Ships and Stars

23 minutes ago, Doc said:

When I used to own a 16" Lightbridge I often tried to find this group. It was right on the edge of what I could see in the lightbridge so if I was successful I knew it was a good night. I could split the group into three but it was tough and normally just a smudge until you spent a long time just staring at it and then on those fleeting seconds of good seeing you could split them, it was challenging to say the least.

Thank you Doc! Sounds like the 20" under excellent skies is the way to go, kind of what I was figuring with these faint galaxies. I may skip it tonight and just go for a quick binocular tour if the cloud breaks. 

Hopefully Stephen's Quintet pops back up late spring before summer hits. I'll check Stellarium. 

Welcome, we've had terrible weather up here, you're not the only one! Might be a few gaps in the cloud tonight, fingers crossed, an 8" Dob is perfect to nip outside with. Have fun!

Hello all,

I'm normally focused on nebulae this time of year, but somehow I've managed to forget all about Stephan's Quintet near the Deer Lick Group in Pegasus - I've never seen either group. This time of year it is dropping quickly at my latitude. It seems 18:30-19:45 or so is the best time when it's reasonably high up, but I think now will be it until next year. 

The weather here has been atrocious with almost non-stop rain and wind since the last full moon, not even a break in the clouds for binoculars, but tonight and tomorrow night might have small windows of clear skies.

Since this is looking hit or miss, I was going to try the 12" 'grab and go' dob under dark-ish skies (21.20-21.50) over the 20" dob, because I might not be setting up for very long. 

Has anyone had a good look and been able to resolve the galaxies in Stephan's Quintet? Or is it more of a faint smudge? I've read 200x is about right, but that's a fairly small exit pupil. 

Can you get a decent view with a 12" dob? Or is this one really difficult?

PS anyone have problems with Stellarium? Mine keeps freezing up and buttons come and go, then couldn't close it. Really weird. Might uninstall and reinstall.

Cheers all

I used Suncalc for desktop if I want to see accurate solar positions, the twin to the equally handy Mooncalc that I use for planning dark sky trips when the moon is far enough below the horizon for faint DSO chasing.

At my latitude, the sun only rises about 9.5 -9.8 deg above the horizon this time of year, with just under 7 hours of 'daylight', using the term very loosely, so if I actually want to see the sun, I have to climb a small hill south of our house around noon, or get in a boat and go about 2-3 miles offshore and look at the southern horizon. 

The sun won't directly shine on our house again until late January I think, and even then, it will only be for a few minutes.

In the summer on June 21st, the sun here only hits a maximum altitude around 56 degrees but never really drops far below the horizon.

35 minutes ago, PeterW said:

Never seen any of these for sale... given the rarity of those lenses it’s a pretty good deal. I find them more ergonomic than the others and I don’t need the focussing (yet).

Peter

Hi Peter, I've one eye slightly worse than the other, is there no dioptre adjustment or way to individually focus these? I suppose not, unless they sit in a threaded socket, etc.

I had some Kawai widebinos, interesting, but sold them. Replacements are tempting!

Excellent news - this covers a massive area -1350 sq mi. I'd love to see the whole of the Cairngorms up here follow suit. There is a dark sky park up on the NE side between Tomintoul and Glenlivet, but the whole of the Cairngorms should ideally be a reserve. That's a lot of doors to knock on though and a lot of people to convince. 

Well done to everyone involved in Yorkshire, bet it was a monumental task!

Sounds like a nice observing session actually. Simple is good. Nothing worse than setting up the big scope and doing an alignment, then watching a wall of cloud move in. Well, except perhaps driving 40 miles to do that, then immediately taking it back down! 

My 300p flextube is broadly similar, sets up quickly, doesn't have goto, didn't want it on that one. Telrad and raci and I'm off. 

The weather here is utterly dire. Something like 36 hours of off/on rain and flood alerts. Next week not looking good either, maybe a small window Wed night. 

Glad someone is getting out a bit!

1 minute ago, PeterW said:

Two “more bigger” amici prisms for the “homebrew right angle binocular project”... now to start finishing the different parts of it.

Peter

 

Ooooh... what are you building? Any hints or still top secret? Are you modding an existing pair to right angle, or building from two refractors? Sorry! Caught my attention 😆 If there was a reasonable way to replicate the EMS I'd love to see it. 

5 hours ago, CedricTheBrave said:

thanks everyone for the input

I have decided to go for a couple of the Morpheus ones to start and see how I get on with them

 

The Morpheus are really good, but my one reservation about them is the max focal length of 17.5mm which only gives you a 3.8mm exit pupil, not fully optimal for fainter nebula and galaxies. If you are mainly observing planets, then that's something else - higher mag is the order of the day of course.

I don't know how well your eyes dark adapt in your usual viewing spot due to ambient background light nearby, or what size they might dilate to (depends mainly on age but can vary widely), but in a nice f4.6 scope like yours, to get a 5mm exit pupil you'd want something around 23mm. If you have excellent dark adapted eyesight with a 7mm exit pupil, you could fully benefit from a 32mm eyepiece, while a 27 or 28mm eyepiece would give you a 6mm exit pupil. The 2" SW 28mm LER eyepiece is actually ok for the money and very comfortable to use.

The 20mm APM still gives a 4.34mm exit pupil and 100 deg FOV for 269EUR plus shipping, an awesome eyepiece for the money and a great all-rounder. It's a lot lighter than the 21mm Ethos as well (and about 1/4th the price) but not tiny by any stretch.

I checked the APM website, think they have stopped doing the discount on the 9/13/20mm XWA set. It's still a good deal in the grand scheme of things.

If I could only buy one eyepiece though, it would be the 20mm XWA. Not sure on shipping times though, don't think they are back in stock until Dec 18th. On the other hand, you could always fill in the gaps with a 25mm plossl for not a lot. I have a couple of dirt cheap Revelation plossls now at £12.50 a pop from Telescope House (I bought 25/32/40mm sets for my binoviewers) and on occasion, I'll use the 25 or 32mm plossl for small, faint stuff. They work surprisingly well in both my scopes.

Anyway, something to think about. Sorry to add to the indecision around eyepieces! 😉

Welcome! I had one of my best summers working in Portugal. I then stayed in the Algarve in Salema for a short while, visiting Sagres and Cabo San Vicente, great part of the world, very nice!

Sounds like a superb scope Cedric!

I've a 300p f4.9 dob and a 500p f3.95 dob, I had a couple of Ethos but sold them along the way and replaced them with 9/13/20mm APM XWAs 100 deg EPs which are pretty close to Ethos spec in my humble opinion.

APM Germany is selling a set of 3 on a good discount, but even on their own, I consider them an absolute bargain. If interested, I'd jump on that before we leave the EU come January 1.

I also use a 17.5 Morpheus which is excellent in fast scopes and gives plenty of eye relief.

So that's the 9/13/20 100deg APMs, a 17.5 Morpheus and lastly, a 10mm Baader Classic Ortho (BCO) for small galaxies, plus a 2x TV powermate. That's all I use, but I'd like a widefield 30mm EP for the slower dob and a widefield 24-25mm EP for max exit pupil in the fast dob.

Haven't used the Delos or Pentax XWs, but they both receive excellent reviews.

On a budget but still requiring high quality, I'd look at APM or Morpheus. The APM Ultra Flat Field EPs also seem to garner praise. 

Televue filters aren't cheap, but the Nebustar is just awesome! I use that and Astronomik filters. Insanely expensive for small pieces of glass, but they just work and have tight quality control.

Have fun!

PS I've had a couple of Hyperions as well, and as John says, they don't like fast scopes, so I'd avoid those but the Morpheus are fine. The XWAs are brilliant though!

I seem to get on well with fairly heavy binoculars handheld, partially I suppose because I did heaps of photography using a 500mm or 600mm tele lens handheld for about 10 years or so leading up to astronomy interests. Prior to that, I spent a lot of time target shooting from my early teens up to my late 20s, so I guess breathing control and holding somewhat heavy things as still as possible is a bit second nature at times.

I'm able to use my 15x70s Apollos handheld for short 5-10 minute sessions on/off throughout the night and I'm no bodybuilder or bricklayer. In fact, I've only used them on a tripod once for about 10 minutes, specifically when I was trying to bag the Horsehead in October (close, but no cigar) I think they're around 2.5 - 2.7kg. My 12x70 Celestrons weigh a mere 1.4kg and are a doddle in comparison. Same with my 20x60 Pentax WPs (also around 1.4kg)

I had 25x100 Skymasters at first on an AZ4 with an L-bracket. That worked quite well actually, wished I'd kept the AZ4. I've hoiked the 25x100s up to my eyes handheld on the odd occasion to look at something for 10-20 seconds, but that was borderline desperation, think I'd forgotten the L-bracket one night or something. Can't say it was relaxing!

One of the main benefits of handheld binocular viewing for me (up to 15-20x max) is the complete freedom to move around the night sky without a tripod or any restrictions. However, I will shamelessly take advantage of anything stable around me that I can use to relax a bit and steady the views. That includes leaning up against my van, or rest my elbows on the roof of my car if I've taken that out to a dark site. Walls, fence posts, picnic tables, etc, whatever is around. If I really want to hold still near zenith, I'll lay on a foam camping mat, that works well. 

Anytime I can view handheld, that's my preferred option for unrestricted movement, but magnification and aperture/weight seems to vary quite a bit from person to person. 👍

13 hours ago, shirva said:

Software wise you could look at backyard nikon and astrotoaster 

Thank you!

Wow, thank you @Mike JW A lot of information there. I've been sidetracked with my giant obsy binocular project, just got a fork mount for that. I dug out my Watec 902 camera this afternoon, haven't used it but thought I'd give it a go again if possible. Livestream is still in the works!

Wow, this is cool, nice project. I can't leave anything alone, am always modifying stuff. JB Weld is excellent if you need to epoxy anything on. You can even drill and tap it for threads. Extremely strong bond. I use it on just about everything.  

It will be the business with the carbon tube!

I think the samples they are after are to assay various areas in advance of possible mining operations (someday). The US was talking about the same thing but only theoretically as I recall. 

This is a hard one actually, because most every bit of kit I drag along is all key to a successful night's observing. Some of it is a 'frustration preventer', some of it is just a sheer necessity.  

My 'official' three:

1.) Sky & Telescope's Pocket Sky Atlas (Jumbo edition, spiral bound). The way they break down what to see vs time of year can be confusing at first. Nevertheless, it's a really handy field guide with lots of interesting objects and taught me my way around the night sky.

2.) Dimmable red LED torch from Antares, sold through RVO. While the build quality is definitely on the cheap side, it does the job and maintains that all-important dark adaptation while I'm fumbling around for eyepieces or flipping through the S&T Atlas. For what it is, it's a bit pricey at £20, though I guess it's a speciality item, so not a lot made/sold. 

3.) Telrad for the non-GOTO 300p. Point and shoot! Perfect for observers with short attention spans like myself, or for chasing holes in the cloud to make the most on those partly cloudy nights. I can buzz around the night sky to different areas with the 12" dob as fast as I can using my binoculars on a tripod. A real timesaver and frustration preventer.

2 hours ago, Stu said:

Lovely stuff. I very much enjoy vintage scopes too. I now have aTelevue Genesis, Vixen FL102S fluorite, a TAL 100r and the Telementor. Need to get more use out of the TAL to see how it performs. I suspect that one will find a new home in future but the other three will definitely stay.

I like Russian stuff as well - have a few old Zenit cameras going back to late 50s/early 60s. The TALs are well-regarded it seems, but I don't know much about them. I just picked up a TS Optics binocular fork mount which has a Vixen rail mount. It has an 8kg capacity, but I think it will hold more. My 7.2kg bins will stay put effortlessly at a 40-60deg altitude by only lightly tightening the altitude lock. Anyway, I was thinking it would also double up nicely as a great alt-az mount for a refractor. I like the wooden tripods as well though!

I'm out with the 300p and binoviewers tonight but the atmosphere is pretty wobbly - moon looks like a flag blowing in the wind and stars are a ball of mush. Might be heat coming off the house though, so will give it another crack now  👍

I was showing the moon photos above to my four year old, and she said was he on the moon when he took those? I said no, no and pointed to the photo of the telescope. She exclaimed 'whoa, that's a good one!'

I'd love to have a nice Telementor, I've a soft spot for vintage things that are functional. 

2 hours ago, Jiggy 67 said:

You have to wonder where the various apps/organizations get their data from. 
I use Scope Nights which I find to be the best and Clear Outside which, lately I have found to be the worst. Tonight Scope Nights has completely clear skies from 9pm as does the BBC whilst Clear Outside and Xasteria has 100% cloud!!....how can they be so different?!? I suppose we’ll see later who is right 

Scope Nights uses Met Office data - I've found Met Office to be the most reliable, with Ventusky cloud cover prediction my second port of call - Ventusky is helpful to see which way cloud is moving (can be the opposite of the wind direction on the ground) or where it's developing. I have noticed Met Office will sneakily change the forecast from clear to partly cloudy literally on the hour if it doesn't clear, but at least they are paying attention! 

Met Office does a cloud cover forecast, but the imagery is really low res and grainy, Ventusky shows much better. I'll have to compare the two. 

I think I spend more time looking at weather forecasts than through the telescope. No, actually, I'm sure I do!

I put in a lot of time looking at the weather and planning. I'm in NE Scotland, we are fortunate to be in a bit of a rain/cloud shadow as the West coast of Scotland and Cairngorms tend to catch and block a lot of the precipitation, but it's by no means 'dry' here!

I use three forecasts: Met Office, FLO Clear Outside and Ventusky, specifically their cloud cover/precipitation maps. You'll want to use Ventusky on a laptop or desktop PC, not a phone, it shows a LOT of information.

I then roughly average the three. If they are all in agreement for clear skies, I will consider making a road trip to my dark sky spot about an hour and a half away. If it's all clear on one weather site but marginal on others, I'll head to a spot closer to home.

As I view DSOs like nebulae and galaxies, the moon must be down or I'm wasting my time, sky is too bright. I'll use moonphase and mooncalc  to pick the upcoming window around the new moon. For example, in December I'm looking at the 8th through the 22nd, with longer viewing around either side of the new moon on Dec 14. 

So between some late hours and driving (up to 50-60 miles one way if we aren't in lockdown!) to clearer parts of NE Scotland, I usually manage to squeeze in at least one or two decent nights of DSO observing a month, anything over three and I'm feeling lucky.

Just to wind myself up, I have a location in Western Nevada on my saved locations on FLO, I'll look at it but it just always shows clear all day and night, year-round 🤣

8 hours ago, scarp15 said:

As last visited just before Lockdown 1, my 'out of Town' seated area.

 

Oooo, that looks good Iain, wide open views!

Very nice! I like widefield too more and more. Often too windy here even for observing, so I imagine imaging must be challenging. Good call on the 200mm lens!

My TS Optics fork-mount arrived for the giant obsy bins from Germany in under 48hr. I went for it now in case things get pricier after January. So much uncertainty. 

This is a much more refined set-up than my home-made fork mount and holds the 7.2kg bins near zenith effortlessly. So far. It seems well made though.

The max payload is 8kg I think, so I'm nearing the limit, but will report back if there are any issues in a binocular observing report soon.

I also picked up an 80mm Vixen rail to attach the bins to the mount, a dimmable low power red LED torch and a large sheet of red film from RVO as it was all in stock, quick shipping there too, thank you!

11 hours ago, PeterW said:

I was looking at this sort of  one if I ever went bigger. Be interesting to know offset of the pivot and bracket from the tripod connection. I was going to attach it to the top of my EQ6 tripod (can get a 3/8” adapter), but worried the tripod leg angles would cause the bins to be stopped from getting to the zenith and that I might need a tripod pier extension (I had one but sold it - wouldn’t be the first time I regret selling stuff). 

 

Peter

Hi Peter - the fork mount arrived yesterday from Germany in under 48hr! Amazing. It's quite nice overall for the price, this was by far the cheapest one at around £202 with exchange rate commission and DPD shipping, these things are a bit dear. The anodising/powdercoat is a little thin perhaps compared to the higher end fork mounts, APM etc, but they cost 2x to 4x more and I've not seen them in person. I'm using it for now on a trusty old Velbon Sherpa medium duty alloy tripod with a 1/4 to 3/8 camera thread adapter and an 80mm Vixen rail. There are no interference issues when viewing at zenith, but while it's stable, the balance point is set back a bit far for my liking, I'd prefer a larger tripod soon but my main viewing position with be sitting down on a very short stool so the tripod will only be 2/3 extended, about 1m high.

I think you might be able to get away without a pier on a SW steel tripod, but can't say for sure at the moment, I can take some measurements from the centre of my tripod once it's all set up.

I'm doing a minor repair on one of the tripod legs with some JB Weld, so waiting for the epoxy set before I mount it again this afternoon. 

Digital scale shows the fork weighs 3.43kg. It holds altitude with the 7.2kg bins very nicely and seems quite stable. So that's around 10.7kg for the bins and fork mount.

I'll post more when I've set it all up, work is pretty hectic at the moment but I might do some lunar this evening to test it out...