wibblefish

As someone who is exceptionally curious (thinking of future telescopes) with a tripod base on wet grass / mud / snow I don't worry about it getting mucky, how does it work with a Dobsonian base? i.e. would it need drying if it gets wet / expand / suck up moisture etc. (I am assuming its made of MDF or some such material)

If you wanted to see what a Rigel looks like mounted on a refractor rather than a Dob (only pictures I could find were Dobs!) this is my new one on a 90/660 refractor and a size comparison to a BST starguider (tho they are quite chunky!)  

I've only managed to use it once but its a huge step up from my standard red dot finder! It pretty much weighs the same as the original RDF to (I am not sure if a Telrad is heavier maybe?). Box came with two clip on / off bases (plus sticky stuff) of different mounting "roundness"(?) so just pick whichever fits the tube angle best.

Hope it helps!

Thanks @orion25 looks great  

I did find it again at the weekend to confirm when I was hunting for M1 (which was being elusive) as I used it as part of my star hop

Hi and welcome!

I would suggest the 102/500 ST for portability or perhaps the Evostar 90 (though that might be a bit long / bulky for a car?) if I was to buy one of those. I would suggest an AZ mount over an EQ one as they can be fiddly for beginners (especially if this is primarily for a child) to set up and unneeded if the telescope is primarily for visual use from what I understand. 

I have a 90/660 Evostar which is probably similar to the 102ST and get plenty out of it whilst it isn't overly bulky as I can pick it up with one hand to move it around on the lightweight tripod.

Another option might be binoculars / small spotting scope and a sky guide if you don't want to spend a lot of outlay on a telescope initially to "test the water" to see if it is something your son would be interested in longer term? It could also mean delaying the telescope purchase for a few months which might give you more time to consider and a wider choice as most stock is limited at present due to covid / transit issues.

I am sure there will be plenty of other opinions there are some smaller table top dobsonians that are very good price + portability which may be very suitable but I have no experience of them 

15 minutes ago, Tiny Clanger said:

I was taking balance as having the clutch entirely loose , and letting the 'scope tube find its own level, then sliding the vixen/SW/whatever bar/rail/whatever back & forth until the 'scope (with an ep in , of the most used type) is dead level.

The heritage dob alt bearing is just a large knob you tighten, no gears or anything, so it needs the 'scope to be well balanced to move easily , or else when you undo it the tube swings vertically . The knob has a pretty strong action though, so it locks solidly, and as long as it is released gradually it's not hard to find a good point between solidity and ease of movement. I suppose that's the result of the simple hefty dob base design.

Yep, wide view, lower mag, big stuff, a 'scope is good for ... what it's good for ! That's why I supplemented the little dob with a mak for the small bright stuff 🙂  I'd genuinely suggest someone wanting to spend under £400 and 'see everything' (as the request usually says) ought to consider 2 scopes, a wide field one (short refractor or 130 newt. on an alt az , or a heritage dob, whatever they fancy) and a 102 mak . for the narrow field views.

Heather

 

Ah yeah I don't know anything about Dobs Mine is balanced enough that it wont do much even with the clutch off until it is tipped back quite far (as one would expect) the only exception seems to be sometimes I have had the tube slip even on full clutch when inserting EP (usually the weighty EP + barlow combo - so much heavy glass!) so it was just a thought  

I am getting a new diagonal tomorrow so will see how the extra weight affects it, likely I will be pushing the dovetail as far forward as possible as there is no weight on the front of the tube and the pronto is a top load mount. I could probably do with bolting an extra weight or something on the dovetail if that is even a thing that exists or perhaps I should just wrap the spare 1kg wrist weight I have over the front of the tube to give it a bit more weight on that side of the mount head (wether that will make the payload to heavy is a completely different question though!) 

Yeah concur on the telescopes, I am only a few months in but I know I am going to need another telescope to see all the things! I do wonder about upgrading to the next size of short tube (127S) just for more light grasp and giving this one away. I suspect the right answer is to complement with an 8" Dob or a 127 Skymax or some such but I'll wait a while before posing that question to the group

@Tiny Clanger I think I am maybe using the wrong word, the telescope isn't out of balance (i.e. would pull the tripod over) its just I have had moments where the clutch has "slipped" off target when the additional weight was first applied if that's a better way of putting it? 

My main reason for high magnification is for trying to split double stars but there is going to be a limit to how useable it will be, I think the often quoted figure is 180x in UK skies but in practice it may be lower). I have pushed my refractor to the limit trying to see various things in recent nights (faint DSO, tight doubles etc.) and whilst that is great fun (if frustrating at times) it is much more suited to seeing those big wide field views at the low magnification end and getting lost amongst the star clusters

I recently acquired my telescope (90mm refractor) and after looking at various threads in this forum I upgraded the 25mm / 10mm eyepieces to a set of BST 25 / 18 / 12 and a barlow with the idea the 12mm would be a 6mm and plenty of magnification. What I found was the weight of the barlow + eyepiece gave some hairy moments with the balance of the telescope plus I had trouble gaining focus if I then tried to use an additional filter with that combo as well as plenty of high mag focusing shake due to the tripod. It might just be the one I had but its something to bear in mind with lighter weight telescopes when you buy decent but much heavier eye peices.

With a bit of weight to combat the shake (I bought some wrist weights and wrapped them round the tripod legs) and purchasing an 8mm I found it was much less weighty than the barlow + 12mm combo. If I really want to the 8mm + barlow (so 4mm) would give me a 165x magnification which is probably approaching the high end of useful magnification for the telescope.

Another suggestion might be to look into a zoom eyepiece but I have no experience with them unfortunately but plenty on here will have I am sure.

No point observing under clear skies if you get frostbite! Id suggest if you are keen, its safe to do so (ice could be a problem!) and can keep wrapped up warm then maybe if you fancy a short time out go for it

I had a session the other weekend in the cold where I was so focused on the scope I didn't notice my toes had gone numb till my music stopped (I have like an hour and half playlist I listen to to drown out the neighborhood noise :)) was painful when they warmed up!

Hot chocolate at the ready?

Welcome! Thats a great goal and it looks fantastic  

I would double check your targets with a skyapp I use Skyview or Stellarium Mobile (Skyview is easier to use) to be sure but it could also be an expectation thing potentially? This thread is a fairly good primer  

My experience is with a similar aperture telescope (90mm) and to my telescope even with a barlow and my highest magnification eye piece Mars shows as a small disc with a hint of orange colour and sometimes a hint of shadowing on the surface if the viewing is very clear (something similar to the image I have attached but less orange and a little smaller). 

Be aware large magnification doesn't necessarily mean you will see more especially with objects that are very distant, I probably would be pushing my scope quite heavily at the below magnification and would likely be experiencing some focus / tracking shake as well.

Yeah I signed up for this the other week. Hoping to be able to do it but this seems to be the week atm!

8 minutes ago, Orange Smartie said:

No need to apologise!  Being on topic is over-rated anyway.

Do you have Turn Left at Orion?  I got hold of it in the last week or so and it's very useful for giving an outline of seasonal targets (and stuff we in the Northern Hemispher can see all the time).  Of course it doesn't help you if you're looking in the wrong direction, as I have proved!

Lol I always feel bad waffling off-topic on threads that arent my own!

Yeah I have it, I really need to have a re-read at some point but I have plenty of targets for the moment. Mine is a bit tricksy with the back garden having bad LP in one direction, high trees in another and not being so big so I am going for volume of things to look at and working down the list of a night with my app going nope nope depending on how low / obscured stuff is  

12 minutes ago, Tiny Clanger said:

Ah, well your profligate brain really shouldn't be told the 127 mak itself is a very neat little package (it even comes with a handy padded bag ...)  ,and I've hardly ever set up both it and the heritage 150 (only had the mak since November, so this may change later in the year when it's less cold & muddy out) . If there are planets to see , or the Moon is up, the mak goes out, if no planets on the menu and the sky is not illuminated by the moon, little dob it is.

Honestly from what I've read the smaller 102 mak would probably be just as nice for lunar & planetary stuff, and being lighter could go on a lighter cheaper mount too.

I suspect that the pair of 'scopes I own are limited partly by light pollution , and partly by user ineptitude ,so I should probably stick to the free upgrade route of getting better at observing, while eagerly waiting the opportunity to drive down the road 10 min's to a darker rural spot when 'these unprecedented times' ease ...

You should try the Skymax on double stars, they are really fun though sometimes a challenge to find and totally not affected by moon / LP  

Ah I nearly bought a 102 as my first telescope on an EQ mount (that could do AZ), kinda glad I avoided it now due to stock limitations as get some lovely views out of the refractor. Its a shame there are no real star parties / I don't really know anyone with something like a Dob / Mak to go and have a nosey about how the compare so I will just have to rely on SGL  

Back on topic (sorry @Orange Smartie) it alas looks like my weather window has closed according to my app even though its clear skies and sun out, guess it'll be a stick head out of backdoor situation later! Its on the master list of targets though ready!

17 minutes ago, Orange Smartie said:

Wow!

 

Seconded, thats a lot of stuff in one place blimey

Hehe, I often just stick my head out as well but luckily the refractor whilst small has almost zero cooldown 

Unfortunately my brain keeps looking at the bigger 127S Bresser / 120 Evo or ST / 127 Skymax or just a really big 200P Dob and thinking now I would see more of xyz. Its traitorous and wants to spend more of my pennies! I am not sure I even have room for a second scope stored  nor the will to set up more than one on a night or the patience to wait an hour for the bigger things to cooldown 😛 

I shall have to add them to my list, I might get a night out tonight though weather app is highly changeable at present and its also reporting some cloud cover so who knows what the seeing will be like! Be good if so since it looks like wall to wall cloud and snow here for the next week!

That's some great stuff there!

Shame the link is the daily mail lol I also love in the article how they also say "Luckily for SpaceX, it was able to stick the landing with its Falcon 9." - pretty sure at this point its not luck 😛

4 hours ago, MylesGibson said:

If you are over the way of Mu Cephei, there is also another star in Canes Venatici to look out for that unfortunately I haven't been able to observe yet as I only recently discovered it! La Superba is the name. Can't believe I haven't heard of it before with a name like that! That is supposed to be one of the reddest stars in the sky. R Leporis is also another really good one to look for. Better viewed when at one of it's dimmer phases, as that is when it appears most red, but also makes it more difficult to observe!

Will add that one to my list, thank you, I already have R Leporis on the to do list  

5 minutes ago, NGC 1502 said:

The doubles I observed included- Algeiba in Leo, Iota and Zeta in Cancer, Rigel and Sigma in Orion, Beta in Monoceros. All nicely resolved in the 80mm Vixen apart from Zeta (Tegmine) in Cancer - easily resolved as a double but it takes one of my larger scopes to resolve the 3rd component.  Mu Cephei is in Cepheus almost overhead as soon as it gets dark at this time of year, yet another fine sight 👍

For me the best of the above is Beta Mon.  Cracking triple nicely resolved in a small scope. I get as much fun out of my small scopes as my larger ones.....

Ed.

Cool I have done those I think except Rigel which is being stubborn, I got a hint of the secondary last time I was out (and Sirius) I think but I may have just been a little out of focus or imagining it so will need to try again to confirm  

I concur on Beta Mon, that's an amazing sight when you resolve it down!

8 minutes ago, Pixies said:

I used to place my EP case on a little camping table and keep it near me when observing. But recently, I stick mainly with my widefield plus a zoom at the scope and if I decide to use a prime EP or get a filter, I wander off to the back door and grab them from there.

Honestly I am just being lazy instead of walking over the garden to the case that they normally sit in which I put on a chair where I keep my books / notepad but I have found chasing doubles recently at different mags having the 3 EP + barlow to hand makes life easier

2 hours ago, NGC 1502 said:

With thanks to wibblefish for mentioning 119 Tauri, I’d not heard of it previously.

In a rare clear slot last evening I went out with one of my small refractors, an elderly Vixen 80mm made in the 1980s.

119 Tauri is slightly variable at +4.2/4.5 magnitude.  From my back garden it’s just visible with difficulty to the unaided eye. At 45x the red colour was obvious and a fine sight.

Lots else followed, mainly double stars, but nice to view a new to me object.

Ed.

Glad you found it, I am going to see if I can find the other one Mu Cephei (Garnet Star) which is just off the great square (I think) next time I am out. What doubles did you look at? (Always up for more of those, finding them quite enjoyable at the moment!)

1 minute ago, SuburbanMak said:

Looks business-like. After one night of rolling around on the floor getting neck-ache I went all-in on finders too. After a couple of sessions I can tell I am not going to regret a penny and sure you will find the same.  +1 on everything folk saying here about alignment, I got it as best I could on the top of a church spire about 500m away  then fine tuned on first the moon & then Capella in one of those rare clear nights, happy star-hopping!

Honestly even slightly poorly adjusted the finderscope is a brilliant upgrade, I appreciate my telescope is probably wide enough to be its own finder but still its making life a bit easier star finding and hopping which is what I was after - that and turning the diagonal back upright instead of the jaunty 90 angle it was at original *facepalm* 

17 minutes ago, Dantooine said:

Or on the tray so the weight is equal on all 3 legs. I’m sure these things will help. 

I usually keep my glasses and torch on the tray but possibly a good plan. After an incident where an EP fell off the tray when repositioning the other week I got myself a fishermans tripod rest which I can just plonk the EPs I am swapping in and out in, seems to be fine so far with my little collection of BSTs though probably not a good place to put to much weight  

14 minutes ago, John said:

When aligning finders in day time I use the most distant object that I can find - about a mile away ideally. Even then I re-adjust using a star at night to ensure that the accuracy is as good as possible. For the optical finder I try and get the scope / finder alignment to the point where something bang on the cross hairs of the finder is central in the field of view of a high power eyepiece.

I find having accurately aligned finders is worth a little effort.

I also try and setup my optical RACI finders so that the angle of their eyepieces match the angle that the eyepiece of the scope is at as well. Then I can move my eye from the finder eyepiece to the scope eyepiece with minimum movement.

These are all little tweaks that I've found help the finding process. Everybody will develop their own preferences as they find what works best for them  

Thanks for the tips, alas seeing anything about a mile away is pretty much a no-go during the day (I usually use a chimney on a house over the road) and since it seems like night is best to align the Rigel I may as well do the finder then on something bright as well it'll give me something to do at the beginning of next session no doubt

6 minutes ago, Dantooine said:

That’s not a bad telescope and the tripod legs will stiffen up if you rill them with sand 👍

Interesting, I didn't think of that, might have to have a look at doing that in the summer when we refill the kiddos sand pits  

I even have some old ankle weights around maybe I'll just wrap them around the tripod legs.

Ok, I tested it in the garage under the light in there and it didn't have issues but I guess against daylight it might be a different story I can happily adjust it at night, lots of bright streetlights and things round here to aim at  

I do need to adjust the finder scope as I only aligned it using my widest EP so its a bit off when at higher magnifications, probably adjust it to the highest magnification one which is what was suggested either here or some other post I commented on

Lol yeah its turning into a little bazooka, it did look worse when I put the Rigel on the right side angle of the scope but decided against it.

Oh dear so much outlay on a little starter scope but nothing that can't be used with future telescopes I think! That is a debate for another year but so far 200P Dob, 127 Skymax, 6" Classical Cassegrain and Bressers 127 series (either long or short tube) are catching my eye and of course if I win the lottery I might just get a 120ED 😛

Next up is a replacement tripod I think but probably be fine for a little while and not risk any more wifely wrath (it was so much easier when I wasn't working from home :D).

Another update, all the new finders are installed though I need to find some time during the day to align them properly, maybe this weekend! Looking forward to using them in anger sometime in the next ... weeks? ... months? .... who knows