Modded EQ5 mount question..

[Quatermass]

I have an EQ5 considering buying the dual axis drive and modding it to have an ST4 port on it so I can guide with an LVI autoguider. The questions I have are..

Has any one done this and how did they get on? and also the dual axis motor kit for the EQ5 is not the same as the motors in the HEQ5 so is the difference anything to worry about..

Cheers..

[eid]

I've done it to my CG-5 and it's pretty straightforward. I'm not experienced with a soldering iron either.

The only problem I had was due to being sent the wrong adapter.

[Quatermass]

Thanks Eid I'm not to worried about doing the mod its just knowing that it will work OK when its done as I have never used the guider before, but got to the stage now where I cant carry on doing unguided imaging any more,need more exposure time to keep me happy.

[eid]

I haven't really had enough clear nights to test it properly yet. My mount is well overloaded too so any wind ruins it.

I expect someone else will give better info on that.

[malc-c]

Can't comment on the mod to the EQ5, but the motors between the EQ5 and HEQ5 are different, in that the HEQ5 have twice the number of microsteps per revolution, giving far better tracking accuracy than the EQ5.

Having said that, I've yet to try guiding using the EQ5 (I have the pro goto) so it may be academic in that the difference in the real world and if you set them up side by side and used the same OTA with the same camera on the same target, the end results when guided may not be any different. Or that any difference would only be obvious to the expert eye ?

[Quatermass]

Yep, been very windy here in Suffolk as well, sigh wind rain and clouds good old British weather.

[Quatermass]

Can't comment on the mod to the EQ5, but the motors between the EQ5 and HEQ5 are different, in that the HEQ5 have twice the number of microsteps per revolution, giving far better tracking accuracy than the EQ5.

Having said that, I've yet to try guiding using the EQ5 (I have the pro goto) so it may be academic in that the difference in the real world and if you set them up side by side and used the same OTA with the same camera on the same target, the end results when guided may not be any different. Or that any difference would only be obvious to the expert eye ?

Thats the thing you see, if I get the dual axis motors kit and mod it will it be worse then if I sold the eq5 mount and got the HEQ5 instead if not then I will go for the modded dual axis kit instead..

[malc-c]

Dual axis motor upgrade cost around £95. Full goto upgrade £300.

Goto advantages include faster slewing rate, goto (obviously), ST4 port with various guide rates. - Disadvantage is the cost

Dual axis advantage - cheaper - Disadvantages are that it requires modification and thus invalidates the warranty and doesn't have the guide rates that the goto has.

IMO - upgrade to the HEQ5 - £745

Advantages - better load capacity, better motors, still portable (depending on your size and strength).

Disadvantages - cost, also makes the EQ5 redundant unless you have plans to purchase another OTA (more money ), or sell the EQ5 to recover some of the investment.

[Chris]

Hi Quatermass, I'm in a similar situation only getting pinpoint stars with 15-20 second subs with my RA driven EQ5 (still trying to get better), also lots of periodic error throwing out about 30-40 percent of my images prior to stacking. I would be interested to know what kind of subs your managing at the moment prior to upgrade? I know the stepper motors on HEQ5 are twice as accurate as the EQ5 Pro, and the EQ5 pro motors are decent compared to the basic RA drives. I too would be interested to know if its worth while trying to guide a basic EQ5 with the basic motors and no PEC? I might end up just biting the bullet and taking lots of stuff down cash comverters so I can get an HEQ5 syntrek, or the cheaper option of the 290 pound upgrade to a pro mount which would have better stepper motors, PEC, and a guide port

[Quatermass]

Thank malc great set up you have there one day I will get my self set up the same sigh..

[Quatermass]

Hi Chris,

At the moment the most I have been able to get out of my set up with just a good polar alignment and using the RA was a full 3 minutes! I was amazed at that, but since then have not been able to repeat it again. Best I can get now is about one minute and 25 seconds but the wind has been a right old pain.

I was thinking of getting 3 old fence panels for a make shift shelter around me! I Dont like wasting money so if the EQ5 with the dual axis motors and a modded on ST4 port will do the job. That will only cost me another 90 odd quid but moving over to the HEQ5 will cost me nearly 500 quid a big price jump, too big for me right now. There must be some one out there guiding with the EQ5 and the dual axis motor kit?

[stan26]

The HEQ5 will obviously make a better imaging platform and future proof you for later upgrades, But you will need to fork out £500 plus. Dual axis drive motor kit for your EQ5 approx £90, sell you current RA drive kit and you could be doing some long exposure guided imaging for as little as £50 outlay! thats the way I see it. I bet the comparing results from a 5min guided sub from both a properly balanced set up EQ5 and an HEQ5 would be quite surprising for people who consider the HEQ5 the minimum for AP.

[Quatermass]

Yes I reckon your right there Stan, Sky watcher wont sell me one extra motor and a pad, they say I have to buy the whole kit which is annoying but thats business I guess. Given what I can do with my current set up its got to be better with a guided set up. Think I am going to have to consider selling our caravan

[Quatermass]

Hi Malcom like your fishing section on your website by the way nice **** you had a man of many talents I see!

[Quatermass]

Lol why is the fish C A R P been blanked out didnt know it was a swear word!

[stan26]

Hi Quatermass, I'm in a similar situation only getting pinpoint stars with 15-20 second subs with my RA driven EQ5 (still trying to get better), also lots of periodic error throwing out about 30-40 percent of my images prior to stacking

Hi Chris, I was averaging 30secs from my EQ3-2 with a good drift align and that resulted in 75% keepers. I have recently stripped down the mount and completely re-greased it using a high quality lithium based clear grease paying special attention to grease only the areas that need lube, then re assembled and spent probably an hour tuning the adjustment screws in RA and DEC whilst the mount was loaded with the scope etc on top, to get rid of as much backlash as possible whilst making sure the gears didn't bind up. After 10mins fine tuning a drift alignment on my pier I was able to get 1min + subs still retaining 75% keep rate, and we're talking about and EQ3-2 here!! Its a little time consuming but boy is it worth it! I recommend this to both you and quatermass to help achieve better subs, at least tune the adjustment screws if nothing else. This will help if guiding with these sort of mounts to.

stan:)

[eid]

Think I am going to have to consider selling our caravan

Hmmm.....

[Quatermass]

What is that a caravan with an observatory on the top!! Good grief thats amazing lol

[malc-c]

Hi Malcom like your fishing section on your website by the way nice C A R P you had a man of many talents I see!

Thanks, and glad you like my site... it's been around 10 years in the making !!

I don't fish as much now - can't afford to since I got the scope back in February last year, and haven't bettered my personal best shown there

I really need to update the astronomy section with some new pictures, but the M42 and M51 images were taken un guided with my 200p on the EQ5.

As you say, for £90 you have nothing to loose but to try the modification with a dual axis drive upgrade - if it gives you 3min - 5min guiding than that's fine for most subs

[Quatermass]

Hi Chris, I was averaging 30secs from my EQ3-2 with a good drift align and that resulted in 75% keepers. I have recently stripped down the mount and completely re-greased it using a high quality lithium based clear grease paying special attention to grease only the areas that need lube, then re assembled and spent probably an hour tuning the adjustment screws in RA and DEC whilst the mount was loaded with the scope etc on top, to get rid of as much backlash as possible whilst making sure the gears didn't bind up. After 10mins fine tuning a drift alignment on my pier I was able to get 1min + subs still retaining 75% keep rate, and we're talking about and EQ3-2 here!! Its a little time consuming but boy is it worth it! I recommend this to both you and quatermass to help achieve better subs, at least tune the adjustment screws if nothing else. This will help if guiding with these sort of mounts to.

stan:)

That sounds like a sound idea Stan and given how much wind and rain is lashing down here at the moment could well keep me from going mad..oops think it might be too late

[Quatermass]

Thanks, and glad you like my site... it's been around 10 years in the making !!

I don't fish as much now - can't afford to since I got the scope back in February last year, and haven't bettered my personal best shown there

I really need to update the astronomy section with some new pictures, but the M42 and M51 images were taken un guided with my 200p on the EQ5.

As you say, for £90 you have nothing to loose but to try the modification with a dual axis drive upgrade - if it gives you 3min - 5min guiding than that's fine for most subs

Good to know another fisherman on the forum and an astronomer as well. I am an level 2 angling coach and chairman of the norfolk broads angling strategy group so have quite a lot to do with fishing as you can imagine. Its fishing that got me into star gazing funny enough. I sat there looking at the stars every time I went night fishing and one night thought it would be nice to know a little bit more about them. Had no idea it would be just as addictive as fishing but its just added to my enjoyment of the night sky. Im thinking the Dual axis motor upgrade and modded st4 port is worth a go as if it gives me 5 minutes more on a sub that would be pretty good compared to what Im getting now.

[Chris]

Hi Stan,

Cool! what an amazing difference for the price of some grease, Congrat's . I did think my poor subs may be down to a combination of human error and the motors lacking the necessary microsteps, I had no idea servicing the mount could make so much difference, a tuneup may help improve things then as the mount was second hand when I got it so its probably a bit overdue by now

Hi Quatermass,

I'm very impressed with the subs both yourself and Stan have achieved with basic mounts without PEC and fancy stepper motors, it lets me know that theres more to be had out my mount, and to be honest I've not given as much time to drift alligning as I could do out of fear of loosing too much time imaging when the seeings good. Good luck with your plans with guiding, I'm not too clued up about how you can do this without the 290 pound upgrade, is it possible to buy the upgrade and sell the bits you don't need like the hand controller and instead drive it with Exmod, this is the only cheap solution I can think of to upgrade to a guide port, plus then you get the better stepper motors and no worry about it being worthwhile?

Cheers Chris

[eid]

I had an almost windless hour here last night so tried some guiding (kind of). I was taking movies of the planets, so cant show you actual results (long exposures) but maybe my graphs would be informative?

I think the glitch in the middle was a gust of wind.

Here they are anyway:

[Quatermass]

Its been horribly windy the last few nights hoping it will calm down a bit now so I can get another session in tonight.

[stan26]

I'm not too clued up about how you can do this without the 290 pound upgrade, is it possible to buy the upgrade and sell the bits you don't need like the hand controller and instead drive it with Exmod, this is the only cheap solution I can think of to upgrade to a guide port, plus then you get the better stepper motors and no worry about it being worthwhile?

Cheers Chris

Hi Chris, You don't need to upgrade your mount to guide if you already have the basic "dual axis" motors. If you only have the RA drive "single axis" motor kit then your cheapest option is to upgrade to the "dual" kit for about £90. IMO there is no point considering the pro goto kit for £290 if your intention for upgrade is purely to guide. Yes the motors are maybe better on the pro kit, But if you are going to spend this much you might as well sell your current mount and buy and HEQ5. The dual axis hand controller on the basic motor drive kits can be modified like what I have done. This is done by simply soldering in an st4 port on to the circuit board in the controller, its very simple especially if you buy the ready made components from shoe sting astro like I did. check out this link.

http://www.store.shoestringastronomy.com/eq_mod.pdf

Then it acts just like the pro mount with an st4 port to take commands from your laptop / PC or a standalone guider like what Quatermass will use. You will then need to decide how you want to link it with your computer if you don't use a stand alone unit. Your main options are USB or serial port (db25). I choose the serial port . Its cheaper, and I don't really like USB. I purchase a serial port interface (GPINT-PT) devide from shoe string. Its pre made pre configured to "st4" format and has an out put socket to take the RJ12 cable. RJ12 cable is what you would use to connect the PC to the st4 port on the controller. Cables are easily sourced from uk suppliers.

HTH

Stan:)