Ships and Stars

I hear you, I need 20 acres in Spain, Nevada, etc and a job working online! 👍 I'm halfway there with the job but would miss working in the field. Ah well...

Excellent advice. If anything, I can simply use what I have as a benchmark or reference for any future tweaks I make. Just getting time to view is my main problem!

Indeed - I was just looking at the GSOs for £32.80 each, that's pocket change in this game. The Baader 35s eudiascopics sound great, but they are £155 a pop, virtually second-hand 24mm Panoptic territory (now £254 new). Now I'm reading about clear aperture (my WO binoviewer has only 20mm clear aperture), light cone restrictions in fast dobs, Siebert's website (ouch!) and the 'zero path' TS or Omegon BVs etc and it's making my head spin again. No cheap way out to get maximum performance, as with most things. To complicate matters even more, I am now looking at a low profile Crayford focuser to move the binoviewer in as close as possible to try and get away with a 1.2x or 1.3x gpc. I think for now I will live with the 1.6x and some 32mm EPs and see how life goes! I'll probably be happy with this set up. At least for a week or two! 🤣

I can only dream about 61x! My target for the fainter DSOs is around 85x for best results I believe, but that is single EP viewing. Probably a bit lower mag for binoviewers. I wished I'd started experimenting with them before, but only recently realised I had a low profile 2" to 1.25" adaptor lurking in the back of my EP case, doh!

Hi all, apologies for not replying earlier - things have been flat out! Thanks! It is your Morpheus that I've been using, a great eyepiece. I'm going to try out a range of DSOs with BVs and use the Morpheus and the 21E as benchmarks. I'll look into some different arrangements to drop magnification as well. Cheers! Good point Gerry on the exit pupil through binoviewers - I didn't realise that about splitting the exit pupil, but it makes perfect sense. It will be a few weeks before I can invest in some new EPs, but looking for an affordable combination - a slew of different ideas ranging from 30 or 40mm Vixen NPLs (the 40mm NPL only has a 40deg FOV, but mag would drop to 80x with a 1.6x gpc so as good as it gets for moderately faint nebula) to 27mm Orion/ BST/ Omegon etc extra flat eps. Also the trusty TV plossls or maybe a pair of 35mm Baaser eudiascopic(s) if I can find some second hand ones, although I hear they need considerably more inward travel to focus because of the shoulder design which would probably set me back to a 2x GPC. John has mentioned some focusers have a split tube to shorten drawtube length, perhaps an idea. I'd go for the Binotrons and a powerswitch but will have to wait until I've sold a few more toys! Lots to think about! Thanks everyone, I'll no doubt report back once I've tackled a few more DSOs with the 500p.

Probably the same - attaching a DSLR to a reflector is just like turning it into a giant fixed aperture mirror lens. Thanks!

Ooh that's a nice looking setup! I appreciate the information. I looked at the Siebert website some time ago and emailed him, but never ordered a GPC. Getting the magnification down is a top priority. Thanks very much! I like your thinking! This area is still a bit of a mystery to me, but have a rough idea of what you've done. Thank you both!

That's great - now we're talking! I can only agree with you from what I've seen thus far. How again did you manage to drop down to 1.2-1.3x? I know the Denks are BVs but is the Earthwin a low power GPC? Would that thread onto my standard 1.25 nose piece I wonder, or is bespoke for Denk BVs? My target mag for faint DSOs in the 20" is around 85x which will be hard to achieve without losing the current mandatory 1.6x barlow effect. I'd be thrilled even to go down to 100x. I have a second-hand 27mm/53deg Orion 'Edge On' that will be arriving soon, a low price 1.25" ep - curious to see how it fares. If I like it and can find another, I'll give that a go in the BVs. 12" is still a lot of aperture! I have to say the 20" can be truly awesome at times, I've only ever had a 200p and a 130PDS (now sold), so the 500p is in a different league altogether. Under 21.90+ skies in the Cairngorms it's probably the best visual astronomy I'll ever experience, unless I have a chance to view through someone else's bigger dob someday. If I can replicate the ball ends on the 6 truss rods, I'll make some shorter 'bino' truss rods, hate to modify the standard ones in case it throws something out of alignment. The ball ends (12 in total) might be something for a 3D printer enthusiast. I'll measure them, but I think they are simple 25mm ball ends. I bet M27 looks amazing but M42 is probably mind-blowing through BVs! Next time I'm out I think I will just stick with binoviewers vs 17.5 Morpheus and revisit some of the targets I've seen recently to compare the experience. From what I saw viewing M57 with the bog standard 20mm WO eyepieces, I think I will have some exciting results. 60x mag through yours is excellent, that must be wonderful!

Rest assured, you will never need a warmer pair of boots! The nice thing I like about them is that the liner boot comes out and you can wear them around like slipper boots, very comfortable - the liners actually look and act like the Russian Valenki I mentioned above. £93 isn't bad actually. You can always sell them on if you ever wanted to, and it's not likely you'll wear the soles out for many, many years. They are huge but very comfortable. No driving in these unless you want to end up in someone's front room 😉

The bag thing is a good trick!

Hi all, I've really wanted to try my WO binoviewers in the big dob for DSOs like nebulae and galaxies, which I've understand is kind of a non-starter, since it effectively halves aperture, though other gains can be had through stereo vision. I had a very short observing session last night - wind picked up too much for the dob and it was shaking like mad. But I did make a brief but interesting observation. I finally decided to try the binoviewers on M57 last night (20mm standard WO ep with 1.6x GPC at 160x) vs my 17.5mm Morpheus (114x) on the 20" dob. Admittedly, it's a bright DSO, but I was pleased to find it looked amazing through the BVs. I 'think' I could even see a hint of the central star, and that was with the moon very close by, maybe 25-30deg to the south and at a higher altitude. I'll call it a maybe on the central star - will try again next go. For comparison, I swapped out the BVs for a single 17.5mm Morpheus and could tell absolutely no difference in brightness - only that I gathered a fair bit more detail with the BVs. Maybe I just saw what I wanted to in my mind, but I tried to be objective. The maths behind BVs splitting the light ray will presumably contest this assertion. In reality, I didn't get much time to play with this setup so the jury is still out. The next chance I have, I will try using binoviewers for a longer period to scan along the Veil and also M31, M32, M33 and M110 and any other DSO I can in increasing faintness to see what the practical limits are. As an aside, I also found the BVs better for centring a star during alignment vs using a single ep, perhaps because there was no slight 'head roll' when placing both eyes to the EPs. Anyone else player around with BVs on some of the brighter DSOs? I'm hoping to get some lower mag 1.25" EPs to try and gain more of a widefield and drop mag for fainter DSOs. I'd love to lose the 1.6x barlow but can't focus without. One idea I had was investigating if there was a 'negative' 2" adaptor which actually sits inside the drawtube, as the BV nosepiece will go in some distance. Not keen on cutting and truss rods! A SW flextube dob would be great to play with in this regard. Cheers all.

High altitude mountain climbers sometimes use vapour barrier liners, which is a fancy way of saying a.) first wear thin liner socks (just thin polyester dress socks from ASDA will do), then b.) put the now infamous single use plastic bags on your feet (also found at Asda 🤣), then c.) your warm socks. It prevents perspiration from getting into the thick outer sock and ultimately your boot, which causes loss of insulative properties. It also stops the foot from perspiring which also helps to increase heat. Of course you'd need to go a size up so feet aren't crammed in there. Perhaps easier just to run in place or take a brisk but brief walk - with astronomy it's the stationary aspect that slows circulation. Hillwalkers will know this - it's freezing cold at the start of a climb, then by the time they are halfway up, they are stripping layers and opening zips. If you really want to be different, (not really practical for 99.9% of British weather) go native and get some Russian Valenki s galoshi (felt wool boots and rubber slip on soles), Inuit Mukluk from North America or some Scandinavian reindeer slippers which look deceptively thin but are a popular traditional winter footwear in Sami regions. I was in Kautokeino, Norway one February, it was nudging -35C or more (digital thermometer at the local Statoil wouldn't go any lower) and many locals were wearing reindeer slippers. You don't need rubber soles, everything is frozen solid and the hairs on the bottom grip like cross country ski skins. Probably not practical for your local high street in the Midlands however! 🤣

Winter camping has always been my thing. I have some Sorel Glacier XTs I used in Arctic Norway but they are overkill for the UK, even winter camping up high in the Cairngorms, except when it's below -10C or -15C. Those temps really don't happen much unless you are camping on top of Ben Macdui in January. Like most things crammed into my house, they were second hand but like new, £60. https://www.sorel.com/mens-glacier-xt-boot-1573891.html Don't think about trying to drive in them, haha. Realistically, just get some cheap Trespass snow boots maybe a size up with plenty of wriggle room as suggested above, but find some really scratchy, coarse wool socks. A Russian friend claimed the slight itching effect of the wool promotes circulation and I can only agree. Cotton socks are just a no go. I also picked up two pairs of fleece JCB socks from Morrison petrol station (random purchase!) and they are actually decent.

Thanks Peter! SOunds like you had a good night as well. One item I often wear - I bought an older Rab down expedition parka off ebay in the summer for £45 and used nikwax down wash, came out like new. Tumble dry very low or no heat with tennis balls - breaks up the down clumps and makes it loft right up. I like the hood as well, it blocks stray light. Down lasts for years. You can find down trousers as well. The Montane Extreme salopettes and anorak are very warm - fleece too, so if it gets damp, no big deal. Basically, any quality used down gear off ebay is usually excellent - Rab or Mountain Hardwear, etc, or much more affordably, an insulated boiler suit with lots of layers underneath is fine. Mine is Swedish, Fristads, but it's not really anything special. Thanks for the tip on the Horse Head! Hoping to revisit soon. I agree, the Cocoon is not going to set the visual astro world on fire any time soon, haha, I've decided now I'm probably not going to squeeze much more out of it, unless I was looking in the wrong place again! I feel guilty now I didn't stop and spend some time on the Flame Nebula - so caught up in the HH I basically forgot about it! The conditions were excellent - hoping for a repeat before New Years once the moon is out of the picture again. I will definitely try these tips with different magnification and filters - a filter wheel is next on my list! Cheers all!

The average days of sunshine map is telling as well. Devon and Cornwall well below. NE Scotland worse than usual and cloud and precipitation, but not as bad as some have it! I guess to be fair, the west coast of Scotland gets a lot more rain and cloud than we normally do here around Aberdeen, but I wonder how much exactly...

Ah right - I had that backwards! I thought the higher the target the less rotation. I wondered why HH allowed a 20" without much movement... May I ask what is meant by third intersection? I enjoyed taking these photos quite a lot. Might try it again tonight from LP area and see how things fare.

Seem unusually rainy? It's not your imagination! Interesting rainfall distribution stats released from Met Office. https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/about-us/press-office/news/weather-and-climate/2019/2019-autumn-and-november-stats Western/Northern Scotland well below average - many other places - well above. Costa del Ullapool anyone?

The AZ4 tripod is excellent for binos. I had 25x100s on a star adventurer L bracket no problems other than making sure altitude clutch was securely tightened. Plus, you can easily swap out the binos for a small telescope like a 130 or 150 Newtonian or small to mid size refractor. Very versatile.

I bought a Yuasa 70ah deep cycle leisure battery from Tanya Battery for £62. It's a mobile powerhouse. Not heavy by leisure battery standards and has a nice handle which covers the terminals when not in use.

Aperture and dark conditions seemed to work quite well here for these test shots. I'll try this under LP conditions but not holding breath! Who knows, might take a few keepers. Decided to try ski wax on the altitude runners so they don't freeze up! I think 15sec will be max reliable exposure time, maybe 20sec near zenith.

Ah thanks, definitely hoping to pick up bubble nebula next time! I don't think there's ever going to be a great deal of visual enjoyment in the Cocoon nebula, that's one for the imagers. Friday was great here, early Sunday was good but I was still recovering from Friday, only had 2 hrs sleep Sat morning. Lots of layers and lots of coffee! My right hand without glove for a bit went really numb from messing around with EPs and camera, didn't realise it until a bit late! Oops. Close call with frostnip... great evening though. Thank you! I'd love to be able to view from home, but LP just gets worse and worse. I can see a little, but only if lights are off next door, a rare event... I was definitely on a mission, could be some time before another chance like that. Studying targets in advance is a huge timesaver, especially if tracking plays up. Don't blame you on the amber nectar, I'd have liked one if it was a bit warmer out! Or wear thicker gloves, ha.

Thanks Mark, no doubt it's a bit of work but worth it when conditions are right (and time permitting). The Stargate is actually quite portable once the rocker and mirror are removed from the base, about 32-33kg each if I remember correctly. The truss rods and secondary assembly are a piece of cake to transport. Still it's a bit of a workout but I can load in about 20-25 min and the same for setup, second nature by now. I use tiedown straps to gently hold everything in place in my van and take it nice and easy to the site. Fortunately there isn't much traffic at the times I'm out roaming around, especially on the way back.

It was frantic at times but the conditions were excellent. I probably had too many targets to squeeze in, but managed ok. I was surprised the HH was revealed in the photo - that was a 20" exposure at ISO6400, no filter. It's grainy and not of any quality, but at least I know I was on the mark, sort of a 'finder photo'. I might start doing some grainy high ISO reference shots with the harder nebulae so I can be more confident I am lined up properly.

Thank you again - I was trying to think of the NPB a month ago when I mentioned the Orion ultrablock. The NPB is actually relatively affordable - they do cosmetic seconds, and do both 1.25" and 2". I have friends in the states who could post them to me or take the plunge and see what customs would be. I think I'll go for those! The filter wheel is the other thing I need to pick up - like you mention, sometimes I think it's too easy to get hung up using a certain filter, e.g. Hb when one of the others would do a better job. Plus they are really fiddly to change when hands are numb, so I am less inclined to experiment. A filter wheel and NPBs are on the list... I took my gloves off to do something the other night for a minute, and ended up working without them for 10-15min. Oops! Had to start the van up to restore circulation... Thanks again for the advice!! Hoping for some clear weather again soon 👍 Thanks, that was definitely the darkest, clearest conditions I've encountered thus far with the big dob. Just need to watch that frost getting on everything! I'm thinking I'll use ski wax on the altitude runners! Will also take your lead on making a small shield for the finderscope. I have a Telrad which is just superb, but there's no obvious place to mount it on the 500p. I'm working on that, haha.

Thanks Gerry! I'll go for SH2-157 for sure, I was right there with M52. I seem to enjoy these challenges.To me, the Horsehead was markedly easier than the Cocoon, mainly because of confidence in knowing I was looking in the right spot. I used the Hb unsuccessfully seeking out the Flaming Star, but now am a little uncertain I didn't have the UHC in instead, though I'm 90% certain I was using the Hb. I probably slewed right past it, hate being in a rush! I have a list of DSOs for the Hb filter I found online (CN) but didn't spend a lot of time chasing it - must do more research on that. I was so close to the Bubble Nebula, but M52 caught my attention and that was that... haha. It's always a nice surprise when some unexpected DSO comes into sight. It will be a challenge for me to get back to this site anytime soon, it's a 1.5hr drive and a close family member is needing a fair bit of care, but hoping for another go before the new year. Moon coming back into play and forecast for next five days is a no go...maybe one small window of opportunity here next week. Rest assured when I get another go, I'll be on the road asap! I thought of your location when I was complaining about the cold and thought you'd get a laugh! I haven't broken out my goose down parka and trousers and Sorels yet, but definitely wearing them next time. Cheers!