scope or bins that is the question

[starship trooper]

hi people,

After a break from astronomy of about 5/6 years and after seeing stargazing live my passion for spotting has been relighted.

I use to own a meade ext70at which i managed to veiw the moon and not much else and i never really managed to set it up properly so i never manage to see anything elso so i think thats why i ended up leaving the hobby.

But now i am back and i would love to start again and learn about the night sky,so here we go......

I live in milton keynes which has a lot of light pollution but i do have access to a site that has minimal light pollution and also go down to cornwall quite alot,the typr of things i would like to see are the moon,planets,nebula,double star and maybe some dso when i have learned more about the night sky (maybe one day do some imagine but not important now)

The scope i have been looking at are the skywatcher 150p/200p dob,skywatch explorer 130p but then i have been looking at bins which i know is the suggested way to start learning the sky but the by the time you paid for the bins and a tripod i feel you might as well get a scope and maybe more happier i just dont know but if people could please enlighten me into what they think and any advice you may have please let me know.

All help appreciated thanks dazz:headbang:

[Demonperformer]

The 200p is a nice scope, easily transportable, and will cover most of what you specify. Won't be able to use it for imaging as a dob, but can always mount the tube on an EQ mount for that (with tube rings and dovetail bar).

[oldfruit]

Hi, scopes and bins both have their advantages and limitations. Bins are great if you want to travel light, you can use them for things other than astronomy and they give great widefield views of the skies, but they do limit what you can see.

Scopes are good for observing most celestial objects, solar system, nebula, galaxies etc, but if you want to travel with it you need to make sure you don`t hav kit that is too bulky etc.

I suppose you need to ask yourself at what level do you want to re-enter the hobby. You were doing astronomy before so you may find that another scope would be the obvious next step. You can buy a scope that is easy to travel with if that is what you wanted. Plus if you have a car you could even lay your scope on the back seat and it should travel ok.

Enough of me waffling.:D

[Tac]

This was my predicament too. I had been looking at the 130P on the AZ GOTO for sometime and almost pressed the 'Buy' button but after some searching and joining here I decided to get the Revelation 15x70 (Homepage - Revelation 15x70 Binocular) With these you can see quite a lot of stuff. I have seen the Orion Nebula, Jupiter and her moons, Andromeda Galaxy etc. It also allows me to learn the sky where as the GOTO probably wouldn't, or not as well as least.

I hear what you say about the Tripod but a good Tripod will last you for years and can be used for other things too. At £50 for the bins, £80 for the Tripod and a Ballhead (not necessary but nicer) you get something that you can use for other purposes too if you wanted to.

I have now decided to save for the 200P on the HEQ5 PRO mount. It will be sometime before I have saved for this but in the meantime I have my bins which I am VERY pleased with. I am amazed at what you can actually see with them

[starship trooper]

i have been go to the 200p and the dob mount seem a quick and easy way to set up,would it be ok on ground like grass and the like or do you need to be on concrete?

as for the bins my mind says i should but my heart says i wont be happy because i would be seeing the detail i want to see,i do have and very old set of boots 10X50 bins that i need to see if they are still ok to use when i get clear skys can you mount any bins to a tripod if so what is a good budget tripod and mount to buy?

thanks again

[Tac]

I can't comment on the Dob as I have no experience with these but if you have some 10x50's and they are still ok then maybe the scope is the one to go for.

Although I have seen Dob's on grass and they seemed to be solid enough. I think you just need to try and choose somewhere that is fairly flat.

[xyz]

And with respect to grass, if it is damp (and it almost always is) I would advise to lay something waterproof down first (sheet of plastic, big door mat etc.) to reduce the moisture access to the base. It will suffer from too much dampness. I also think that you would soon churn up the grass into a mud patch with your feet. Oh and your chair legs will tend to sink in .....

[GazK]

thats a tough choice. I propose... both!

[starship trooper]

i see maybe a dob isnt the right choice because it might be the i am doing my observing in fields .what sort of scope would people suggest i am looking at a budget of £300-350 at a push and sweet talking the misses:o so less i spent the better.

As for my bins i dont think they have much eye relief and i do wear glasses so is that a problem?

anyway thanks for all the advive:headbang:

[JamesM]

I would always recommend a pair of binos anyway but if they are going to be your main observing tool, which will necessitate maybe a larger pair, then a tripod is mandatory. However, no matter what size, without the right mounting on the tripod, you will find it difficult viewing anything really high in the sky towards the zenith because most mounts don't tilt back far enough and is made more difficult if you are tall. Unless you have very poor eye sight, I would have thought that most binoculars can facilitate viewing without the need for you to wear your spectacles. Interestingly, Lidl sell from time to time cheap pairs of binos (£12-15) which have eyecups that are designed to used by those wearing glasses. The quality of these units is variable and please don't hesitate to take a dodgy pair back, but at home we must have about 4 or 5 pairs that are pretty good, all dotted around the house and so don't feel particularly precious about them should one be dropped on the floor.

Scope wise, the dobs offer better value for money in aperture and are more intuitive to use out of the box. Personally I would want at least some tracking facility (RA motor) especially at higher magnifications where you might want to get that little bit of extra focus, a bit more difficult if the object is moving across the eyepiece and you are also having to do the tracking. So a motor for tracking would be something that could be fitted to an equatorial mount at a later date (though more cheaply if attached from the start). However, a budget spread between a scope AND a mount will decrease the aperture and so the resolution (detail) that you will looking at. Difficult choice but only you know what your priorities are.

Clear skies

James

[starship trooper]

i think i am swinging towards a dob when i can get the money together,but i have been offer a meade jupiter ds2000 with autostar the scope is a refractor with a 70mm aperture and a 700mm fl and a focal ratio f10 i know it isnt that much of a scope is it but i was wondering if i would be able to use the tripod and mount for a different scope maybe.

But for £50 can i really turn it down?

What are your thoughts?

[JamesM]

Well, the F10 ratio which reflects the relationship in size between the objective lens at the front with the length of the scope. This notation also indicates the likely presence of what is called 'false colour', typically a violet halo that appears around very bright objects like the Moon and planets. This 'colour' for some people puts them off observing because it distorts the true image quality and possible detail of what you can see. Any scope that has an 'F' number above 7 or 8, will be a scope where this problem has optically been kept to a minimum - its always there a little but of no real significance. Remember, this is only on bright objects that this 'problem' occurs and doesn't apply to viewing faint objects like the M42 Orion nebula. One of my scopes is about this size and I think you will find it ok and for the money (including the mount) I think you have got yourself a bargain. The aperture won't reveal in any detail many deep sky objects but for the money it will certainly keep you busy whilst your saving up for your main scope.

Clear skies

James

[starship trooper]

i hear what your saying and i thought that f10 was a bit high but as you say it would be go to use and learn the sky while i save up for my dobsonian scope and also it will make sure i want to really do this.

Cheers for your thoughts and maybe there might be some way of using the mount for some other scope to?

[JamesM]

The f10 notation is an indication that this scope is proportionately longer than one with the same 70mm aperture but which is shorter, say an F6. The longer the tube, the more narrow the light path will be which allows more adjustment in finding focus and so there isn't a much work for the eyepiece to do (i.e you can get away using cheap ones). You will see plenty of scopes out there with proportionately shorter tubes which means the light has be brought to focus in a shorter amount of space. This means that when focusing on say a planet, you will see the image 'snap' into focus which is great but higher demands will be placed on an eyepiece to achieve that, hence you will need a more expensive eyepiece. This 'F' notation applies to not just refractors but also reflectors and cassegrain type scopes, some will be faster than others (some will be more demanding on eyepieces than others)

The mount I would imagine is fairly lightweight so if you were to put another scope on it, it would have to be relatively the same weight and size as the Ds2000. Any newtonian scope would be too heavy I would have thought. Certainly change your scope for another refractor but to be honest I would concentrate on saving your cash for that dobsonian!

Remember that 50 posts and 1 months active membership allows you access to the FOR SALE SECTION which at the moment is hidden from you until you meet the criteria. Dob scopes come up for sale fairly frequently so your 'proper' scope might not be as far away as you might imagine.

Clear skies

James

[starship trooper]

i received my scope today it has hardly been used and it brings back memories of when i had my ext70at.So the scope come with 2 ep a 9mm and a 25mm how do you think these will be and should i think of getting a few more different eps?

Also coz i will do abit of spoting in my back garden when this blumming cloud has gone would a light pollution filter be of any use?

Thanks again for all the help

Dazz