First telescope

[Imaginary]

Hello everyone!  

I have had a life long fascination of the night sky and space and I have been watching the night sky with my binoculars for the last couple of years and now I think it is time for me to upgrade to a proper telescope  

I have looked up information online, watched videos about various telescopes(and eyepieces) and attended a "introduction to telescopes" course but I still find it hard to choose the correct one for me.

I`m looking for a portable telescope for visual astronomy. I have read on forums that a dobsonian is a good choice for beginners, but I`m looking for something a bit more portable.

I live in a bortle class 7 area but I regularly travel to my home town wich is a bortle class 2 area, so im looking for something I can easily take with me and fit in my car.

 

What set-up would you choose for a budget of around 2000$ ?

 

Thanks in advance  

[Elp]

What you like to observe has a large bearing as to what will be best.

[ollypenrice]

Aperture is important in visual astronomy but inevitably comes at a cost in terms of portability. Bigger is - well - bigger!  Robustness is another aspect of real portability.

For many, the 4 inch refractor hits their target. This one is an old established favourite. https://www.firstlightoptics.com/ed-pro/skywatcher-evostar-100ed-ds-pro-outfit.html It has a longish focal length for its aperture so isn't going to give as wide a field as a faster 4 inch, but it is very well colour corrected as a result. Being a refractor it is robust and won't require collimation.

For visual observing, alt-az is nice and intuitive, does away with polar aligning and needs no counterweights. This would be one option. https://www.firstlightoptics.com/alt-azimuth-astronomy-mounts/astro-essentials-alt-azimuth-fork-mount.html

On a suitable tripod it would make a kind of budget replica of the Televue 4 inch used by Steve O'Meara to write his classic observing guide to the Messier objects. You'd be on budget for a couple of reasonable eyepieces, too.

( Eyepieces stimulate a kind of mania among astronomers, many of whom have twenty or so. I use two, almost exclusively. Better two good ones than four poorer ones, in my view.)

This is a setup you would pull out of the car, place on the ground and get started. A red dot finder would also be good and you'll need star charts but you could print selected regions from a digital planetarium.

Olly

[vlaiv]

I think we will need more information of what you consider light weight.

If I'm considering light weight setup - I'm with Olly - I'd get something in 4" class.

Maybe something shorter - like this scope:

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/stellamira-telescopes/stellamira-110mm-ed-f6-refractor-telescope.html

It will give you some residual chromatic aberration - but it will be good all around scope - showing you low and high magnification views well.

Then, I would suggest mounting it on a good mount with slow motion controls - my choice would be this:

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/alt-azimuth-astronomy-mounts/skywatcher-skytee-2-alt-azimuth-mount.html

Together with tripod, this combination weighs total of about 16Kg if I'm not mistaken. You also need about a meter and 20 in length of space to store it in your car.

6" Dob telescope weighs about the same at 16-17Kg, requires about the same length of space being 1200mm of focal length (So tube is approximately that long as well, only difference is that you need some more space for base / rocker box since it is more cumbersome then folded tripod.

I've transported my 8" F/6 dob in different size cars without problem, so dob telescopes fit in cars.

If you need something lighter weight than above - then you are looking at perhaps 80mm of aperture, but again, you won't save much on weight as mounts tend to be heavy for stability.

80mm F/7 ED doublet has only like 3Kg and mount that can handle it - say this one:

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/alt-azimuth-astronomy-mounts/sightron-japan-alt-azimuth-mount.html

Has only about 1.5Kg - so that is 4.5 total.

Now, depending on the tripod you decide to use - you can either end up with 5Kg steel tripod - which will bring total weight to ~10Kg, or you can perhaps get very good / stable carbon fiber tripod. That option can help save storage / transport room as such tripods tend to collapse to smaller size.

For example - this is only 2.5Kg:

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/tripods/stellalyra-carbon-fibre-tripod-with-38-thread.html

That brings total to 7Kg - ok, now that is really light weight setup.

[Cosmic Geoff]

Dobsonians come in all sizes.

Do you want GoTo (which you can afford on your budget) or not? 

[Bugdozer]

If you are more into planetary/lunar/other high magnification observing, and want the convenience of a good goto instrument, then the Celestron Nexstars are good. I have the 5SE and absolutely love it, partly because it's VERY portable which is important for me. You could get one of the larger aperture models on that budget.

They are Schmidt Cassegrains so have a long focal length, hence relatively high magnification, and the mount is not that great if you want to progress to photography, but for visual observing they make it very easy and are quick to set up, don't require constant fiddly collimation and enable you to find things in the sky with ease. I seem to get scoffed at a lot for this but the biggest barrier to me with my first two telescopes was literally being unable to find the objects I wanted to look at. Using a goto scope has eliminated that problem entirely and I spend twice as much time actually observing as opposed to hunting about.

However, if you want to observe fainter extended objects like galaxies and nebulae, they aren't the optimal choice and a Dobsonian would probably suit you better.

[ollypenrice]

For me a small telescope with a very long focal length misses out on what a small telescope can do and a big one can't, which is deliver a very wide FOV. That's why I'd prefer to avoid Maks and SCTs. I also think that, in Norway, you will also want something which does not attract dew. SCTs and Maks are bad for this.

I do like the look of this, mentioned above by Vlaiv. https://www.firstlightoptics.com/stellamira-telescopes/stellamira-110mm-ed-f6-refractor-telescope.html I didn't know about it.

Olly

 

[vlaiv]

2 minutes ago, ollypenrice said:

I do like the look of this, mentioned above by Vlaiv. https://www.firstlightoptics.com/stellamira-telescopes/stellamira-110mm-ed-f6-refractor-telescope.html I didn't know about it.

I also like the looks of that scope. I haven't used or seen one in person, but I think it is a good scope.

Sure, at F/6, being ED doublet - it will have some chromatic aberration, but as far as I can tell - it will be less than say 4" F/10 achromat. That second scope I've used and in fact I own one, and I can say - it is a lovely instrument and amount of CA is far less objectionable than I thought it will be.

Since I owned F/5 4" achromat at one point - I do have idea of how bad CA can actually be - and F/10 version really has little. Any ED scope with less CA than that is very capable instrument.

[Louis D]

I'd probably suggest you start out spending a fraction of the $2000 budget on a good starter scope that is still compact.  If you find you're not that into astronomy later, you can easily pass it along.

I would suggest either a Sky-Watcher Heritage 130 or 150, but mounted alt-az style on a photographic ballhead on a sturdy tripod:

Or on a Sky-Watcher AZ5 mount:

If you prefer a driven mount, they can also be had on a goto mount in the Virtuoso GTi 150P version which can be mounted on a photographic tripod:

[ollypenrice]

6 hours ago, Louis D said:

I'd probably suggest you start out spending a fraction of the $2000 budget on a good starter scope that is still compact.  If you find you're not that into astronomy later, you can easily pass it along.

I would suggest either a Sky-Watcher Heritage 130 or 150, but mounted alt-az style on a photographic ballhead on a sturdy tripod:

Or on a Sky-Watcher AZ5 mount:

If you prefer a driven mount, they can also be had on a goto mount in the Virtuoso GTi 150P version which can be mounted on a photographic tripod:

Yes, I understand this argument but the OP has wisely started out with binocular observing already.  The problem with starter scopes, which is common to starter products in other arenas, is that the buyer risks finding, 'Yes, I like this,' and will almost immediately want to take the next step. When they do, the starter setup will be obsolete for them.

On the other hand, many seasoned observers have a 4 inch (ish) refractor along with all sorts of other, more extravagent, instruments and they keep it because it remains a particularly useful tool.

Personally, I have given up on 'starter products' because I invariably find that they have a very short role in my activities. This may just be me, of course.

Olly

[Imaginary]

On 03/11/2023 at 10:04, Elp said:

What you like to observe has a large bearing as to what will be best.

Of course! I forgot  

 

I`m most interested in planetary observations and the Moon. And would also like to see some of the brighter galaxies.!  

[Imaginary]

On 03/11/2023 at 11:08, ollypenrice said:

Aperture is important in visual astronomy but inevitably comes at a cost in terms of portability. Bigger is - well - bigger!  Robustness is another aspect of real portability.

For many, the 4 inch refractor hits their target. This one is an old established favourite. https://www.firstlightoptics.com/ed-pro/skywatcher-evostar-100ed-ds-pro-outfit.html It has a longish focal length for its aperture so isn't going to give as wide a field as a faster 4 inch, but it is very well colour corrected as a result. Being a refractor it is robust and won't require collimation.

For visual observing, alt-az is nice and intuitive, does away with polar aligning and needs no counterweights. This would be one option. https://www.firstlightoptics.com/alt-azimuth-astronomy-mounts/astro-essentials-alt-azimuth-fork-mount.html

On a suitable tripod it would make a kind of budget replica of the Televue 4 inch used by Steve O'Meara to write his classic observing guide to the Messier objects. You'd be on budget for a couple of reasonable eyepieces, too.

( Eyepieces stimulate a kind of mania among astronomers, many of whom have twenty or so. I use two, almost exclusively. Better two good ones than four poorer ones, in my view.)

This is a setup you would pull out of the car, place on the ground and get started. A red dot finder would also be good and you'll need star charts but you could print selected regions from a digital planetarium.

Olly

Thanks alot for you reply (and everyone else who have replied to my question)!  

 

Yeah, I also saw a comment that refractors are good in areas where dew can be a problem( I live in Norway), so im leaning towards a refractor now!  

 

Do you got a reccomendation for a couple of decent eyepieces that would work well with the Evostar 100ed? I see that it comes with a 28mm occular. I`m mostly interested in watching the planets, the Moon and galaxies  

 

Again. Thanks!

 

[Imaginary]

On 03/11/2023 at 11:48, vlaiv said:

I think we will need more information of what you consider light weight.

If I'm considering light weight setup - I'm with Olly - I'd get something in 4" class.

Maybe something shorter - like this scope:

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/stellamira-telescopes/stellamira-110mm-ed-f6-refractor-telescope.html

It will give you some residual chromatic aberration - but it will be good all around scope - showing you low and high magnification views well.

Then, I would suggest mounting it on a good mount with slow motion controls - my choice would be this:

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/alt-azimuth-astronomy-mounts/skywatcher-skytee-2-alt-azimuth-mount.html

Together with tripod, this combination weighs total of about 16Kg if I'm not mistaken. You also need about a meter and 20 in length of space to store it in your car.

6" Dob telescope weighs about the same at 16-17Kg, requires about the same length of space being 1200mm of focal length (So tube is approximately that long as well, only difference is that you need some more space for base / rocker box since it is more cumbersome then folded tripod.

I've transported my 8" F/6 dob in different size cars without problem, so dob telescopes fit in cars.

If you need something lighter weight than above - then you are looking at perhaps 80mm of aperture, but again, you won't save much on weight as mounts tend to be heavy for stability.

80mm F/7 ED doublet has only like 3Kg and mount that can handle it - say this one:

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/alt-azimuth-astronomy-mounts/sightron-japan-alt-azimuth-mount.html

Has only about 1.5Kg - so that is 4.5 total.

Now, depending on the tripod you decide to use - you can either end up with 5Kg steel tripod - which will bring total weight to ~10Kg, or you can perhaps get very good / stable carbon fiber tripod. That option can help save storage / transport room as such tripods tend to collapse to smaller size.

For example - this is only 2.5Kg:

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/tripods/stellalyra-carbon-fibre-tripod-with-38-thread.html

That brings total to 7Kg - ok, now that is really light weight setup.

I`ve read Olly`s comment and I`m looking at the Evostar 100ED now  

 

The weight it self is not much of an issue (within reason of course), I am thinking more about the voulme of the kit when it is packed for travel. When im traveling my hometown during winter I usually have a a lot of skiing and mountaineering equipment with me, so i dont have all the space in the world in my car.  Thats on of the reasons I have looked at other options than a dobsonian  

 

Thanks alot for you reply! I really appreciate all the response I`ve gotten  

 

[Imaginary]

On 03/11/2023 at 12:33, Bugdozer said:

If you are more into planetary/lunar/other high magnification observing, and want the convenience of a good goto instrument, then the Celestron Nexstars are good. I have the 5SE and absolutely love it, partly because it's VERY portable which is important for me. You could get one of the larger aperture models on that budget.

They are Schmidt Cassegrains so have a long focal length, hence relatively high magnification, and the mount is not that great if you want to progress to photography, but for visual observing they make it very easy and are quick to set up, don't require constant fiddly collimation and enable you to find things in the sky with ease. I seem to get scoffed at a lot for this but the biggest barrier to me with my first two telescopes was literally being unable to find the objects I wanted to look at. Using a goto scope has eliminated that problem entirely and I spend twice as much time actually observing as opposed to hunting about.

However, if you want to observe fainter extended objects like galaxies and nebulae, they aren't the optimal choice and a Dobsonian would probably suit you better.

Thanks for you reply  

 

I saw a comment that Mak`s and the Schmidt Cassegrains can have some issues with dew. During mid winter I have temperatues pushing -35 celsius and very dry air. 

Do you have any experience in similar climate with your 5SE?

 

 

[bosun21]

Regarding refractors I heartily recommend the 4" Starfield. It's far better made than the 100ED and has better quality glass than the SL110. It has Japanese O Hara FPL53 and Lanthanum glass optics which is an excellent combination. I have seen no chromatic aberration at magnifications over 200x. It's also F7 which is a good focal length and could be used for astrophotography with the addition of an 0.8x reducer should you decide to take this path down the road. All in all it's my most used telescope. PS don't forget that with your conditions at home you will require dew heaters regardless of the telescope design. My refractor dews up in England on occasion, necessitating a dew heater to be used.  You could buy an AZ4 mount to mount it on which is also very capable. Good luck with your new endeavour.

Edited November 6, 2023 by bosun21

[Elp]

I second the Starfield. It's great.

For solar system particularly you can't beat the focal length of an SCT/mak and also Newtonian/dob but if you then want to view deep sky you'll find the focal length a little frustrating to use as the longer it is the harder it is to find targets comfortably (a lot of the time when using my C6 I'm surprised how much blank sky you can see due to the native focal length and resolving capability as well as my LP, don't get the issue with a shorter focal length refractor as stars are always visible due to the larger FOV), not so much of an issue with a goto mount but using one isn't as engaging as star hopping, its useful if you're time constrained but also take into account the initial alignment procedure. If you want less bulk it's difficult to beat a refractor setup which can fit into a bag you can sling onto your back.

[Cosmic Geoff]

3 hours ago, Imaginary said:

I saw a comment that Mak`s and the Schmidt Cassegrains can have some issues with dew. During mid winter I have temperatues pushing -35 celsius and very dry air. 

Do you have any experience in similar climate with your 5SE?

Mak's and SCTs have problems with dew if you don't use a dewshield.  The same problem occurs with a refractor, but the typical refractor has a dewshield built-in.  As I have pointed out elsewhere, a Mak or SCT should work fine with a dew-shield, and a dewshield should be seen as an essential accessory.   I have used my Mak and SCT satisfactorily for years, using a dew-shield.  In more extreme conditions one can also add a dew-heater kit (also used with refractors.) 

 

4 hours ago, Imaginary said:

Thats on of the reasons I have looked at other options than a dobsonian

You mean a big Dobsonian.  A small table-top Dob should fit in your car OK.  A big f10 refractor (+tripod & mount) might not fit well in your car either. 

[Bugdozer]

6 hours ago, Imaginary said:

Thanks for you reply  

 

I saw a comment that Mak`s and the Schmidt Cassegrains can have some issues with dew. During mid winter I have temperatues pushing -35 celsius and very dry air. 

Do you have any experience in similar climate with your 5SE?

 

 

You are correct, but I second what Cosmic Geoff said - a dewshield makes a big difference. I made my own very cheaply out of a rectangle of 4mm craft foam and some velcro and it works very well. Or as you are in a more severe climate, you might want an actual dew heater unit fitted. This will of course be more expensive but will help significantly. 

But being honest, without the shield, the scope sure does love to mist up sometimes. 

[Louis D]

7 hours ago, Imaginary said:

I saw a comment that Mak`s and the Schmidt Cassegrains can have some issues with dew. During mid winter I have temperatues pushing -35 celsius and very dry air. 

At those extreme temps, I would recommend against any mounts requiring battery power.  That, and the typical Chinese internal drive lubricants could solidify rendering the mount unusable.

@jetstream observes in a very cold part of Canada and could probably give his input on the subject of extreme cold.

[ollypenrice]

I've had 8, 10 and 14 inch SCTs and still have the latter two. They do need dewsheilds but they need them a lot more than a refractor needs them! Whatever you use to combat dew, on a dewy night an SCT will get shut down before a refractor. Long before - and I live in the south of France, not Norway. Camping mat makes brilliant dewsheild material, by the way.

Olly

[gorann]

I noticed that you live in Norway, like I do much of the time. On finn.no you can now and then find some fine telecopes at good prices. Right now there is this carbon fibre Stellarvue 90 mm APO svr90t triplet for sale at 16 000 NOK = 1150 GBP.

https://www.finn.no/bap/forsale/ad.html?finnkode=326603842

I do not know the seller and have never owned one of those but it looks like a very good deal to me for a top of the line telescope that you may never want to sell even if you later buy a bigger one. Maybe someone here knows more about that telescope model can comment on it.