge I have come to realise since I joined, it is that it is a very very helpful and friendly place to hang about.

You got that right. Plus I get to learn a bunch of new British terms, like "chuffed" and "the business".