First 150P use on Sunday - Clear Skies?

[Tommohawk]

hi All

Am complete novice. Bought a Skywatcher 150p last weekend , and finally got a good night for viewing. A few interesting developments.

Firstly, I took care to get good north facing set-up, (no polar aligner) but found my RA's were all wrong. By the end of the evening I discored that the RA dial gives diferent readings on either side (!) and also its about 10 deg skewiff. Need to have a look at that.

Anyhow, got Jupiter + moons and very pleased with view. Used standard 10mmEP  + x2 Barlow.

Located M31, but the view was reallt pretty poor. Am confident had good focus. Also got M42, and similar result.

So, what I'm wondering is if the viewing just wasnt very good. Would be really useefull to know if anyone else more experienced had a look last night in my area, and what you think.

Another question. The moon wasnt up yet - but does it affect the viewing even when its below the horizon?

Cheers

Tom

[wookie1965]

M31 looks like a fuzzy i have never seen any detail from my house M42 is different that shows great nebulosity and the trapezium, the 10mm eyepiece is not that good that's why i bought the 8 MM BST Starguider from Sky's the Limit much better viewing The RA dials are pretty much useless on these scopes well is on mine they are too small i never use them i use a good map TLAO or Google Sky then Star hop. Try a couple more times, with the DSOs use the 25mm that is a decent eyepiece. 

[brantuk]

Yup - the setting circles on smaller mounts aren't accurate enough really - they'll get you generally where you need to be but you'll still have to refine the search using the ra/dec controls. More trouble than they're worth imho.

The seeing was okay last night but there was a fair bit of high level whispy cloud. M31 in the 150P will be a fuzzy patch but with a well defined oval shape and bright central core. But the atmosphere and LP affect the view significantly - the moon will have washed quite a lot of dso's out - including Andromeda galaxy. Better on a darker night with better transparency and view when the object is high in the sky avoiding the thicker atmosphere at the horizon. And of course dso's are always better from a very dark site.

You were lucky if you got good views of Jupiter with the barlowed 10mm supplied eyepiece - not often people report success with that particular supplied eyepiece. But at 150x magnification you should have seen clear banding easily - though if the moon wasn't yet up Jupiter would appear to "boil" cos it was at a lower elevation.

Better glass makes this scope sing, and you don't need to spend too much to upgrade it, £40 - £50 'ish per eyepiece will do the job. Join an astro soc and borrow some better eyepieces to try out at an observing session - most folks will lend one to try - you'll be pleasantly surprised.  Hth

[LouisJB]

I was looking last night (from Sussex). The seeing seemed poor (which would affect planets) and there was some thin clouds in some directions (East for me, towards M42) - M31 is a very big, gradual fade - you need good dark skies to see it all. On a good night you'll see it + M32 and M110 in the same view, you'll want the 25mm EP otherwise you'll likely just be seeing the bright core - maybe that's all you were seeing, in which case it's a pretty featureless ball. You can't really see much detail on M31 other than overall shape with a 6" tube I think, maybe with something larger you would. Some details, lanes & spirals start to appear more when you image it.

M42, you should be able to see wider nebulosity, but again dark skies will help, as would lower light pollution. 

I think if the Moon is below the horizon you can get some observing done, when it starts to make the sky bright in that area either look at it or something opposite in the sky. When it's full and high in the sky, the best thing is to have a good look at it as nothing else much will be visible!

[Tommohawk]

Thanks for replies. TBH I found the RA helpful cos it got me roughly in the right area, and I was keen to get RA correct so I could track properly. That said if latitude and North are set correctly, once you have object in view th RA must be correct I suppose, whatever it says on the dial.

The finder scope looked a bit cheap, so initially I worked without it. But having screwed it on I found it adjusted to align readily, and was easy to use and surprisingly stable and accurate.

When looking for the M's, I was using the 25mm. But M31 was just a ball - no shape at all. I viewed this pretty early, so wasnt low - about 50deg alt.  Maybe the better eyepiece counts for more with the fuzzies? Would be happy to spend a bit more on EP. ANyone have any tips for brands? Would a 2" help? Is it worth getting 2"  Barlow for planets too?. Bear in mind I may want to do photos - is 2" set up better for this?

Even to my untutored eye the 3x barlow was defintely rubbish - loads of chromatic abb. I see they make Barlows up to 5x. Would a decent 3x Barlow be helpful? 2"?

I was looking last night (from Sussex). The seeing seemed poor (which would affect planets) and there was some thin clouds in some directions (East for me, towards M42) - M31 is a very big, gradual fade - you need good dark skies to see it all. On a good night you'll see it + M32 and M110 in the same view, you'll want the 25mm EP otherwise you'll likely just be seeing the bright core - maybe that's all you were seeing, in which case it's a pretty featureless ball. You can't really see much detail on M31 other than overall shape with a 6" tube I think, maybe with something larger you would. Some details, lanes & spirals start to appear more when you image it.

M42, you should be able to see wider nebulosity, but again dark skies will help, as would lower light pollution. 

I think if the Moon is below the horizon you can get some observing done, when it starts to make the sky bright in that area either look at it or something opposite in the sky. When it's full and high in the sky, the best thing is to have a good look at it as nothing else much will be visible!

 Good to hear you found viewing iffy too. Maybe theres more to come. Oddly East was quite clear though inc. Jupiter. It was South and west that looked washed out for me. BTW, by the time I M42 cam over the tree line it was pretty much South East, same as Moon, so maybe that didnt help.

The point I was getting at with the Moon is this.....  does it only afect the  viewing when its actually above the horizon ie visible in the sky, or will it affect the viewing even before this?

There shouldnt be too much light pollution where I am -  5 miles north of Heathfield, so probably better than many, no?

Cheers, Tom

[Tommohawk]

Had a good night yesterday, Monday. Interesting  that Jupiter not quite so clear, but Orion nebula much more visible. I think the sky was defintiely better to the South than on Sunday. Maybe a little less moon as well. Andromeda still just a round faint fuzz - no sign of elliptical structure at all.

Also I meant to say, on Sunday when I first got M31 into view and nicely focussed a meteorite(?) shot pretty much through it.... well, about a gazillion miles in front of it I suppose. Would have been a great picture.

Would very much appreciate some help on my EP query. I'm happy to look at planets and do my best with DSO's like M42. Also, I'd like to have a bash at photography - probably DSLR body + EP projection. With that in mind, before I start considering a camera set up, and given that my existing EPs are probably not great (standard issue) I have some specific questions.

1. Would I do well to consider going to a 2" set up? I think this would give a wider view, but would the image clarity improve?

2. Similar question regarding 2" Barlow - would this be worthwhile?

3. Also I see Barlows avaliable up to 5X - probably not feasible, but would a 3X be a good idea? If so, again is 2" worthwhile? (They look scarce, so I guess not)

thanks

Tom

[wookie1965]

What budget have you got your scope is an F5 and do you wear glasses to take into consideration eye relief, saying all that the BST starguiders at £49 from Skys The Limit are very good i have 4 of them the 8 mm is brilliant for planets the Celestron x-cels get good reviews as well a good 32mm plossl would be good to locate the DSO's.

[acey]

M31 is now too low in the sky for the best views - it's better seen in late summer and autumn. A north-facing site may be convenient for aligning an EQ mount, but you want a south-facing site for the best views, since objects are at their highest when due south. If the EQ is giving you problems then just point it roughly north, release the clutches and find objects by star-hopping - or put the scope on an alt-az mount. The setting circles on small scopes are frankly useless, and a relic of former times when they were seen as the hallmark of an observatory instrument. M42 is the easiest fuzzy, visible even under light polluted conditions. But don't go for anything too low in the sky.

[Tommohawk]

Thanks for EP pointers - will look them out.

Spectacle wearer - have tried removing them, but have considerable astigmatism and this degrades the image without spex on.

What about the 2" question? Is there anything to be gained form this? I wondered if perhaps there would be no optical advantage, but maybe the camera body would be better supported? And maybe as a spec wearer I would getter field?

Question is though, can I do EP projection or use Barlow with 2" set-up?

M31 is now too low in the sky for the best views - it's better seen in late summer and autumn. A north-facing site may be convenient for aligning an EQ mount, but you want a south-facing site for the best views, since objects are at their highest when due south. If the EQ is giving you problems then just point it roughly north, release the clutches and find objects by star-hopping - or put the scope on an alt-az mount. The setting circles on small scopes are frankly useless, and a relic of former times when they were seen as the hallmark of an observatory instrument. M42 is the easiest fuzzy, visible even under light polluted conditions. But don't go for anything too low in the sky.

BTW, M31 is at ~60 deg alt at 7.30pm - isnt that reasonably high? M42 is much lower only about 32 degrees. Or am I way off??

Thanks for the tip about setting circles. Have got a bit more used to finding my way around without, and using finderscope which is very good.

Thanks

[wookie1965]

The 2 inch will give you more field of view e.g you could get and eyepiece with anything from 80-100 degrees and many people like these they are more expensive i have not used them so i cannot give you an informed view more than likely someone else will, but from what i have read the 2 inch is for DSO's i could be wrong, to get a larger low power eyepiece e.g 40mm, anything after 32mm in 1.25 will not give you any more field of view. I have found the BST's brilliant and im a spectacle wearer they have screw up eye relief and loads of it.

[acey]

BTW, M31 is at ~60 deg alt at 7.30pm - isnt that reasonably high? M42 is much lower only about 32 degrees. Or am I way off??

Thanks for the tip about setting circles. Have got a bit more used to finding my way around without, and using finderscope which is very good.

Thanks

OK, I didn't have my planisphere to hand to check. M31 has declination 41 deg so if your latitude is, say, 51 degrees then your southern horizon is at declination -39 deg and you can see m31 at a maximum of 80 degrees above horizon (when it is due south). M42 is declination -5 so rises to a maximum 34 degrees above horizon. So you're seeing M42 at its highest and M31 20 degrees below its highest, though you should still get a decent view.

[Tommohawk]

Acey, OK I see what you mean. Hoping I will at some point be able to get M31 a bit better. Maybe its time to clean the mirror!

Cheers

Tom