ST102 finder dilemma

[Starslayer]

So I now have the ST102 with Crayford dual speed focuser upgrade, 2" williams diagonal, nice eps and a recent 9x50 raci finder which is now on thanks to the overlooked ( on my part ) need for a shoe on the new focuser. 

Clear skies last night, excellent. Let's have a quick look at Orion.  Now it is not exactly a small target but the trouble I had and HOW much did I miss the dodgy little plastic RDF that came as stock. !!!!!   I need to get the RDF back on for tonight but hold on, where do I fit it? There are no other areas to add it to the focuser or anywhere else for that matter.  OK I can remove the RACI and pop it in there but I want both on.

Any ideas would be greatly appreciated. The sudden loss of the ability to look straight through to get straight on a particular area of sky was a real pain last night.  Thanks all. 

[cloudsweeper]

I don't use a RACI on a widefield 'scope, finding that a decent RDF (Baader Skysurfer III) is sufficient.  But if you want both, I believe there are "splitters" available - you put it in the shoe, then the top branches into two so you can fit both items on together.  Others can probably give better detail!

Doug.

[Starslayer]

Sounds promising.

[Richard_B]

I have the same scope and focuser. I use a Rigel plus an Astro Essential 9x50 90 deg finder scope. The Rigel took some getting used to but is excellent and I would recommend one as the space it takes up in the scope tube is really small

[Starslayer]

13 minutes ago, Richard_B said:

I have the same scope and focuser. I use a Rigel plus an Astro Essential 9x50 90 deg finder scope. The Rigel took some getting used to but is excellent and I would recommend one as the space it takes up in the scope tube is really small

MMm. Another good idea. The double shoe thing may be a bit bulky and I am not sure if one side would interfere too much with ep area.  Not seen the Rigel in the flesh. I have a telrad on my sct which is big. Too big for the ST.  The rigel always looks a bit skyscraperish to me. I don't suppose you have a pic of it on your ST102 do you? 

Edited February 11, 2022 by Starslayer

[Zermelo]

I had a similar situation with the Bresser frac I bought - single shoe.
Actually, even that shoe was no good, as I wanted to use a Synta-style RACI that I already had.

A forum member pointed me in the direction of these, and I used one to replace the stock shoe (actually, I see FLO have some alternatives).
I liked it, and bought another - because, like you, I found I still wanted an RDF. I could have fitted a Telrad baseplate and used that, but I was worried about the weight.
I removed the focuser, drilled and tapped the tube and fitted the extra shoe:

 

      

 

I did investigate the gadgets that double (or even treble) the mounting points, but these cost quite a bit more than an extra shoe.

I know nothing about the ST102 and whether this is an option there.

 

[Carbon Brush]

A vote for the Rigel. I have a couple of them.
I have one on my MN78, along with a 50mm RACI. Though on this scope it only gets used when I lose mount datum for any reason.

They are not expensive and tiny when alongside a telrad😁
You can try one out by sticky pads on the scope to see how you get on.
If you are really unsure about location, elastic bands and masking tape work wonders🤣

I have also used the 2/3 shoe brackets. I don't think they are the right choice for a small scope (ST102).
Having said that. finders are very much a personal choice. There are no right/wrong answers.

[Starslayer]

3 minutes ago, Carbon Brush said:

A vote for the Rigel. I have a couple of them.
I have one on my MN78, along with a 50mm RACI. Though on this scope it only gets used when I lose mount datum for any reason.

They are not expensive and tiny when alongside a telrad😁
You can try one out by sticky pads on the scope to see how you get on.
If you are really unsure about location, elastic bands and masking tape work wonders🤣

I have also used the 2/3 shoe brackets. I don't think they are the right choice for a small scope (ST102).
Having said that. finders are very much a personal choice. There are no right/wrong answers.

Thanks. I think the Rigel may be good.  Does it just stick on like the telrad and does it come with these pads?

Edited February 11, 2022 by Starslayer

[cloudsweeper]

Rigel comes with pads, but on my Dob, it kept getting knocked off.  So I drilled a hole in the end of the tube, and screwed it on.  Very easy and effective!

Doug.

[Carbon Brush]

I would regard the pads (or masking tape) as a fastener while you have a play and see if you get on.
The ST102 is easy enough to take apart for drilling, once you have decided where to fit the finder.

[Cosmic Geoff]

I used the basic red dot fnder with my ST102 Startravel, but when it failed (as they do 😧) I bought a Baader Skysurfer IV.  I never saw the need for an optical finder.

[Richard_B]

On 11/02/2022 at 12:33, Starslayer said:

MMm. Another good idea. The double shoe thing may be a bit bulky and I am not sure if one side would interfere too much with ep area.  Not seen the Rigel in the flesh. I have a telrad on my sct which is big. Too big for the ST.  The rigel always looks a bit skyscraperish to me. I don't suppose you have a pic of it on your ST102 do you? 

 

[ScouseSpaceCadet]

On 11/02/2022 at 11:54, Starslayer said:

So I now have the ST102 with Crayford dual speed focuser upgrade, 2" williams diagonal, nice eps and a recent 9x50 raci finder which is now on thanks to the overlooked ( on my part ) need for a shoe on the new focuser. 

Clear skies last night, excellent. Let's have a quick look at Orion.  Now it is not exactly a small target but the trouble I had and HOW much did I miss the dodgy little plastic RDF that came as stock. !!!!!   I need to get the RDF back on for tonight but hold on, where do I fit it? There are no other areas to add it to the focuser or anywhere else for that matter.  OK I can remove the RACI and pop it in there but I want both on.

Any ideas would be greatly appreciated. The sudden loss of the ability to look straight through to get straight on a particular area of sky was a real pain last night.  Thanks all. 

A couple of years ago I had the same problem with a ST120. At the time a Russian fella was selling 3D printed double finder brackets on Ebay. Since then several others have started selling similar aluminium cast brackets . I can't vouch for the seller, that link is just an example.

FLO sell a bracket using a different config:

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/finders/astro-essentials-multi-finder-adapter-for-sky-watcher.html

[Starslayer]

30 minutes ago, Richard_B said:

 

Thank you

 

[Louis D]

On 14/02/2022 at 04:06, ScouseSpaceCadet said:

Since then several others have started selling similar aluminium cast brackets . I can't vouch for the seller, that link is just an example.

I have a couple of these triple mounts for different scopes.  They are quite robust and work very well.  You have to be careful about where you put the various finders in the three shoes or you won't be able to get your eye in the proper position or get them all to fit next to each other.  I put my RACI finder (the heaviest of the finders) as far over as possible to keep it more in line with the altitude axis so I get less backward tipping at high altitudes.  Next goes my QuikFinder on an adapter from ScopeStuff in the middle position.  Last goes my GLP sight because it ends up almost straight ahead of the eyepiece in the diagonal, which doesn't matter for it but would make using the QF in that position next to impossible without tipping the eyepiece out of the way.

[Starslayer]

58 minutes ago, Louis D said:

I have a couple of these triple mounts for different scopes.  They are quite robust and work very well.  You have to be careful about where you put the various finders in the three shoes or you won't be able to get your eye in the proper position or get them all to fit next to each other.  I put my RACI finder (the heaviest of the finders) as far over as possible to keep it more in line with the altitude axis so I get less backward tipping at high altitudes.  Next goes my QuikFinder on an adapter from ScopeStuff in the middle position.  Last goes my GLP sight because it ends up almost straight ahead of the eyepiece in the diagonal, which doesn't matter for it but would make using the QF in that position next to impossible without tipping the eyepiece out of the way.

Picture?  🤣  

I have actually decided that I do not need the 9 x 50 on the ST102 but I have upgraded the RDF to a Baader Skysurfer 111 and it is very good.  The 9x50 is now on my 6"sct with the addition of a Baader universal shoe and again works well although I have the Telrad on there too.  I think a rdf of some sort is essential ( for me at least ) as the start point. 

Edited February 15, 2022 by Starslayer

[Louis D]

48 minutes ago, Starslayer said:

Picture?  🤣  

I have actually decided that I do not need the 9 x 50 on the ST102 but I have upgraded the RDF to a Baader Skysurfer 111 and it is very good.  The 9x50 is now on my 6"sct with the addition of a Baader universal shoe and again works well although I have the Telrad on there too.  I think a rdf of some sort is essential ( for me at least ) as the start point. 

I'll try to remember to snap a pic the next time I have one of them set up.

[Louis D]

I had a spare moment today, so I setup my 90mm APO with the triple finder mount with a couple of combinations of nighttime and solar finders from different angles.

I had it backward in the above post about where I put the GLP and QuikFinder.  The GLP protrudes too far back to be in the top position and the QF sits up high enough to not have eyepiece interference.

The phone is for when I use SkEye to locate difficult objects.  I forgot to take a picture from underneath, so I'm including an earlier image of the bracket I made for it.

Notice how the 9x50mm RACI sits perfectly in line with the plane of the altitude axis for best balance.

I couldn't think of a useful third solar finder, so I left a finder shoe empty.

Edited March 1, 2022 by Louis D

[Starslayer]

12 hours ago, Louis D said:

I had a spare moment today, so I setup my 90mm APO with the triple finder mount with a couple of combinations of nighttime and solar finders from different angles.

I had it backward in the above post about where I put the GLP and QuikFinder.  The GLP protrudes too far back to be in the top position and the QF sits up high enough to not have eyepiece interference.

The phone is for when I use SkEye to locate difficult objects.  I forgot to take a picture from underneath, so I'm including an earlier image of the bracket I made for it.

Notice how the 9x50mm RACI sits perfectly in line with the plane of the altitude axis for best balance.

I couldn't think of a useful third solar finder, so I left a finder shoe empty.

Thank you for taking the time to post all this.