Skyliner or revelation?

[JulianFR]

I read an otherwise positive review of the Revelation 300 in different forum, dated a couple of years ago, in encourage owner suggested the mirror's centre collimating ring was placed 2-3mm out.

Re the flex tube's focuser, I've replaced my 200's with a Lacerta (or semi-replaced it anyway). I guess I could recycle the Lacerta.

[rory]

So that's clear then, Skywatcher.................or Revelation!!!!!

Am guessing it would be cheaper to upgrade the focuser on the SW than it would be to change the Rev's mirror (although am guessing that would be slight overkill!) if as I progress it becomes an issue.

EP's will inevitably be upgraded in time so there's little to choose from there.

Primary mirror springs on Rev need to be changed according to some and am not massively keen on the idea of adjusting the secondary with a screwdriver (guaranteed I'd drop it straight onto the primary!)

I'm thinking I may just stick with the SW and depending on how my bank balance looks on Wednesday morn may stretch to the flextube because the more I look around my house the more I realise storage is a real issue! How many toys do 3 kids really need?????!!!!!

But then there's the Revelation............or the Meade....................Orion.........................SW..........!!!!!@@@@@

I need a drink!!!

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To add to the mix . There is a Orion sky quest 10" on astro buy&sell now at a good price . I think it's a go to or tracking version .

Sorry , more confusion for you. , :-)

[emadmoussa]

To add to the mix . There is a Orion sky quest 10" on astro buy&sell now at a good price . I think it's a go to or tracking version .

Sorry , more confusion for you. , :-)

The Orion Skyquest is a re-branded GSO/Revelation.

[emadmoussa]

So that's clear then, Skywatcher.................or Revelation!!!!!

Am guessing it would be cheaper to upgrade the focuser on the SW than it would be to change the Rev's mirror (although am guessing that would be slight overkill!) if as I progress it becomes an issue.

EP's will inevitably be upgraded in time so there's little to choose from there.

Primary mirror springs on Rev need to be changed according to some and am not massively keen on the idea of adjusting the secondary with a screwdriver (guaranteed I'd drop it straight onto the primary!)

I'm thinking I may just stick with the SW and depending on how my bank balance looks on Wednesday morn may stretch to the flextube because the more I look around my house the more I realise storage is a real issue! How many toys do 3 kids really need?????!!!!!

But then there's the Revelation............or the Meade....................Orion.........................SW..........!!!!!@@@@@

I need a drink!!!

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Why would you want to change the Revelation mirror?!!

[Dreadz]

Why would you want to change the Revelation mirror?!!

That was my slightly intoxicated brain reading too much into some of the reports of issues in the past with the optics. I would draw from your reaction that that would be more than slight overkill

Am just keen to get the best piece of kit for the cash I have available but with so many different options and seemingly so little to choose between them am finding it difficult to choose. Am hoping to make it to my local astro society star party in the botanical gardens of wales on Friday and with any luck there'll be a few scopes there I can try for myself to see which works best for me

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[emadmoussa]

OK. If you're going 10" get a Revelation. If you can manage the Revelation 12" solid tube, then again...Revelation. Otherwise, Skywatcher is your other option.

[Dreadz]

Ok. Given the availability of a 12" revelation for a little more than the 10" skywatcher am on the verge of committing to the rev unless someone has some insight into the skywatcher to change my mind for the millionth time ?????

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[emadmoussa]

Ok. Given the availability of a 12" revelation for a little more than the 10" skywatcher am on the verge of committing to the rev unless someone has some insight into the skywatcher to change my mind for the millionth time ?????

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Are you planning on observing away from home?

[Dreadz]

The majority of the time will be spent in my back garden but will no doubt at some point be looking to travel to darker skies.

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[emadmoussa]

I guess you're better off with the Revelation considering your needs and your budget.

It'll be ideal if you have a shed and just roll the scope in and out.

[Dreadz]

My shed is in need of replacement so wouldn't be good idea to store scope out there for now. Maybe when I get my payout I can get a new shed/obsy

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[AlexB67]

If you do go for the skywatcher flextube because of storage ( it was my main consideration since it is more portable in my car)  I would not worry too much about the focuser alone as an entire show stopper or some of those details.

IMHO it is a bit overstated sometimes, it works well enough. I have put 2 inch eyepieces in there without any hassle and notice no slop after applying a small mod, not that it has much slop to star with anyway.  Fine focus is all good and a nice luxury no doubt,  but when starting out in the hobby for visual use and standard eyepieces it is not as if the focuser doesn't work and you can't focus in the end of the day. 

Just like the stock eyepieces, you can pay a lot more and improve them, as for the focuser and always decide to do this at a later date.

Everything on these scopes works out of the box. In some areas some things will be a bit better on one make than another, It may not to the best how long term seasoned observers would like it to be.

I felt a bit more comfortable about buying an SW over the GSO. My gut told me at the end of the day that perhaps on average the likelihood of getting a poorer mirror out of a batch could perhaps be more likely on the GSO models, could just be in my head though   SW synta  mirrors, I have seldom heard any negative reports on mirrors. Of course there will always be some. Another scope builder used GSO as a supplier on a regular basis and he had problems with batches of them too I recall, don't recall how long ago nor the maker, it may all well be blast from the past. The fact that quite a few of these collective reports exist put me off a little bit on the revelation I must admit. That is not to say there are plenty users very pleased with them and the vast majority will be happy with either no doubt.

I look at the mirror of a scope as the CPU of  PC, it is the heart, it is the work horse, and the most important part of the scope, and it cost a large chunk of it and produces the views, for me that added a lot of weight in my consideration when I bought mine. That said, mirrors can be recoated, replaced, I considered the cost and hassle of  that too just in case it came to that.  a recoat is around a 80 - 100 pounds I recall, but you'd have to take it out, sending a mirror is also a hassle or getting one replaced,  something you'd probably not want starting out new. For me it was about a bit of risk minimisation too.   

In terms of long term cost you may also like to consider the f ratio, the 10 inch model GSO has in its favour in that it is f/5, it may not seem like much over f/4.7 but below f/5 the requirement on good eyepieces becomes quite stiff on the wallet.

So did I help ?

GSO revelation or SW,  have another drink 

[John]

A chap posted last year on another (US) forum who worked for one of the main bespoke mirror figuring companies in the USA. He gave some statistics out that I found quite interesting - a good proportion of the work of the company was re-figuring low cost mirrors for private customers and, of that, GSO manufactured mirrors outnumbered Synta ones by a large ratio, something like 8:1

I recall. That plus the past saga of not over-coating mirrors properly, never sorting the long known issue of poor springs on the primary cell are why I'm dubious about GSO scopes.

"Your Mileage May Vary" - I hope !

[GuillermoBarrancos]

What about the Orion SkyQuest XX line of Scopes? I am looking at for example the 12inch XX12g. It looks amazing and the base can be easily dissassembled/reassembled. Making it an extremely portable dob Scope for a 12inch'er.

It also comes With 2 decent EP's and has a dual speed focusser.

They seem to be better available here in Europe too now.  Telescope Service just added the GoTo Versions today.

[AlexB67]

AFAIK, the skyquest uses the exact same mirrors as SW from synta. The rest is just about different ways it which it is made and the extras. for example, the RDF is the default finder, a finder scope in the SW. The OTA is a bit heavier on the SW but the skyquest is made from a  bit thinner material and perhaps easier to dent. Not that should be a big deal, we don't buy scopes to dent them.

Other will provide more useful info no doubt that own the skyquest.  As far as I recall, like the SW they are well received in what they offer for the money generally.

SW do not do a solid tube DOB anymore in the 12 inch size, so if you want a solid tube the skyquest and revelation models do offer that.

[Dreadz]

John these are some of the issues that keep bugging me with the Revelation. Google keeps throwing up reports of pitting/uncoated mirrors, shoddy springs, flimsy primary mirror plate, collimation slipping easily but they're mostly on old threads and reviews but does kind of reinforce the "too good to be true at that price" thoughts in my head but several people on here have thrown their support behind the Revelation.

Can anyone on here categorically put these to bed please. I can live with replacing the springs but refinishing the mirror in a year or two doesn't appeal, nor does the need to collimate every time I setup my scope!

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[rory]

AFAIK, the skyquest uses the exact same mirrors as SW from synta. The rest is just about different ways it which it is made and the extras. for example, the RDF is the default finder, a finder scope in the SW. The OTA is a bit heavier on the SW but the skyquest is made from a  bit thinner material and perhaps easier to dent. Not that should be a big deal, we don't buy scopes to dent them.

Other will provide more useful info no doubt that own the skyquest.  As far as I recall, like the SW they are well received in what they offer for the money generally.

SW do not do a solid tube DOB anymore in the 12 inch size, so if you want a solid tube the skyquest and revelation models do offer that.

mmm, emad mentions orion skyquest using  the same mirrors as gso/revelation ? 

[AlexB67]

He may well be right and I am wrong, or is it possible they changed supplier at some point ? The internet is not always the most reliable beast, or perhaps the way my brain recorded it in memory had a bit of a misfire  

[AlexB67]

Form what I recall without researching , my internet is stalling badly at the moment, but the focal ratios match those of SW exactly for the 10 inch, for example the GSO in 10 inch is actually 250mm, the SW 254mm,  so they match imperial units exactly, a useful  hint perhaps. The Skyquests followed the same  f ratios I thought ... relying on memory now.

[Bart]

I can live with replacing the springs but refinishing the mirror in a year or two doesn't appeal, nor does the need to collimate every time I setup my scope!

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I have the 10" GSO for two years and the mirror hasn't gone yet, and it held Collimation very well even with the original springs, despite being wheeled around on a sack trolley

I'm happy with it anyway

Barry

Ps with Dobs of this size, you should collimate every time you use anyway. It only takes 1-2 minutes and off you pop

[GuillermoBarrancos]

Form what I recall without researching , my internet is stalling badly at the moment, but the focal ratios match those of SW exactly for the 10 inch, for example the GSO in 10 inch is actually 250mm, the SW 254mm,  so they match imperial units exactly, a useful  hint perhaps. The Skyquests followed the same  f ratios I thought ... relying on memory now.

You are right. The Mirror of the Orion SkyQuest XX12g is 305mm.

http://www.teleskop-express.de/shop/product_info.php/language/en/info/p6760_Orion-SkyQuest-XX12g-12--f-4-9-GoTo-Gitterrohr-Dobson-Teleskop.html

While the GSO Scopes follow an exact diameter of 300mm:

http://www.teleskop-express.de/shop/product_info.php/info/p1190_GSO-Dobson-980---12----300-1500mm-Teleskop---Deluxe-Version.html

[Stargazer_00]

I'd just add to this I have looked over a few Rev's and owned a large range of SW dobs and frac's and have never though of getting rid of my SWs and gettings Revs.

[Dreadz]

Confuuuuuuused!!! Theres some knowledgeable people on here telling me go revelation but google has put so many niggly little doubts in my mind! The rev is seemingly better spec'd but skyliner seems more consistently reliable ??

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[emadmoussa]

I don't understand this hive against the Revelation/GSO scopes. If you never had one, I don't think you can judge objectively. I had one and it was  excellent...never had any issues with it.

[GuillermoBarrancos]

Confuuuuuuused!!! Theres some knowledgeable people on here telling me go revelation but google has put so many niggly little doubts in my mind! The rev is seemingly better spec'd but skyliner seems more consistently reliable ??

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I have been looking at both Skyliner 300 flextube synscan and Orion SkyQuest XX12g. Not only is the Orion XX12g better specced with dualspeed focusser and better starter EPs, it also offers better portability, due to the base being easily dissassembled/reassembled. Which is not possible with the Skyliners, unless you go for either 14 or 16inch.

They are both currently offered for the exact same price here in Europe.

PS. And to put the discussion to rest. Orion has the exact same optics as Skywatcher. They are both made by Suzhou Synta.

Reference:

Orion Telescopes & Binoculars is an American retail company that sells telescopes, binoculars and accessories online and in-store for astronomy and birdwatching. It was founded in 1975 and has corporate offices in Watsonville, California with a retail store in Cupertino, California.^[1][2] A large proportion of its products are manufactured by the Chinese company Synta for the Orion brand name.^[