alan potts

Well I had a look at if the scope was pointing at Polaris and it was indeed a good way off, which was quickly put right. Even though I was able to centre the pole star east to west I was still a little off mark north to south which must indicate either PA isn't spot on or the telescope is not sitting parallel to the the polar axis, I tend to feel the latter is correct but in my view it was close enough.

Even doing this it slewed close to Saturn but still not in view of a 1.5x10 degree field of view, after moving the scope and sync setting on Saturn and another star a few times it behaved. But even though I synced to an object it still slew a good way off after to a star that was only 4-5 dergees away, something is not right here for sure. After messing around and instead used the Dialogue Setting in EQmod, then it set itself on on objects with good accuracy, even on a slew to M15 which was a fair way from where the scope pointed.

Another point for site friends helping me here, even when pointing is good after sync or other set-up methods and point s are saved, it it back to square one the next night. It doesn't remember anything even though sync points are loaded on Un-park. I do though have a feeling I had another box ticked in this EQ mod section beforehand when things were good.

Bit of a stinker this one I feel.

Alan

6 hours ago, symmetal said:

Hi Alan,

Following on from my previous post I installed APT and the ZWO drivers along with ASCOM itself (forgot about that )  on my Laptop with USB2 ports and it all performed with no problems. Without the 12V supply it took long exposures OK and with the 12V connected cooled it by 20 degrees using the default APT cooling aid settings, took a couple of 1 min exposures and warmed it back up. Also the Ascom camera selection didn't play up like it does on at least two of my other PCs.  Maybe I need to reinstall Ascom on them.

Although a USB2 socket should supply up to 0.5A this may not be true in all laptops where they have possibly skimped on the power. In order to confirm that the camera uses the 12V when it's connected and not the USB power, I'll have to cut open a USB2 cable and cut the power wire to insert an ammeter to measure it. I'm happy to do that as I have plenty of old USB2 cables lying around doing nothing.

See how your test goes when you try it indoors tomorrow.

Alan

Grant said power was and would not be a problem as I was using the correct transformer bought from FLO, in any case it would appear I have taken a set of Darks which Sharpcap stacked and this alone rules out power supply and cables. The laptop though older is a top quality Thinkpad made to professional standards not the normal machines that are bought in Techno Markets, the 3 of these came from a friend who is really expert at IT, he told me the build quality of these laptops is much better than shop bought, showing me the copper heat sinks inside on and around the processor. It was also only the camera that was connected to the laptop so it was supplying nothing else, I feel this is not the issue, it's more likely something I haven't done, or have done wrongly.

Alan

9 hours ago, Dragon_Astro said:

SharpCap can be used for long subs for deep sky work, because I do for subs lasting minutes, along with many other people. SharpCap can also be used to capture Fit file format as well as PNG.

The “offset” is the “black level” slider under the gain.

It can also capture your Light subs and apply your master Dark frame to it at the same time, it saves all your various darks in a folder. 

The latest version of SharpCap also does dithering linked with PhD2.

I am sure Sharpcap does work but I found it very difficult to understand after being use to PHD and APT which to me at least were straight forward, even though the latter in this case I couldn't get to work. The cooling was about the only thing that I clicked with, but appear to have taken some Darks which it seems to stack for you. So at least it ruled out the camera as the problem and cables too.

I just, maybe unfairly, didn't like Sharpcap.

Alan

Nice shot, can never see where the name comes from.

Alan

Just a bit of cloud here for the first day this month.

Alan

2 minutes ago, Anthonyexmouth said:

ok, the cooling problem is easily solved, set the cooling step to 0.0 and let the driver deal with the cooling NOT APT. 

 

I will bear that in mind Anthony,

Alan

13 minutes ago, Anthonyexmouth said:

ok, first thing to confirm is APT detecting the camera.

does it show the correct camera in the bottom right where mine shows up?

what happens when you try and start the cooling aid?

 

I will go over this tomorrow in the house with a scope, camera and laptop. When I tried this cooling it srated but stopped saying something like it could not reach temp, but I am not sure of the exact wording, it didn't work is all I know.

Kind of you to try for me, I will report back tomorrow on what happen, with my luck it will work in the house but not outside.

Alan

28 minutes ago, symmetal said:

Hi Alan, 

I just tried my 071 with APT and it worked with no problems. I also tried using a USB2 cable instead of USB3 and it still worked. When you first connect the camera you need to select CCD: ASCOM camera. The Zwo native drivers don't appear in the drop down box. When you click OK and the ASCOM camera chooser dialog appears. Choose ASI Camera 1 and then the 'Properties' button. Choose the ASI 071 camera (if you have more than one camera connected) and here you can select the gain/offset (choose unity gain from the drop down menu) and whether you want the anti-dew heater to be on. If you are in humid conditions it's worth having it on but for now can be left off. Then click OK and APT will say 'Camera Connected'. I tried a few long exposures with no problems.

There is a kind of bug in the Ascom camera selector screen. When the Ascom Camera chooser box appears select the camera fairly quickly and then the camera options and the OK. I've found that taking more than a couple of seconds to choose the camera it may crash requiring a restart of APT. Also if you click away from the camera selection window to another program or window before you've made the selection and options and clicked OK on the ASCOM dialog, it will almost certainly crash the program. This is not an APT problem as it happens the same if I use FireCapture for planetary imaging. It happens with other cameras and not just the 071. SGP which I normally use for imaging seems more tolerant of this ASCOM chooser dialog as it normally doesn't cause a problem. If it's the only camera connected after the first time of setting up it will automatically connect without the Ascom chooser box appearing.

Edit: As my USB2 cable is plugged into the PC USB3 socket it is able to supply 1A to the camera so wouldn't cause a power problem if the 12V power supply isn't used to power the camera as it says it does. I can install the drivers on my USB2 laptop and try the camera there with and without the 12V supply so see if there is any issue. I'll report back.

Here's a screen shot with the camera connected, cooled and then warmed and a 60s exposure taken. No errors

Alan

I will set up a camera and program tomorrow in the house and try this. I am fairly sure this is what I got.

16 minutes ago, Anthonyexmouth said:

I'm struggling to follow this thread.

I'm using ZWO cameras with APT.

Can you break down your main problems into a few bullet points to clarify your issues and I might see whats going wrong for you. 

Ascom Driver loaded for APT.

Selected Ascom camera in section.

APT tells me camera connected.

Will not cool the camera all connection fine.

Will not take a shot all connections OK .

The power thing I mentioned at the begining was when I first plug the camera in and turned the cooling on using sharpcap, it stopped the mount tracking dead. Sharpcap is not for me.

many thanks

Alan

It does support cooling, it is the only thing I have actually got to work. I have taken it off the telescope and re fitted my Canon, I have lovely sky and I am not wasting any more nights doing something I don't understand, I may even send it back. I agree Sharpcap is aimed at planetary but people keep pointing me that way I have taken it off the laptop too. If it doesn't work with APT then it's not for me. At the moment it doesn't, I have messaged the APT man himself. I am sure I will get there, people on here are kind and do really help, but like me sometimes they don't always read all that has been said and offer information that is way over my head, this is not difficult.

Alan

I asked a similar question and was put off the 183mc as the pixels were too small and this gave problems on some scopes. I am sure someone will give you a much better answer than I just have. I bought a 071 and I am not enjoying it at all, I am sure the camera produces fine result but in my hands I am not so sure it ever will. At the moment I am wishing I had got another mount and stuck with my Canon 40D, so easy to use.

35 minutes ago, symmetal said:

No I wasn't suggesting you to use USB3, just to use USB2 cables that are a good fit in the camera USB3 connector as a wobbly connector can cause problems. 

Alan

Yes all seems fine, however you have prompted me to look at the laptop, I know one of the Lenovo's has a couple of faulty USB ports, I have 3 the same I got in a job lot here. That said I feel it has made a stacked Darks file so I think it is working. What I am having serious problems with is not know what or when the camera is doing something. E.G, when you just turn on sharpcap the top of the screen basically tells you nothing is happening, but there is a line along the bottom counting frames and clocking up time in a bar shaped green line implying it is working on an exposure, no noise nothing, I hate it, have not even considered how you dither with it. Beginning to with I bought a new mount instead and stuck to the Canon 40D

16 minutes ago, symmetal said:

That length cable should be fine. Just be sure it's a firm connection in the camera and doesn't easily wobble about. A bonus with USB3 is that the cables are a more snug fit compared to USB2. That's the reason I swapped my USB2 cables for the Lindy Chromo cables (as FLO now stock). They look nice but the snug fit is the bonus. 

Alan

I don't have a USB 3 laptop, only 2 desktops with it. I don't really want to put one of those in the observatory, both have 16gb of ram and I use them for processing, the office model is sort of the wife's, wouldn't dare move that, I would have to move.

Alan

11 minutes ago, symmetal said:

Good. That's progress.  I was wondering, as you're using USB2 what length cable are you using, and do you have any USB extender cables in the connection to the camera. As the USB2 connection will be trying to work at its maximum speed, extenders or a cable over 5m can cause intermittant communication problems when working at high speed, which could lead to the type of problems you had initially.

Alan

I believe it is just a 1.5m cable maybe 2m but for sure no longer, that first issue with mount stopping is an odd one, I feel this is about power and earth connections, things here are not what they are in the Uk.

Alan

2 minutes ago, Adreneline said:

!!!!! - are you on the moon?  

Hope you get it sorted.

I don't disagree that plate solving will sort it - I've tried that too and it works - but I felt it ought to work without recourse to that method.

Good luck!

Adrian

I agree with you. A little while back when I was fighting PA and trying to understand how to get it better, I got PA down into 3-4 arc mins area and all of a sudden there is was, say jupiter on first slew. in-frame but not centre. Now when I do it is it miles out in some cases maybe 5-6 degrees or more as when I start I can see Jupiter easily. Once I have synced to it then it will point OK. But the distance between map position and actual scope postion on the EQmod little chart is  a fair old gap

10 minutes ago, alacant said:

I think that compared with an astronomical telescope, the lens would be flipped vertically, but judging by the angles an eq mount gets into over an hour or so, I think the angle humans interpret it as is constantly changing. Also, compared to our reflector image, it's flipped horizontally. Also, what about after a meridian flip?

I'm giving up!

I don't actually feel any of us care, I for sure never move the camera positions so the shots are at all angles as you say due to the EQ mount, at the moment though I am mainly shoot south so not so noticeable.

Alan

I have spots on mine and as far as I am concerned the scope and everything else is spotless, I have given up, good luck.

Alan

3 hours ago, Adreneline said:

Hi Alan,

I may well be way off the mark here (excuse the pun) but I have had very similar if not identical problems in the past which drove me nuts. Careful and methodical polar alignment using SharpCap, drift alignment and just a plain old eyeball approach failed to solve the problem.

One session I decided to make sure my imaging scope (ED80) was actually pointing in exactly the same direction as my polar scope and my guide scope (SW 9x50 sitting in tube rings on the top of the ED80), taking the polar scope as the reference. I positioned polaris smack in the middle of the polar scope and checked the guide scope and imaging scope only to discover that the imaging scope was no where near aligned to the polar scope - polaris was no where in sight.

To cut a long story short my NEQ6 saddle was twisting the vixen bar as I tightened it up; the twist was sufficient to throw the scope out of alignment. A new (GeOptik) saddle later and now all three are perfectly aligned and all is well. Slewing to a target always results in it being in view, albeit not necessarily smack in the middle but at least visible for the last manual nudge so that I can sync with CdC.

I then progressed to a parallel setup with both imaging scope/lens and guide scope mounted in tube rings. I now nearly always check that everything is aligned before I start - it might add five minutes to the setup process but in the long run it saves me time.

I hope this is not a red herring but it certainly solved my problem at the time.

Adrian

Food for thought there, I have only really had this issue for a short while, a month tops, I will look at it tonight as looking outside it will be clear, as the hasn't been a cloud in the sky for weeks. I will also be able to line up the finder I put on the other day.

Alan

3 hours ago, almcl said:

+1 for Adrian's comments!

If the main scope is not pointing exactly at the NCP on switch on, the first goto will likely be off.  

If you have a finder scope it may be worth seeing how close to the pole it is pointing before switching on power to the mount.

I have a diagram of how Polaris should appear in my 9 x 50 RACI (below).  If you have a similar finder, it may help?

If, after a successful couple of alignments, slewing to the other side of the meridian produces a large error, then cone error may be an issue, but that's probably a topic for another day?

I have the guide camera which is lined spot on the the main scope, and I have just placed a 9x50 SW finder on the 70mmED, this I have yet to align, but that id fairly simple. Trouble is I don't know how the two imaging scopes are in relation to one another, something to look at that I didn't think of, then thats no surprise.

Alan

2 hours ago, bottletopburly said:

Platesolving is your answer , I know it’s been spoken about before Alan it’s worth the leg work in the end 👍

All in good time, I'm still in junior school at this lark. 1st year too.

Alan

1 hour ago, steppenwolf said:

It is of course very important to know that not just the mount but the telescope too is pointing at the NCP at start up but I have to say that plate-solving does indeed resolve any issue like this. Even though I have a fixed observatory, a very accurate mount and my telescope attachment to the mount is spot on, I still do a plate-solve at the start of each session so that I know that the mount/telescope will slew accurately from the very beginning.

I may get round to Plate-solving when I get off Janet and John books, so difficult for me, this new 071 is a nightmare, just do not understand a single thing, largely software based issues, how the hell do you know if it's working. Begining to wish I had bought a better CEM 120 mount.

Alan.

30 minutes ago, Laurin Dave said:

Hi Alan

Are you putting EQMOD alignment points both sides of the Meridian?  Does it work well one side and not the other, if so then maybe you have a bit of cone error (scope not orthogonal to the mount axis). 

 

Dave

Dave,

I only really image on the rising side and them allow it carry on for about 30 mins max across the meridian, so I have no points that side I did about 3-4 months back but this problem seems to have raised its ugly head only in the last couple of weeks.

Alan. 

Orientation, mine are often upside down, nice shot.

Alan

I use C du C with Eqdir and in the past it has been pretty good at putting stars in screen, my field of view is a decent size about 1.5x 1.0 degree. Even when I sync it in with a few targets once it cross the meridian it tells me it is a long way out, moving the FOV marks by a fair distance.

Now first I thought Polar align, which once was bad but now according to many checks (10plus) with PHD2 Polar Drift is better than 2 minutes error, good enough for decent guiding even down at below 20 degrees from the horizon.

Last night after a scpe change I checked it again the same way with PHD2, and this time the FOV is 2x1.3 or so, as a reducer is fitted, PA was said to be 1arc minute after a 6 minute run about 2 degrees from the Pole, slewing to Saturn it could even get close, maybe 5 degrees out, in any case I was unable to find it, got angry and packed up, not enjoying astronomy the last 2 days.

Any ideas of the problem.

Alan

M13 always amazes me with my 18 inch, so what an extra 6 inches offers I can't imagine. I dare say it will open out some of the more tight and small Globulars like M70,75,80,30 and 15, all of which I have had the camera on recently