New Telescope for Christmas.... Advice and Help please, only seeing blobs of light!

[flyerdp]

Hi all,

I have been interested in Astronomy for a long time and when my 8 year old son expressed an interest in it I saw the perfect opportunity for us to do something together.

He asked Santa for a telescope this year.  I dug around online.  I wasnt going for a $600 set up for a kid and found the Celestron 127EQ Powerseeker telescope.  It came highly rates/reviewed at Amazon and it was a fair price to start out with.

Needless to say it didn't take long to see that well frankly... Celestron is the "Walmart" house brand of astronomy equipment.

Jupiter is HUGE in the night sky and we don't live in a big city and even going far out of town all I got was a white blob of light barely discernible as anything. Seeing its moons as specs was more exciting than the whitewashed ball of light that was jupiter.

I thought... how am I going to keep my kids interest if this looks so lousy to me?!  I talked to their support and on their advice I ordered their eyepiece set, another $150 in. 

My son said he wanted to take pictures from the telescope and I had bought their attachable camera mechanism.  What a joke that turned out to be.  Anything but the moon... forget about it.  I returned it and ordered the NexImage 5 (another $180).  First one came with bad pixels (but could be tested) and the replacement comes today.  While I had the original I shot a pic of Jupiter and used registax to build a composite photo.  Granted I am still new to this but again, a blob of white with ZERO details of any kind.  With the 13mm and 6mm lenses in the kits I could at least SEE the bands on Jupiter with the naked eye (sort of).  Sometimes I think its my imagination, sometimes I think that I really am seeing them the detail is THAT poor.

Oh yes I bought the tracking motor so I could align the scope and whatever we were looking at wouldn't dissapear by the time he got to the eyepeice as well as the cheshire eyepiece for collimation and watched videos online to collimate.  I am going to return the cheshire as I have ordered a laser unit instead.  I know many people believe in the cheshire but when Im out and its temperature adjusted and dark I want to make sure its aligned without loosing night vision.  The tracking motor is a joke too, it pops/jumps while running which is useless for tracking.  Support is supposed to get me a new one, we will see how that goes.

At this point I am a good $600 in to this hobby now and am no better than I was when I started.  No picture taking capability and blurry objects in the sky.

I can return everything but the scope (Santa doesnt take returns at our house) so while yes I have spent a good deal badmouthing Celstron is there a way this thing can be salvaged?  

I have been reading about the ED lenses several of you all recommend on here from ebay and if I return $400 worth of stuff I wouldn't have a problem re-investing it in something of value to make this better.

Thanks for listening to my rant and any/all advice would be welcome particular in the area of improving the scope or imaging.  I am in IT by trade so a computer based imager would probably be what I would like best.

[Langy]

Hi, I'm new to the hobby too. I have the Celestron Astromaster 130EQ which is a beginners scope too.

No if that image you have posted is what you are seeing in the Eye Piece then I suspect there is something not set up correctly. Even the budget EP you get with the budget scopes should produce something better than that. I can see Jupiter fine in mine as a small round defined circle and at times can see the atmosphere rings.

If you are trying to image through the EP rather than removing it and using an appropriate imaging device then that can cause a lot of issues too. It takes time, a lot of patience and I think sometimes luck to get a good image through the EP. I got one of the moon in my gallery like that, hand held a camera to the EP and also have Jupiter in there where I had to have the camera on a tripod through the EP.

Someone on here with their wealth of experience will soon tell you what is wrong, but buying lots of EP will not solve things if the basics are not setup correctly.

Oh and if like me being in IT you are looking to record images you may want to look at the web cam option. I'm new to it but lots of posts about and for a real budget cam the xBox webcam has been mentioned a few times.

[bingevader]

The Celestron 127EQ Powerseeker is very much a starter 'scope.

It's design means that it isn't collimated in the usual way and Celestron recommend returning it to them should the need arise.

It's not really designed for any form of astrophotography.

[Peter Drew]

Hello Flyer, welcome to this forum.

I think you have fallen for the same trap that most of us do when beginning, wanting to do everything at once. I would recommend taking a step back and instead of spending more money spend some more time getting used to the basics of using the telescope. Celestron make some fine telescopes in their overall range but some of the entry level ones are just that, they are not really up to much more than basic operation. Don't be disheartened, it all comes together eventually. 

[flyerdp]

Hi, I'm new to the hobby too. I have the Celestron Astromaster 130EQ which is a beginners scope too.

No if that image you have posted is what you are seeing in the Eye Piece then I suspect there is something not set up correctly. Even the budget EP you get with the budget scopes should produce something better than that. I can see Jupiter fine in mine as a small round defined circle and at times can see the atmosphere rings.

If you are trying to image through the EP rather than removing it and using an appropriate imaging device then that can cause a lot of issues too. It takes time, a lot of patience and I think sometimes luck to get a good image through the EP. I got one of the moon in my gallery like that, hand held a camera to the EP and also have Jupiter in there where I had to have the camera on a tripod through the EP.

Someone on here with their wealth of experience will soon tell you what is wrong, but buying lots of EP will not solve things if the basics are not setup correctly.

Oh and if like me being in IT you are looking to record images you may want to look at the web cam option. I'm new to it but lots of posts about and for a real budget cam the xBox webcam has been mentioned a few times.

The Celestron 127EQ Powerseeker is very much a starter 'scope.

It's design means that it isn't collimated in the usual way and Celestron recommend returning it to them should the need arise.

It's not really designed for any form of astrophotography.

Yeah, before I bought the NexImage 5 imager I made a point of asking the guy if I could use it with my scope and get some decent planetary shots.  His response was to make sure the place I bought the imager from had a good return policy......  Badoom boom.

[Langy]

Hello Flyer, welcome to this forum.

I think you have fallen for the same trap that most of us do when beginning, wanting to do everything at once. I would recommend taking a step back and instead of spending more money spend some more time getting used to the basics of using the telescope. Celestron make some fine telescopes in their overall range but some of the entry level ones are just that, they are not really up to much more than basic operation. Don't be disheartened, it all comes together eventually. 

Yes they may be entry level but they are more than the sort of thing you find in the toy shops as far as I am aware. He should at least be able to see Jupiter as a proper round with some detail at times along with the moons. The scope should also be able to record with a webcam to capture some images.

Peter, I'm new too but done a lot of research into the sky itself with hours of videos on YouTube and agree you need to learn to walk before you can run but you state that he can only do basic viewing which I'm sure with steady upgrades the scope should handle more, please correct me if I'm wrong. However you need to learn the basics and when you do buy upgrades you will see how much better the items are as to what you were originally supplied.

If you're willing to go out and spend several times the amount you paid for the scope straight away on upgrades then also in my mind you should have spent that on a better scope with these included to start with.

I knew I didn't have the RA motor drive and low spec EP on my scope, but willing to take time to upgrade those as the scope was in my budget and could be used for enjoyment straight away.

[cantab]

• Most Amazon reviews are uninformed. You'll be better off looking for reviews on astro sites and forums such as cloudynights, or in print publications.

Celestron put their name on some excellent equipment. They also put their name on some dubious stuff. The Powerseeker range unfortunately tends to be the latter. That said, not all is lost.

The Powerseeker 127 uses a design called the Bird-Jones, which tends to have issues at high magnifications. Planets therefore are not going to be the scope's strong point. But with 5 inch aperture, hopefully you'll have more luck on deep-sky objects. Try the Orion Nebula, and the cluster M35 in Gemini.

Remember also that focus is tricky at high magnifications. And that to reach focus you turn the knob in the direction that makes what you're looking at *smaller* - it took me a few minutes to figure that out the first time I looked at Jupiter in a scope!

Regarding astrophotography, the mount won't be up to taking deep-sky images, and the mentioned optical issues may make it poor at planetary imaging too. The Moon may indeed be about it. If you have a decent camera, try sticking it on a tripod and taking a 30 second exposure of the sky, no telescope involved, you should get some nice results that way.

Keep the Cheshire collimator. I believe Bird-Jones scopes cannot be collimated with a laser.

On a final note, I'd say Peter Drew is right, throwing more money at it isn't going to help. Astronomy is a hobby where learning and experience count for more than your equipment. You have a scope that may be flawed but should not be useless, you just need to learn what it is and isn't good at, and you have a nice set of eyepieces for it.

[baggywrinkle]

Set up in the day and try and focus on terrestial objects so that you can see if 1. you are getting focus and 2. there are no collimation errors.

Also try with the Nextimage 5 in the scope during the day and connect to a PC and see what you need to do the set up.

Do not use the high power ep's, start with the lower powers and work up.

Oh! And of course Welcome to SGL. Persist, you will get there.

[source]

Hi

If you are really not happy with it over the long term, another option could be potentially to try sell it, and get an Orion xt8 or xt8i dobsonian. With the xt8i you're looking at about $600. It doesn't come with automatic tracking sure, but its got the intelliscope to locate thousands of objects. Just a random idea ...

[source]

(Note sure how to edit a post) You can get the xt8 classic for about $350 or look into a xt6 as well... (soz ignore the xt8i comment, I misread your post initially, thought you said you were looking at about $600)

[source]

Last thing I wanted to add was if you can get everything back for $400 and reinvest, I would consider starting over with something like a dobsonian reflector 8". I think that will give you the kind of views you are looking for. If you can afford the xt8i with intellisense tracking that would give you the ability to locate 14000 objects in the sky easily. I wouldn't invest any more in the scope you have since its clearly not meeting your requirements. Granted for photography the xt8i doesn't have automatic tracking, so maybe think about the photography aspect. But most good quality, good view telescopes with automatic tracking are going to cost you way more. My other advise would be research about telescopes for now. Here's a good starting source. Hope it works out

https://www.astronomics.com/how-to-pick-a-telescope_t.aspx

https://www.astronomics.com/juggling-ps_t.aspx

https://www.astronomics.com/telescopes-faq_t.aspx

[flyerdp]

Thanks all for the comments.  At this point I have been able to determine the scope is defective and am returning it and getting a 130EQ.  Cheapest upgrade route for now. 

I had my son write a note to santas repair dept. asking for a solution and we 'mailed it' yesterday.

I plan on replacing it tomorrow afternoon after work while he is at his grandparents and he still thinks I am at work and coming from there to get him and we will arrive and "Poof" new scope.  Old one in the morning, new one in the evening.  I hope it works out alright.  My wife is not happy about it.

[ardbeg74]

• Most Amazon reviews are uninformed. You'll be better off looking for reviews on astro sites and forums such as cloudynights, or in print publications.

Your not kidding, I saw a scope get 5 stars because it got delivered quickly????

 I am going to return the cheshire as I have ordered a laser unit instead.  I know many people believe in the cheshire but when Im out and its temperature adjusted and dark I want to make sure its aligned without loosing night vision.  

Keep the cheshire. The cost is minimal. It will never need collimating ( did you check that the laser you bought can be collimated? ) and never run out of batteries. Can do a star test when you are and adjust accordingly. ( Probably want a barlow for that -- see below )

Return the next image and ra motor. Return the EP set ( unless you really love them - its almost like you were miss sold these as a solution to a faulty scope). 

This should claw back some cash and hopefully calm down your wife. 

I have heard that the rdf on the 130eq's is not all it could be, usually the suggestion is to fit a telrad or rigel quickfinder... so i can imagine the conversation with your wife where you have to explain why the new scope you bought has to have something else to make it work. So the previously clawed in cash can be used to sort that.

You will probably want to upgrade your EP's but dont buy a set, you only need a low power, medium and high power. With the addition of a 2x barlow then you will effectively double the number of eps you have. But dont need right away, spend some time getting used to your new scope then buy  good quality EP's ( but not the most expensive ).

Just my 2 cents. Its not been a great start for you but it will get better, there is an amazing universe out there just waiting for you and your son to discover!

But most importantly, make full use of SGL and ask away. I've yet (touch wood) to make a purchase that i regretted, and its all down to the guys and gals here.

Clear skies and best of luck

Mark

[Tommohawk]

It's a good story - hope it has a happy ending!!

[Teignstar]

Hiya

Looks like the issue here may be resolved.

I am new to astronomy and had a telescope given to me as a gift.

The sound advice I gleaned from the forum and its members, is 'take things slowly'!!

To learn the limitations of the scope and its EP's, understand how to view through 'your scope' and, importantly............have patience!!

I think the learning bit is important and this forum has many knowledgeable members, certainly spending money is something t do with care!! and of course knowledge.

Slowly I am getting there and making the most of experiences with my scope, as they come along.

Happy viewing

[nicks90]

as others have said - walk before you run.

I had a celestron 130eq and it is a good little scope! Start off with some pleasing and easy to see objects first. If you go straight out and try for the leo triplet, you'll probably struggle to find them and struggle to control the scope.

But if you start off with good easy targets like the plieades, orion nebula, jupiter, beehive cluster - all really big bright objects - then not only will you get your first "WOW" moments, you will more easily fathom out how to use your EQ mount, how to manage the focusing and also work out the 'foibles' of the red dot finder.

do set it up in daylight, do align the red dot finder with the scope at something in the distance in daylight, get used to focusing the scope on something in daylight, get used to what each eps aparent field of view looks like in daylight! Especially the latter, its really useful to know how much each ep with actually 'see' of the sky. focus on a tree a long way away. with the 10mm how much of the tree can you see, then without the scope see how much that part of the tree takes up, is it the size of your thumb at arms length, bigger, smaller? That will give you an indication of how accurate your scope needs pointing to find an object in the night sky.

guess what - use it in daylight first!!!!!

and above all, have fun!

[flyerdp]

as others have said - walk before you run.

I had a celestron 130eq and it is a good little scope! Start off with some pleasing and easy to see objects first. If you go straight out and try for the leo triplet, you'll probably struggle to find them and struggle to control the scope.

But if you start off with good easy targets like the plieades, orion nebula, jupiter, beehive cluster - all really big bright objects - then not only will you get your first "WOW" moments, you will more easily fathom out how to use your EQ mount, how to manage the focusing and also work out the 'foibles' of the red dot finder.

do set it up in daylight, do align the red dot finder with the scope at something in the distance in daylight, get used to focusing the scope on something in daylight, get used to what each eps aparent field of view looks like in daylight! Especially the latter, its really useful to know how much each ep with actually 'see' of the sky. focus on a tree a long way away. with the 10mm how much of the tree can you see, then without the scope see how much that part of the tree takes up, is it the size of your thumb at arms length, bigger, smaller? That will give you an indication of how accurate your scope needs pointing to find an object in the night sky.

guess what - use it in daylight first!!!!!

and above all, have fun!

Thanks for the advice.  I tried that to see tree lims etc.. with the messed up 127EQ and struggled.  I engaged support and while polite and tried to be helpful refused to even acknowledge the possibility something could be wrong with the scope no matter how many times I suggested it.  It wasn't until I went online and understood what I had bought and how it worked did I realize something was in fact a problem.