First light - 22x85 binos

[Astronut]

I had a proper first light with my new Helios Quantum Apollo 22x85's tonight.

Bought from Steve(FLO) on Monday and sent direct from the suppliers to arrive the next day, Tuesday. Top service - thanks Steve

They were well packaged. However, when I removed the objective caps both lenses were heavily dewed - not sure if this is normal but it worried me. They were dry within half an hour of exposure to the air though with a few dew marks left behind.

I'd ordered a Manfrotto tripod and head the same day but these didn't arrive until yesterday (Friday). At around 10lbs in weight, these binos are next to impossible to use hand-held so this is the first real chance I've had to use them - a clear night the day after I get new gear, now that's a rarity :?

Individual eyepiece focusing takes some getting used to - I found the best method is to focus each barrel one at a time with the other barrel's objective covered and both eyes open. I can close my left eye (as I do at the telescope) with no problem but for some reason I end up squinting with my left eye if I try to close my right eye.

I'd picked up a method to check bino-collimation (barrel alignment) of focusing one barrel and defocusing the other. When using both eyes, the focused star in one barrel should be in the middle of the defocused star in the other barrel. Not sure what the tolerance is but the focused star in the right barrel was slightly off centre (to the right) of the defocused star in the left barrel. I swapped the focus (focused left, defocused right) and the result was the same - I would have expected the focused image in the right barrel to be off centre (to the left) of the defocused star but it was the same ie. slightly off centre (to the right). It could be my eyes - time will tell but it's niggling me a bit.

I went over to Mizar first to see if I could split it. A definite split at 14 arcsec. Then I tried Gamma Delphinus. I detected elongation but couldn't split it - this one's a 9 arcsec double and both stars are of similar magnitude. Then I tried Polaris - an 18 arcsec double but a big difference in magnitude between the pair (mag 2 & mag 9). I couldn't see the fainter star. I kept looking and tweaking the focus in each barrel but to no avail. I could see other 9th mag stars in the field though. Could it just have been a case of it being lost in the glare from Polaris or could it be the unconfirmed bino-miscollimation I mentioned above? I've heard of Polaris being split in a pair of 15x70's (which I found hard to believe) but I would have thought it was do-able with 22x85's :? This is niggling me also.

I tried to put this all to the back of my mind and start looking at a few familiar objects I've seen in the dob. I can't remember what order I looked at things (I was panning around all over ) so here's a few highlights:

M27 is much easier to find in a 3 degree field starhopping from Albireo (which was easily separated with distinct orange and pale blue colouring). It was a distinct elongated smudge against the town centre sky glow - no colouring visible though.

M57 - Ring Nebula visible as a distinct grey circular disc but I couldn't quite make out the centre hole at x22.

M37, M36 and M38. M36 and M38 are easily visible and M37 is a little fainter and more condensed shaped like an arrow head with a dark band cutting across the middle and a distinct reddish star towards the centre. M37 is one of my favourite open clusters in the dob as it fits the field of view of the Ethos with plenty of space around the edges perfectly. In the 3 degree binos it's obviously smaller and looking a little lost and crying out for more magnification. Looks nice enough in the binos though.

Slewed around to Pegasus in the SW dipping into the brightest part of the town centre skyglow - did a pan from Enif to the right and spotted M15 - easily visible as a round smudge and obviously a globular cluster. No chance of resolving any stars in it though but it was better than I expected. The outer edges had a hint of resolving but this could have been wishful thinking having seen it in the dob.

It's quite uncomfortable viewing near the zenith but I had a go anyway for M33 and there it was. This was a nice surprise as I find it quite tricky in the dob drom my backyard (even with the Pentax). The seeing and transparency seemed rather better than usual tonight though. I think the 3 degree field helped here and panning left and right confirmed I wasn't seeing things. It was definitely there as a distinct wide smudge with plenty of background around it. Bear in mind that my backyard was partly illiminated with the light coming through next door's extension blinds (as is the usual case until they've gone to bed) so my night vision wasn't as good as it could have been. Despite this, I didn't need averted vision to see M33 - pleased about that Maybe I should have got the dob out but this was a first light for the binos.

Feeling better and a bit over-confident I star hopped from Aries to Eta Piscium to see if I could spot the 'Phantom galaxy' M74. Not a chance (: This one's for darker skies. Still, it was worth a shot. I might have had better luck with the dob but the background sky would have been much brighter in the dob so maybe not.

Then I tried for the 'Crab' M1. Quite faint and small but definately visible.

The Pleiades was an obvious target and perfectly framed in 3 degrees. Couldn't see any nebulosity but I didn't expect to given the light pollution.

The binos are going to take some getting used to and I'm still not sure they're as good as they should be (see above) but using both eyes definately makes up in some way for the drop in aperture from the dob. Viewing close to Zenith is not easy (almost impossible actually) as I'm up against the tripod and the old neck takes punishment but non-inverted images makes star-hopping a bit easier.

When I came back in, I felt a little guilty that I hadn't got the dob out but my gloveless fingers were getting numb from cold so I decided against going back out with the dob.

I'll try and set some time aside and post some pictures of the binos tomorrow in the members' equipment gallery section.

Ian

[Doc]

Ian thats a great report.

The bino's seem to very well on DSO's you spotted alot.

Impressed you saw the M33 through them and as for the M74 can't even see that in my 16" dob.

But like you very suprised you cannot split Polaris surely this is within your bino's grasp.

Maybe you need a better night seeing, maybe polaris is just on the limit of seeing and not seeing.

[Azelfafage]

Enjoyed reading that Ian

I'm insanely jealous of you bagging M33 - but I'll get there one day even if I have to move house :laughing2:

I'd be interested to know how the bino's do on the Casseopia clusters.

Regards,

A

[Astronut]

Cassiopeia was too near zenith to get a look - I had a go but I was so close to the tripod I couldn't get up to the eyepieces. Maybe later.

The transparency must have been very good last night for me to bag M33.

It's still niggling me that I couldn't split Polaris especially given last night's better than usual conditions. I realise it'll be more difficult than in the dob but still... :? . I'm hoping the collimation isn't off or I'll have to exchange them.

I'll be taking them with me this week (back in the truck tomorrow) so hopefully I'll get another chance when I'm parked up for the night.

[Talitha]

Great report, it sounds like you had quite a night! Looking at the zenith with my 22x100s for more than a few minutes at a time was painful till I got a parallelogram. Getting away from the tripod is a big help, and I can even lay back on a lounge chair if I want to.

Btw, seeing as how you beat the "new purchase cloud-curse", you might want to run out and get a few lottery tickets real quick.

[Astronut]

Great report, it sounds like you had quite a night! Looking at the zenith with my 22x100s for more than a few minutes at a time was painful till I got a parallelogram. Getting away from the tripod is a big help, and I can even lay back on a lounge chair if I want to.

Btw, seeing as how you beat the "new purchase cloud-curse", you might want to run out and get a few lottery tickets real quick.

lol - it just might be worth a shot

[Astronut]

I'll post the piccies in the members' equipment seciton (as promised in the first post) next weekend when I've got more time and hopefully used the binos again in between now and then.

[Astro_Baby]

Good to see your getting on with them Ian - I can never really get on with binos myself. They always make me go a bit boss eyed and give me a headache.

[Starjumper]

Great report Ian.

John

[Astronut]

Good to see your getting on with them Ian - I can never really get on with binos myself. They always make me go a bit boss eyed and give me a headache.

They take some getting used to is all and you have to make sure they're adjusted correctly. Having said that, the only real adjustment you can do is the IPD (inter pupil distance) which can be trickier with higher mag binos and their smaller exit pupils. It's possible the ones you tried were out of collimation ie. barrel alignment. These can cause headaches after a while as your eyes force the images together and it doesn't take much misalignment to make this happen.

They can't be adjusted without the proper kit and know-how - I can collimate a reflector with the greatest of ease but binos with their lenses and prisms and multi-folded lightpaths!? (and that's for one barrel! ....and then they both have to be aligned to each other) - forget it

These 22x85's are built like a tank but I handle them with extreme care.

[Andrew*]

Very nice report. Sounds like you're going to get a lot of enjoymen tout of those.

Hope you get the collimation issue sorted.

Andrew

[Astronut]

piccies

[durr]

Ian , I have the Helios 10.5 x 70 HD and they are a superb binocular as you say well built and will last you a life time. I also have the Quantum 6 x20, x30 and x37 100mm right angled binoculars which came in the usual aluminium case and very well packed. They also come with the u tripod which makes for setting up real easy. Taking the binoculars downstairs one day I walked into the kitchen and suddenly the case left my hand, the handle had just come away from the case. Fearing the worst I set them up outside ready to be shocked by the collimation but was pleasantly surprised when I tested them they were bang on. So please when you handle the case put your hand under the box as well. I have now reinforced the Chinese case and it is now ok but the screws and plate that they used were way too weak for such a heavy binocular. The binoculars you have look superb and you could do better with a parallelogram similar to what Talitha was talking about, it makes observing far more pleasurable. The eye relief looks good for people who need to keep their glasses on and the filters really do work but you do need a pair so they can be expensive, bet thing is to try a few different filters out and see which work best for you. Best regards Steve.