Heq5 pro tracking issues.

[SirSnackz]

Hello. I have a heq5 pro mount and I'm having some issues with tracking. I would have it polar aligned using a polemaster then fine tune it with sharpcap. I would do a 2 star alignment on Vega and Arcturus. (those are the only two bright stars I can make out and easily spot). Once that's done I would go and slew to an object. It's usually off by a quite a bit. Maybe star star alignment isn't good enough? Starting from Home position and all the info is correct when initializing the hc

Problem number two. The mount does not seem to be tracking at all. I have it set to sidereal in the hc and the auto guide speed at 1. (although I think those 2 don't correlate with each other?). The mount just doesn't seem to want to track at all

One thing I can think of is that I had a blown board and skywatcher sent me a new board. The board they sent me a newer revision board then the one originally in the mount. I don't know if this would effect it not tracking. Maybe the HC is not working right? I'm Running out of ideas, time and patience. Any ideas? 

[malc-c]

The newer boards are ARM based processors compared to the PIC based originals, but that shouldn't make a difference.  Are you using a guide camera, as you mentioned autoguiding?

Its been a long time since I used a handset, but if I recall you have to use the directional buttons to centre the alignment stars and then confirm so the handset learns the error and thus makes the gotos more precise.  Is that the case for your scope, or are the gotos still way off after alignment ?  Are the clutches secure or do they slip ?

Do you still have the old HEQ5 board ? - these are repairable - you need to have access to a PIC programmer and to be able to solder soic devices, but it's one option if you suspect the new board. - If the goto / tracking issue has only occurred since the fitting of the new board  then give the retailer a call and see if they have any suggestions.

[Seelive]

When you star aligned were Arcturus and Vega both on the same side of the meridian or was your target on the other side of the meridian?

When you get to "Begin Alignment? 1) YES  2) NO" on the HC, if you select 2 does the mount start to track or at least begin moving westwards?  (Something you can check in the daylight without having to wait for a clear night!)

[SirSnackz]

8 hours ago, malc-c said:

The newer boards are ARM based processors compared to the PIC based originals, but that shouldn't make a difference.  Are you using a guide camera, as you mentioned autoguiding?

Its been a long time since I used a handset, but if I recall you have to use the directional buttons to centre the alignment stars and then confirm so the handset learns the error and thus makes the gotos more precise.  Is that the case for your scope, or are the gotos still way off after alignment ?  Are the clutches secure or do they slip ?

Do you still have the old HEQ5 board ? - these are repairable - you need to have access to a PIC programmer and to be able to solder soic devices, but it's one option if you suspect the new board. - If the goto / tracking issue has only occurred since the fitting of the new board  then give the retailer a call and see if they have any suggestions.

I do have the old board but i do not have access or a programmer or able to solder soic devices (let alone trust myself to do it). As for it working with the old board i do not actually know because i was never able to actually get it fully setup before the board died. And no i am not auto guiding at all. 

For when i go and do my star alignment i do center the stars but because its not tracking at all by the time i enter and go to the next star its off and i have to slew it over to fix it, which is normal, but i'd assume with the position of the star not where it should be it messes up the database? if that makes sense i guess. 

4 hours ago, Seelive said:

When you star aligned were Arcturus and Vega both on the same side of the meridian or was your target on the other side of the meridian?

When you get to "Begin Alignment? 1) YES  2) NO" on the HC, if you select 2 does the mount start to track or at least begin moving westwards?  (Something you can check in the daylight without having to wait for a clear night!)

Where my setup is its kinda tricky because i dont have any sky viewage from the west to the south so i can really only see North to South.  When i hit Yes on begin alignment the mount does not seem to track or move at all. just sits still. 

[malc-c]

1 hour ago, SirSnackz said:

I do have the old board but i do not have access or a programmer or able to solder soic devices (let alone trust myself to do it). As for it working with the old board i do not actually know because i was never able to actually get it fully setup before the board died. And no i am not auto guiding at all. 

For when i go and do my star alignment i do center the stars but because its not tracking at all by the time i enter and go to the next star its off and i have to slew it over to fix it, which is normal, but i'd assume with the position of the star not where it should be it messes up the database? if that makes sense i guess. 

Where my setup is its kinda tricky because i dont have any sky viewage from the west to the south so i can really only see North to South.  When i hit Yes on begin alignment the mount does not seem to track or move at all. just sits still. 

So when you run through the alignment the mount fails to slew to the first target ? - can you hear the motors running or is it just quiet and still sat in the default home position ?

[SirSnackz]

10 hours ago, malc-c said:

So when you run through the alignment the mount fails to slew to the first target ? - can you hear the motors running or is it just quiet and still sat in the default home position ?

It does move to the first target. It's not on target but usually it's in the area. And I move and center the target manually. Slewing works. Just doesn't seem to track anything. And when its on and just sitting it seems quiet. when i manually slew or do a goto command it does move

Edited May 23, 2021 by SirSnackz

[Budgie1]

If you just want to check that it's tracking in sidereal then you can do this during the day and without the scope or counter weights attached.

1. Undo the 6 screws on the side panel and remove the panel so you can see the gears.
2. Power up the mount and go through the one star alignment routine, it doesn't matter where the mount is pointing, just let it slew and then accept the position.
3. Once the alignment routine is complete it should start tracking. With the side panel removed you should be able to hear the motor on the RA axis and see the RA motor gear moving. It moves really slowly, so watch it for a while.

If you don't want to remove the side panel then put a mark on the RA axis (pencil mark or a bit of tape) and go through 2 & 3 above but just leave it tracking for 5-10 minutes and see if the mark has moved.

[malc-c]

It's very hard to notice if a mount is running at siderial rate just by looing at it.  You could do as Martin has suggested, or attach a laser pointer to the tube, and mark the wall some feet away where the dot falls, and then see if the dot has moved an hour later.

What power source are you using to drive the mount ? - it needs to be 12v and capable of delivering 2 amps or more under load.

One other possible reason is that the mount is going into park after the initial slew ? - is the handset still displaying the instructions that form part of the alignment routine.

If you place the mount in the default home position, have a decent power supply connected, and power on the mount, are you able to set the speed to 9 and then use the directional buttons to manually slew the mount in all directions, or does the mount stop and fails to respond after the first movement?  - If the latter then I would suggest contacting either the retailer or SW USA for assistance as it could be some communication issue between your old handset and the new board.

[SirSnackz]

9 hours ago, Budgie1 said:

If you just want to check that it's tracking in sidereal then you can do this during the day and without the scope or counter weights attached.

1. Undo the 6 screws on the side panel and remove the panel so you can see the gears.
2. Power up the mount and go through the one star alignment routine, it doesn't matter where the mount is pointing, just let it slew and then accept the position.
3. Once the alignment routine is complete it should start tracking. With the side panel removed you should be able to hear the motor on the RA axis and see the RA motor gear moving. It moves really slowly, so watch it for a while.

If you don't want to remove the side panel then put a mark on the RA axis (pencil mark or a bit of tape) and go through 2 & 3 above but just leave it tracking for 5-10 minutes and see if the mark has moved.

So i removed the side panel revealing the gears did the startup routine and a 1 star alignment and started to track a random object. While looking closely it appears that the Dec is moving and the RA is not. I marked the gears on the RA axis and will watch it over the next few hours and see if it moves. But in the initial test by watching it doesn't appear to be moving. 

5 hours ago, malc-c said:

It's very hard to notice if a mount is running at siderial rate just by looing at it.  You could do as Martin has suggested, or attach a laser pointer to the tube, and mark the wall some feet away where the dot falls, and then see if the dot has moved an hour later.

What power source are you using to drive the mount ? - it needs to be 12v and capable of delivering 2 amps or more under load.

One other possible reason is that the mount is going into park after the initial slew ? - is the handset still displaying the instructions that form part of the alignment routine.

If you place the mount in the default home position, have a decent power supply connected, and power on the mount, are you able to set the speed to 9 and then use the directional buttons to manually slew the mount in all directions, or does the mount stop and fails to respond after the first movement?  - If the latter then I would suggest contacting either the retailer or SW USA for assistance as it could be some communication issue between your old handset and the new board.

As mentioned above i marked the gears and will be watching to see if they move. I am using a 12v 3amp AC wall plug i had laying around which happened to work. Maybe 3amps isnt enough to drive both gears at the same time? When i go to do a star alignment it slews to the spot it thinks it is. I hit enter and it says Alignment successful and brings me back to the main menu. Doesnt park itself into the home position or anything (should it?). I am able to set the speed to 9 and manually slew the mount in all directions with no failure

[malc-c]

2 minutes ago, SirSnackz said:

I am using a 12v 3amp AC wall plug i had laying around which happened to work. Maybe 3amps isnt enough to drive both gears at the same time? 

The mount requires DC not AC..... 

[Budgie1]

5 hours ago, SirSnackz said:

While looking closely it appears that the Dec is moving and the RA is not.

When you put the new board into the mount, are you sure you connected the motors to the correct posts on the board? It maybe worth checking in case the updated board has them in a different location.

[SirSnackz]

9 hours ago, malc-c said:

The mount requires DC not AC..... 

Well ac to DC wall mount is what I meant. I don't think the mount would even turn on with AC. 

 

3 hours ago, Budgie1 said:

When you put the new board into the mount, are you sure you connected the motors to the correct posts on the board? It maybe worth checking in case the updated board has them in a different location.

I'm pretty sure I connected everything correctly seeing as I'm able to use the hc and slew the mount through that in both RA and Dec. But I will double check

Edited May 24, 2021 by SirSnackz

[CraigT82]

11 hours ago, SirSnackz said:

I am using a 12v 3amp AC wall plug i had laying around which happened to work.

Do you have another power supply you can try? These mounts are well known for misbehaving if the power supply is insufficient.

[SirSnackz]

31 minutes ago, CraigT82 said:

Do you have another power supply you can try? These mounts are well known for misbehaving if the power supply is insufficient.

Alright. I dug up the orginal cable that came with the mount and hooked it up to a celestron power tank. Ima let it run and come back and see if it has moved

[Kev M]

6 hours ago, SirSnackz said:

 

"While looking closely it appears that the Dec is moving and the RA is not."

I'm pretty sure I connected everything correctly seeing as I'm able to use the hc and slew the mount through that in both RA and Dec. But I will double check

I would triple check this...are the Dec & RA reversed ?

[SirSnackz]

58 minutes ago, Kev M said:

I would triple check this...are the Dec & RA reversed ?

Alright so i went to double look and i think you were right. i believe when installing the board i nocked loose the  RA connector and so it wasnt fully seated. thats probably why it wasnt tracking. Now when i went to switch the ports around the connector came right off of the board. Is this something i can fix right? or would i need to get a new board again?

[M40]

Can I suggest, don't try to solder the connector to the board, solder four pieces of wire to the board and then solder the wires to the connector.

[SirSnackz]

2 minutes ago, M40 said:

Can I suggest, don't try to solder the connector to the board, solder four pieces of wire to the board and then solder the wires to the connector.

Thats actually a good idea i did not think of that. Probably safer and easier to do that then to solder the connector back on

[malc-c]

OMG - that's not good.   It would be an easy job to resolder the connector, but as you have already stated you are not confident of soldering then M40's suggestion of soldering four short wires to the connector and the board would be an ideal fix, just make sure you get some form of insulation around the connections and the connector so there is no risk of it shorting on the metal casing and shafts.  The alternative is send it back for repair / replacement.  This IMO is a design flaw as that connector has no physical means of being secured to the board other than relying on the solder joints.   The old connectors were through hole and had better physical strength.

At least you got to the bottom of the issue.

[Seelive]

3 hours ago, SirSnackz said:

Alright so i went to double look and i think you were right. i believe when installing the board i nocked loose the  RA connector and so it wasnt fully seated. thats probably why it wasnt tracking. Now when i went to switch the ports around the connector came right off of the board. Is this something i can fix right? or would i need to get a new board again?

Even with surface mount connectors it should take some significant force the 'pull-off' the connector and would likely result in damage to the PCB lands/tracks and also leave the connector pins bent so based on your photo it looks like a manufacturing issue (dry joints).  Personally I would be concerned about the viabilty of the other soldered joints so if you've not had the new PCB long maybe investigate if you can get a replacement before you embark on repair?

[malc-c]

45 minutes ago, Seelive said:

Even with surface mount connectors it should take some significant force the 'pull-off' the connector and would likely result in damage to the PCB lands/tracks and also leave the connector pins bent so based on your photo it looks like a manufacturing issue (dry joints).  Personally I would be concerned about the viabilty of the other soldered joints so if you've not had the new PCB long maybe investigate if you can get a replacement before you embark on repair?

Agreed,  looking at the image again, you would have expected some tracks to be ripped if the solder joints were properly made.

I would be more inclined to contact the supplier of the replacement board and send them the picture and ask for a replacement to be shipped ASAP as clearly there is an issue.  If you make your own repairs any warranty would become voided 

[Padraic M]

I'd agree - send it back. I think you can reasonably argue that all you did was fit the new board (which was an essential task with a replacement board!) and the socket didn't stand up to the job. Before you put a soldering iron anywhere near it I'd look for a replacement.

Fixing or replacing surface mount components is very fiddly work!

[SirSnackz]

Yeah, i first contacted Skywatcher USA, From where i got the board asking if we can replace it. if they make me pay for a new one im just gonna attempt to fix it seeing either  way I gotta buy a new one. if not ill get the new board and hopefully it works. I will update when that happens

[malc-c]

They shouldn't make you pay for a replacement as the one you purchased should be covered under warranty, even if the replacement was sent as a warranty replacement for the original board.  It's clearly a defective board with a dry joint (possibly caused through lead free solder)

[SirSnackz]

Alright. New problem. Got the new board in the mount and now the HC is saying "No connection to mount, Standalone mode" at this point im just gonna have to send the mount back to skywatcher and have them fix it. I tried different cables. not a different hc. not gonna pay to get another one. im out of time and just need it fixed. hopefully they can fix it and i can finally start imagining