Eyepiece / Barlow

[GiggaKubicca]

10 hours ago, DaveL59 said:

does it not screw onto the end of the camera nosepiece? or is that a non-standard thread?

I have no idea if it is standard or not. All I know is I cannot screw it into the bottom of my camera adapters nosepiece. Telescope House said this "Orion may have changed the design of the Barlow.  You always used to be able to thread the optical cell into filter threads of eyepieces and nosepieces of camera t-adapters (hence my suggestion).  It’s a pity you can’t do this with yours."

[DaveL59]

there's a big difference in using eyepiece projection as per your first post and doing afocal with the DSLR direct to the scope and no eyepiece, at least as far as I understand it. For one you may not have enough in-focus in the focuser to achieve focus with just the DSLR but assuming you do then you will need to work out how best to set the camera up to get an image you can work with to focus with. 

If you need to dim the image then a filter in the camera nosepiece adapter will help, they should screw into it as they do on a regular eyepiece, assuming they are all using standard thread, tho a moon filter may dim things a bit too far, can only try it and see what the effect is. At least with the glare reduced you improve your chances of being able to see something and so can try to get focus, if you see what I mean.

[DaveL59]

10 hours ago, GiggaKubicca said:

I have no idea if it is standard or not. All I know is I cannot screw it into the bottom of my camera adapters nosepiece. Telescope House said this "Orion may have changed the design of the Barlow.  You always used to be able to thread the optical cell into filter threads of eyepieces and nosepieces of camera t-adapters (hence my suggestion).  It’s a pity you can’t do this with yours."

More likely the camera nosepiece is a different thread I'd have thought?

Does the barlow lens screw into the other eyepieces directly? The orion shorty is often recommended as a good barlow, tho obviously the more expensive ones are likely better but then if they also don't fit the camera nosepiece you're still stuck in the same boat.

[GiggaKubicca]

3 minutes ago, DaveL59 said:

there's a big difference in using eyepiece projection as per your first post and doing afocal with the DSLR direct to the scope and no eyepiece, at least as far as I understand it. For one you may not have enough in-focus in the focuser to achieve focus with just the DSLR but assuming you do then you will need to work out how best to set the camera up to get an image you can work with to focus with. 

If you need to dim the image then a filter in the camera nosepiece adapter will help, they should screw into it as they do on a regular eyepiece, assuming they are all using standard thread, tho a moon filter may dim things a bit too far, can only try it and see what the effect is. At least with the glare reduced you improve your chances of being able to see something and so can try to get focus, if you see what I mean.

Yes. I just have a feeling I'm not going to get a focus with just the camera body. Others seem to suggest that I can't others say otherwise. Telescope House were telling me to use a barlow. I saw a video that I can't find now of an American talking about how he had troubles focusing the camera body with just the adapter. He mentioned how only using the nosepiece let him take pictures because of the lack of extra distance. However he also mentioned if I remember correctly how some cameras do better with a little extra distance.

[GiggaKubicca]

2 minutes ago, DaveL59 said:

More likely the camera nosepiece is a different thread I'd have thought?

Does the barlow lens screw into the other eyepieces directly? The orion shorty is often recommended as a good barlow, tho obviously the more expensive ones are likely better but then if they also don't fit the camera nosepiece you're still stuck in the same boat.

I was getting told elsewhere that the barlow I have is a bad one for image quality because it's a cheap single element.

I'll admit I haven't actually tried screwing it into an eyepiece. I'll test that in a minute when I go down to make some food. "Food at this time of night?" Haha, yes, probably won't be asleep for at least another five hours.

[DaveL59]

I take it the scope gives nice sharp focus with the eyepieces for visual, given you too pictures with the projection method. How much in-travel is left on the focuser at that point?

On the side of the camera might be a mark that shows where the sensor plane is which may give some idea of how much further in the focuser needs to move to achieve a result. I'm guessing here tho, not knowing your scope/focuser/camera.

I suppose that if you just add your barlow to the camera nosepiece you still can't achieve focus at any point in the range of travel?

Have you tried this in daylight on a distant land target which you may find a whole lot easier to see what's going on? Bear in mind though that the focuser won't need to travel in as far when doing this, so while you might get focus on land, aiming in the sky at night it still may not, but worth doing just to know that something might be possible.

Edited May 8, 2020 by DaveL59

[GiggaKubicca]

5 minutes ago, DaveL59 said:

I take it the scope gives nice sharp focus with the eyepieces for visual, given you too pictures with the projection method. How much in-travel is left on the focuser at that point?

Can't answer that. Didn't take note. I'll tell you tomorrow night if the sky allows me.

 

6 minutes ago, DaveL59 said:

On the side of the camera might be a mark that shows where the sensor plane is which may give some idea of how much further in the focuser needs to move to achieve a result.

I have taken notice. I learnt about this a couple hours ago.
Here's a video of a guy explaining it:

8 minutes ago, DaveL59 said:

I suppose that if you just add your barlow to the camera nosepiece you still can't achieve focus at any point in the range of travel?

No when I had just the barlow on I could get focus. From what I understand from watching several video is that because my telescope is a Newton I will have a harder time using the body without anything to focus.

 

10 minutes ago, DaveL59 said:

Have you tried this in daylight on a distant land target which you may find a whole lot easier to see what's going on?

I haven't. I still try. But for the reasons you explained unless it flags something I'm doing wrong I suspect it won't really show me anything, as in I won't actually learn anything because I have a feeling the results will be that I can't focus because of the camera body / Newton combo doesn't allow me to achieve a focus.

[GiggaKubicca]

Well breaking news just in. Local man manages to screw in barlow lens into eyepiece.

[miguel87]

Many  many people use a newtonian and DSLR combo without a barlow, without a nose piece, just a T-ring adaptor, this is how I get all my photos.

You dont need a moon filter either, this will just dim your image and you may lose detail. All cameras can focus a full bright moon without glare.

You are fiddling with too many things between the camera and the telescope which is more likely to cause glares, reflections etc etc.

Just DSLR-Tring-telescope:

 

[miguel87]

Attach the camera and telescope with no other filters, lenses, barlows etc. Then get the moon in the centre of the image and roll the focusser all the way in and all the way out.

If you find focus(I believe you will) then job done.

If you dont find focus then note which 'end' of the focus range is closer to in-focus.

If you need to go further out, then you can get an extension tube.

If you need to go further in, you must use a barlow lens or alter your focusser arrangement in some way.

 

It is hard to advise when the only images you have shared so far appear to be taken through an eyepiece, which is not how to get your best photos.

 

[Louis D]

5 hours ago, miguel87 said:

If you need to go further in, you must use a barlow lens or alter your focusser arrangement in some way.

I reach focus using a GSO coma corrector attached via a T-thread to M48 thread adapter.  It also flattens the field and corrects coma at the same time.

[miguel87]

8 minutes ago, Louis D said:

I reach focus using a GSO coma corrector attached via a T-thread to M48 thread adapter.  It also flattens the field and corrects coma at the same time.

That's great but it's not exactly 'complete beginner' information.

[GiggaKubicca]

11 hours ago, miguel87 said:

Many  many people use a newtonian and DSLR combo without a barlow, without a nose piece, just a T-ring adaptor, this is how I get all my photos.

You dont need a moon filter either, this will just dim your image and you may lose detail. All cameras can focus a full bright moon without glare.

You are fiddling with too many things between the camera and the telescope which is more likely to cause glares, reflections etc etc.

Just DSLR-Tring-telescope:

 

 

10 hours ago, miguel87 said:

Attach the camera and telescope with no other filters, lenses, barlows etc. Then get the moon in the centre of the image and roll the focusser all the way in and all the way out.

If you find focus(I believe you will) then job done.

If you dont find focus then note which 'end' of the focus range is closer to in-focus.

If you need to go further out, then you can get an extension tube.

If you need to go further in, you must use a barlow lens or alter your focusser arrangement in some way.

 

It is hard to advise when the only images you have shared so far appear to be taken through an eyepiece, which is not how to get your best photos.

 

How do I attach a camera body and just the T-ring to the telescope? I can't see how you'd do it without the body just dropping to the floor when you let go.

[miguel87]

6 minutes ago, GiggaKubicca said:

 

How do I attach a camera body and just the T-ring to the telescope? I can't see how you'd do it without the body just dropping to the floor when you let go.

Take the piece of the telescope that your 1.25 inch eyepieces go into, it should be attached to the scope with 2 finger screws just like an eyepiece.

Once you have this (1.25 inch eyepiece adapter) unscrew it's two component parts.

The flat part screws directly onto your T-ring on the opposite side to the camera.

I have attached a picture of the part that splits into 2.

[GiggaKubicca]

1 hour ago, miguel87 said:

Take the piece of the telescope that your 1.25 inch eyepieces go into, it should be attached to the scope with 2 finger screws just like an eyepiece.

Once you have this (1.25 inch eyepiece adapter) unscrew it's two component parts.

The flat part screws directly onto your T-ring on the opposite side to the camera.

I have attached a picture of the part that splits into 2.

Well mine looks nothing like that. I tried unscrewing it anyway. This is what mine looks like. Also pictures of my adapter for anyone who wants to see.

Adapter

[miguel87]

That first picture looks like it unscrews, there is a silver wear line. Then attach the lower half of it to your t ring.

Edited May 8, 2020 by miguel87

[GiggaKubicca]

Just now, miguel87 said:

That first picture looks like it in screws, there is a silver wear line. Then attach the lower half of it to your t ring.

 

4 minutes ago, GiggaKubicca said:

Take the piece of the telescope that your 1.25 inch eyepieces go into, it should be attached to the scope with 2 finger screws just like an eyepiece.

The very first picture is the part of the telescope that hold the eyepiece, like you told me. This doesn't have any threads on it to let me screw in my camera like you said "Once you have this (1.25 inch eyepiece adapter) unscrew it's two component parts. The flat part screws directly onto your T-ring on the opposite side to the camera."

The other pictures are of the adapter I bought. The first two pictures are of the nosepiece together and then unscrewed.

[miguel87]

Try twisting apart the first piece you showed me. I think it is made of two parts. Is your telescope the orion dobsonian?

[GiggaKubicca]

2 minutes ago, miguel87 said:

Try twisting apart the first piece you showed me. I think it is made of two parts. Is your telescope the orion dobsonian?

The first piece? You talking about the first picture? If so "I tried unscrewing it anyway." It's a onepiece part. It looks like it's fused together. I tried with all my might, it's not a two part piece.

[miguel87]

Ok. Do you not have little finger screws that hold your eyepiece in place when using the scope? The eyepiece holder looks unusual to me.

Edited May 8, 2020 by miguel87

[DaveL59]

a picture showing good detail of your focuser might help here I think?

Some the M42 thread is on the end of the focuser drawtube after removing the eyepiece holder, I've no idea on the orion's though, never having seen one IRL

[GiggaKubicca]

1 minute ago, miguel87 said:

Ok. Do you not have little finger screws that hold your eyepiece in place when using the scope? The eyepiece holder looks unusual to me.

Yes it does have one. I removed it because I was trying to unscrew the two sections. I didn't want the screw in it if I could unscrew it and tried using it with my camera.

[GiggaKubicca]

 

[miguel87]

Presuming you have tried the camera with only the nose piece adaptor in place and you still cant teach focus, I would personally get hold of a skywatcher or similar 2 inch to 1.25inch eyepiece holder and unscrew it like I do to use the t ring with. But I'm sure there are other solutions too, theres tons of adaptors available to turn your t ring adapter into a 2 inch eyepiece basically. Better than moving your mirror or cutting the tube IMO.

[miguel87]

There are adapters on ebay for less than a tenner.