Help with compatible mounts for Skywatcher 250PX

[HaplessWonder]

Hello,

I have just rush bought a Skywatcher 250PX and only after payment have I seen in the description that there is no stand. I am gutted! I am usually so careful with listings and bids. 

I just read the original mount that would come with the telescope arent available separately so what stands or mounts are compatible with this telescope? Me and my partner are enthusiasts so are not wanting to be all flash, we just wanted to gaze at the planets and nearby objects as clearly as possible.

Appreciate any advice.

B.

 

[John]

I think the minimum that would do the job would be an HEQ5:

Sky-Watcher HEQ5 PRO Go-To Astronomy Mount | First Light Optics

Alternatively, for visual use only, you could consider building a dobsonian mount for the scope as detailed here:

How to build a Dobsonian mount - BBC Sky at Night Magazine

 

 

 

Edited December 3, 2023 by John

[Chandra]

The Newtonians, especially when they are of a significant size, are not very comfortable to use in traditional equatorial mounts, but yes, you would need a mount capable of supporting their weight and length, in my opinion the HEQ-5 could be insufficient even for visual, which would already lead to the EQ-6... what woukd means more money...

The option of building your own Dobsonian mount is interesting, if you like DIY... Of course, it would be the most economical option...

Although perhaps they don't sell the manual mounts separately, apparently SW does sell the motorized Dob mount kits... They don't seem to be cheap, but it could be a good solution to the problem, in my opinion better than the equatorial mount, although if you have plans to venturing one day into deep sky astrophotography, this kind of mount will not works to you. https://www.cloudynights.com/topic/627435-goto-dobsonian-upgrade-kit-from-skywatcher/

[Mandy D]

@HaplessWonder There is a great home-made Dobsonian mount built for a 200P by @PeterStudz on this forum. It is a rather unique design as it has cutouts of the Moon and constellations in the uprights and has even been lit with a red lamp in some pictures. Here is a link to one of his pictures of it. He has posted better pictures, but I didn't dig far enough to find them, tonight.

Edited December 3, 2023 by Mandy D

[Chandra]

40 minutes ago, Mandy D said:

@HaplessWonderHay una gran montura Dobsoniana hecha en casa para un 200P por@PeterStudzen este foro. Es un diseño bastante singular, ya que tiene recortes de la Luna y las constelaciones en los montantes e incluso ha sido iluminado con una lámpara roja en algunas imágenes. Aquí hay un enlace a una de sus fotografías. Ha publicado mejores fotografías, pero esta noche no investigué lo suficiente para encontrarlas.

 

Awesome!! A true handyman... It doesn't look like an artisanal manufacture but rather like a factory one... 😍

[HaplessWonder]

13 hours ago, John said:

I think the minimum that would do the job would be an HEQ5:

Sky-Watcher HEQ5 PRO Go-To Astronomy Mount | First Light Optics

Alternatively, for visual use only, you could consider building a dobsonian mount for the scope as detailed here:

How to build a Dobsonian mount - BBC Sky at Night Magazine

 

 

 

I think this is what I am going to have to do, the DIY route. Have to be a tradesman with my DIY skills.

 

Thanks for the suggestion.

[HaplessWonder]

12 hours ago, Mandy D said:

@HaplessWonder There is a great home-made Dobsonian mount built for a 200P by @PeterStudz on this forum. It is a rather unique design as it has cutouts of the Moon and constellations in the uprights and has even been lit with a red lamp in some pictures. Here is a link to one of his pictures of it. He has posted better pictures, but I didn't dig far enough to find them, tonight.

That looks very good indeed, wonder if he would share his plans?

[Mandy D]

27 minutes ago, HaplessWonder said:

That looks very good indeed, wonder if he would share his plans?

You could always ask him. Drop him a private message ...

[John]

2 hours ago, HaplessWonder said:

I think this is what I am going to have to do, the DIY route. Have to be a tradesman with my DIY skills.

 

Thanks for the suggestion.

There are lots of other DIY dobsonian telescope plans on the web. Some are so simple even I could make them ! 🙄

My only tip would be to use plywood rather than MDF if possible. Plywood is strong but lighter than MDF. 

Edited December 4, 2023 by John

[HaplessWonder]

20 hours ago, John said:

There are lots of other DIY dobsonian telescope plans on the web. Some are so simple even I could make them ! 🙄

My only tip would be to use plywood rather than MDF if possible. Plywood is strong but lighter than MDF. 

Ill have to take a look when the scope gets here, I'm not sure if bearings are needed or where the balance point is etc, I will consider it.

[Mandy D]

2 hours ago, HaplessWonder said:

Ill have to take a look when the scope gets here, I'm not sure if bearings are needed or where the balance point is etc, I will consider it.

If this is a 250PX as you say, then it will have the alt mounting points on the tube, unless they have been removed. In which case, you will see, clearly, where they were, so no problem finding the balance point. I've included a photo of my 200P, which shows the Dobsonian mounting points - the large black bit. The thread in the middle is M10 x 1.5. It is possible that these may have been removed, but you can still mount it using rings, like I have.

[HaplessWonder]

6 hours ago, Mandy D said:

If this is a 250PX as you say, then it will have the alt mounting points on the tube, unless they have been removed. In which case, you will see, clearly, where they were, so no problem finding the balance point. I've included a photo of my 200P, which shows the Dobsonian mounting points - the large black bit. The thread in the middle is M10 x 1.5. It is possible that these may have been removed, but you can still mount it using rings, like I have.

Hi Mandy, it's arrived but I have to say I feel somewhat disappointed. Maybe it is my rush to grab it from ebay. Anyway, here are some pics of it and it's features, I am unsure now that this is a 250PX as per the listing as google searches show a different model.

I would like to test it if I can with what I have, there must be some way to. It doesnt have a mount but if I can at least test it to see that it all works.

[Mandy D]

22 minutes ago, HaplessWonder said:

Hi Mandy, it's arrived but I have to say I feel somewhat disappointed. Maybe it is my rush to grab it from ebay. Anyway, here are some pics of it and it's features, I am unsure now that this is a 250PX as per the listing as google searches show a different model.

I would like to test it if I can with what I have, there must be some way to. It doesnt have a mount but if I can at least test it to see that it all works.

Nope, that is not a 250PX, it is, instead a 200P. Both are fine telescopes and both have the same 1200 mm focal length. I am sorry that you have suffered this problem with your purchase. It seems to have a motorised focuser attachment, a laser pointer and a finder. If you cannot, or do not want to return this for refund, then it is possible to make a really good setup with it. The 200P has an 8 inch mirror, instead of the 10 inch that you were expecting. It will only gather 64% of the light of the larger instrument, but that is still a lot! I have both the 200p and 250PX and am disappointed with neither.

You will need to build a Dobsonian base for it, but that is not difficult, especially as you have the altitude mounts already on the tube. To test it, all you need to do is lay it down on a table and prevent it from rolling, then point it at something, in daylight (not the Sun!) a long way off, put an eyepiece in and see if you can focus it. Don't worry if all you see through the eyepiece is black, that will just mean the collimation is so far out that the eyepiece cannot see the primary mirror. My 200P arrived like that and it took 5 minutes to sort.

I think it is likely that you have a very decent telescope there. I have taken some stunning images of the Moon with mine. We are all here to help you get through these teething problems and build things up to the point where this no longer looks like a problem, but an opportunity. You will certainly learn a lot by sorting it, but there really is not much to go wrong with these telescopes and nearly everything is esy to fix. Just check the primary mirror by looking down the tube. There should be some dust on it, but it should be highly reflective. Do NOT attempt to clean it in any way at this time! That can come later if necessary.

Edited December 5, 2023 by Mandy D
Dang typos!

[HaplessWonder]

6 minutes ago, Mandy D said:

Nope, that is not a 250PX, it is, instead a 200P. Both are fine telescopes and both have the same 1200 mm focal length. I am sorry that you have suffered this problem with your purchase. It seems to have a motorised focuser attachement, a laser pointer and a finder. If you cannot, or do not want to return this for refund, then it is possible to make a really good setup with it. The 200P has an 8 inch mirror, instead of the 10 inch that you wer expecting. It will only gather 64% of the light of the larger instrument, but that is still a lot! I have bothe 200p and 250PX and am disappointed with neither.

You will need to build a Dobsonian base for it, but that is not difficult, especially as you have the azimuth mounts already on the tube. To test it, all you need to do is lay it down on a table and prevent it from rolling, then point it at something, in daylight (not the Sun!) a long way off and see if you can focus it. Don't worry if all you see through the eyepiece is black, that will just mean the collimation is so far out that the eyepiece cannot see the primary mirror. My 200P arrived like that and it took 5 minutes to sort.

I think it is likely that you have a very decent telescope there. I have taken some stunning images of the Moon with mine. We are all here to help you get through these teething problems and build things up to the point where this no longer looks like a problem, but an opportunity. You will certainly learn a lot sorting it, but there really is not a lot to go wrong with these telescopes. Just check the primary mirror by looking down the tube. There should be some dust on it, but it should be highly reflective. Do NOT attempt to clean it in any way at this time! That can come later if necessary.

It was listed as a 250PX and as an addition the seller stated 'I am told it is 8' - maybe I was too hasty and should have checked into it.

So, you say it is a good telescope? It certainly feels it from weight and size alone. But those accessories, the focuser, it has a 9v battery which I have tested and it is a good battery, however none of the buttons do anything at all, I would expect the eyepiece part to move around but nothing.

At this stage I just want to see if all is well with it, if the motorised focuser isnt working itll be a return as he stated it was fully working.

The laser pointer has also good batteries but pushing the button nothing appears when I aim at a wall, expecting a red dot.

I really appreciate your help, me and the wife are so keen to just sit romantically gazing upwards so we just want a good scope that will do this.

Not a problem with the mount as it looks a simple DIY project, it's the basics I need to check work first.

The mirror looks sound, little dust but sound.

[Mandy D]

I would not worry about the motorised focuser, as you don't need it and the same goes for the laser. Avoid the aggro of return shipping and getting your money back if you can by asking for a rebate agains the non-working parts and just send those back if he wants them. But, try new batteries first. It is no good testing batteries by measuring their voltage with a multimeter as that does not load them and they will likely show full voltage regardless.

I think, once you get through the disappointmenet and start fixing it up, you'll be a lot happier. As long as you have not overpaid for this after any rebates, it is worth keeping. |Do you have eyepieces with it? You might have to remove the motorised focuser bit to focus manually, but I'm not sure. It will be very easy if necessary and you have the knob on the other side that you can focus with manually.

Good to see you are not fazed by making the mount.

[HaplessWonder]

12 minutes ago, Mandy D said:

I would not worry about the motorised focuser, as you don't need it and the same goes for the laser. Avoid the aggro of return shipping and getting your money back if you can by asking for a rebate agains the non-working parts and just send those back if he wants them. But, try new batteries first. It is no good testing batteries by measuring their voltage with a multimeter as that does not load them and they will likely show full voltage regardless.

I think, once you get through the disappointmenet and start fixing it up, you'll be a lot happier. As long as you have not overpaid for this after any rebates, it is worth keeping. |Do you have eyepieces with it? You might have to remove the motorised focuser bit to focus manually, but I'm not sure. It will be very easy if necessary and you have the knob on the other side that you can focus with manually.

Good to see you are not fazed by making the mount.

I have paid £245 for it as is, which right now am thinking it is too much but I will be guided by what you say, if you say this a is a good telescope.

The focuser turns the vertical bar, is that the drive for the gear I assume? anyway, it turns one way but not the other. The bar turns but the actual focus itself does not move with the turning.

So two things there, it only turns one way and the focus itself isnt actually moved.

Eyepieces I own a NEEWER PLOSSL 25MM which I have inserted, I can see blurry images but cannot get anything in focus at all, maybe the objects are too close.

What would be a reasonable price for this telescope? 

 

[Mandy D]

@HaplessWonder I paid £200 for my 200P second-hand, complete, but no laser, no motorised focuser, but with the standard finderscope. I would say for the OTA on it's own, £245 is too much. I'd want to pay no more than about £150. I guess you had shipping costs as part of your price, whereas I collected.

OK, to get the focuser working there are two things you may have to do. Remove the motor unit. Next, there is locking screw on the focuser barrel, with a knurled knob. You need to loosen that in order for the focuser drawtube to slide in and out. You can see the locking knob to the left in your third photo.

If it is not focusing, make sure you have the extension piece in the focuser, which appears to be shown fitted in the same photo. Then point the scope at a distant object and rack the focuser in and out. If it still does not focus, start pulling the eyepiece out of the focuser. At some point it should focus. If that fails, remove the extension and try without to get the eyepiece closer in. You'll have to hold the eypiece square by hand as the drawtube has a 2" bore. Mine will easily focus on the church clock a quarter mile up the road. If you are getting a blurry image, this is simply going to be down to the closeness of the object and the position the eyepiece needs to be in. It will almost certainly focus at some point.

EDIT: Can you check the spider vane mounting point as indicated by my pink circling? It might be nothing but it looks damaged to me. It should look like the other 3.

Edited December 5, 2023 by Mandy D
Added an Edit.

[Chandra]

@mandyd has given you excellent advice and instructions... You really don't need the motorized focuser for visual observation, it is a perfectly dispensable element that can be saved. Many years ago I had a Newton 8" f/6 and I can also tell you that it is a great multipurpose tube for astronomical observation, it is surely the most common aperture among amateurs. Honestly, in my opinion, speaking in terms of optics, there is no a big jump between an 8" and a 10", another thing is the question of price, since the seller labeled one thing but the product was another. 

The finder is a Telrad. I've never used one, but those who have are generally very fond of them. This is one of the types of "0 power finder" (another type would be the red dot finders that most small telescopes now carry, for example). There are several threads here about its use, here I leave the link to one of them so you can decide whether to keep it or return it (if possible). https://stargazerslounge.com/topic/128382-how-good-is-a-telrad-finderscope/

The laser should not be red, but green light, which is the one for astronomical use. Green light is the one that offers the most brightness with the least power and, therefore, danger, which is why it is the type of laser authorized for this use. It is also a useful accessory in locating objects once it is calibrated with the tube's optics.

The focal ratio of f/6 I think will help you get a less complicated collimation practice than your expected f/4.8, that's a plus for you. The larger the focal ratio, the greater the tolerance for decollimation, or inaccuracy in collimation, and more so for visual purposes. This way it is not necessary to "waste" so much time trying to achieve precise optical alignment (which can sometimes be a lot of resistance, especially with optics lower than f/5). https://stargazerslounge.com/topic/50737-skywatcher-8-f6-dobsonian/

As you say, now the important thing is to try to focus on a distant object (as far away as possible from your location) and verify the mechanical condition of the focuser. Then will come the optical review... and the expansion of your range of eyepieces...

[John]

Would it be possible to get a full refund on the scope and return it on the basis of the description being incorrect and the motor focuser not working as claimed ?

The reason that I'm asking is that there are a number of things about the scope that lead me to believe that it might have had a hard life. The secondary vane support point that @Mandy D mentions is one and also the vanes themselves seem bent from the photo looking down the scope tube you posted.

Given that this is an optical tube from the Skywatcher 200P dobsonian that is being sold without the mount, I can't help wondering how the two became separated - an accident of some sort perhaps ?

If you feel you have to keep it then do try and get a hefty discount on that asking price. I would hesitate even at £100 to be honest with you, given the other issues that will need to be sorted out.

Edited December 6, 2023 by John

[NGC 1502]

If it were me I’d get a full refund if possible.  Then check out our sponsors First Light Optics (link at the top of the page) and purchase a brand new ready to use 8” Dobsonian. Several brands to choose from.

[HaplessWonder]

20 hours ago, Chandra said:

@mandyd has given you excellent advice and instructions... You really don't need the motorized focuser for visual observation, it is a perfectly dispensable element that can be saved. Many years ago I had a Newton 8" f/6 and I can also tell you that it is a great multipurpose tube for astronomical observation, it is surely the most common aperture among amateurs. Honestly, in my opinion, speaking in terms of optics, there is no a big jump between an 8" and a 10", another thing is the question of price, since the seller labeled one thing but the product was another. 

The finder is a Telrad. I've never used one, but those who have are generally very fond of them. This is one of the types of "0 power finder" (another type would be the red dot finders that most small telescopes now carry, for example). There are several threads here about its use, here I leave the link to one of them so you can decide whether to keep it or return it (if possible). https://stargazerslounge.com/topic/128382-how-good-is-a-telrad-finderscope/

The laser should not be red, but green light, which is the one for astronomical use. Green light is the one that offers the most brightness with the least power and, therefore, danger, which is why it is the type of laser authorized for this use. It is also a useful accessory in locating objects once it is calibrated with the tube's optics.

The focal ratio of f/6 I think will help you get a less complicated collimation practice than your expected f/4.8, that's a plus for you. The larger the focal ratio, the greater the tolerance for decollimation, or inaccuracy in collimation, and more so for visual purposes. This way it is not necessary to "waste" so much time trying to achieve precise optical alignment (which can sometimes be a lot of resistance, especially with optics lower than f/5). https://stargazerslounge.com/topic/50737-skywatcher-8-f6-dobsonian/

As you say, now the important thing is to try to focus on a distant object (as far away as possible from your location) and verify the mechanical condition of the focuser. Then will come the optical review... and the expansion of your range of eyepieces...

Fantastic advice, thanks a lot. I am going to look to return it as there are too many questions I have about it. Which means I am back in the market for a good scope that will get me nice close ups to at least see the poles on Mars, Jupiter's spot and maybe it's clouds and ofc Saturn's rings. If I can push it so I could also observe galaxies that would be the perfect scope for me.

 

Thanks

Barry

[HaplessWonder]

19 hours ago, NGC 1502 said:

If it were me I’d get a full refund if possible.  Then check out our sponsors First Light Optics (link at the top of the page) and purchase a brand new ready to use 8” Dobsonian. Several brands to choose from.

Thats what Im looking to do, so far the seller has just quoted a 'sold as seen' so will be fun to get this returned now, I am fine as ebay rules for used state that the item is in good working order, which it doesnt appear to be.

[HaplessWonder]

19 hours ago, John said:

Would it be possible to get a full refund on the scope and return it on the basis of the description being incorrect and the motor focuser not working as claimed ?

The reason that I'm asking is that there are a number of things about the scope that lead me to believe that it might have had a hard life. The secondary vane support point that @Mandy D mentions is one and also the vanes themselves seem bent from the photo looking down the scope tube you posted.

Given that this is an optical tube from the Skywatcher 200P dobsonian that is being sold without the mount, I can't help wondering how the two became separated - an accident of some sort perhaps ?

If you feel you have to keep it then do try and get a hefty discount on that asking price. I would hesitate even at £100 to be honest with you, given the other issues that will need to be sorted out.

About those vanes, I am enclosing clearer pics of the ones Mandy D zeroed in on, to the touch I can feel an actual crimp in that vane as if it has been bent to put a fold in it. What impact does this have?

[HaplessWonder]

21 hours ago, Mandy D said:

@HaplessWonder I paid £200 for my 200P second-hand, complete, but no laser, no motorised focuser, but with the standard finderscope. I would say for the OTA on it's own, £245 is too much. I'd want to pay no more than about £150. I guess you had shipping costs as part of your price, whereas I collected.

OK, to get the focuser working there are two things you may have to do. Remove the motor unit. Next, there is locking screw on the focuser barrel, with a knurled knob. You need to loosen that in order for the focuser drawtube to slide in and out. You can see the locking knob to the left in your third photo.

If it is not focusing, make sure you have the extension piece in the focuser, which appears to be shown fitted in the same photo. Then point the scope at a distant object and rack the focuser in and out. If it still does not focus, start pulling the eyepiece out of the focuser. At some point it should focus. If that fails, remove the extension and try without to get the eyepiece closer in. You'll have to hold the eypiece square by hand as the drawtube has a 2" bore. Mine will easily focus on the church clock a quarter mile up the road. If you are getting a blurry image, this is simply going to be down to the closeness of the object and the position the eyepiece needs to be in. It will almost certainly focus at some point.

EDIT: Can you check the spider vane mounting point as indicated by my pink circling? It might be nothing but it looks damaged to me. It should look like the other 3.

Here is a closer shot of that mounting point you highlighted, I asked another forum user above the same, the vane itself is bent as if folded at one time. 

As for the focus puller, should it be so stiff and hard to move? it's like there is grit or rust gripping or catching it inside.

The wheel with the holes which appears to turn a gear that moves the focuser in and out does work with some force but the motorised unit now longer functions even with a new battery.

[Mandy D]

47 minutes ago, HaplessWonder said:

Here is a closer shot of that mounting point you highlighted, I asked another forum user above the same, the vane itself is bent as if folded at one time. 

As for the focus puller, should it be so stiff and hard to move? it's like there is grit or rust gripping or catching it inside.

The wheel with the holes which appears to turn a gear that moves the focuser in and out does work with some force but the motorised unit now longer functions even with a new battery.

Hmm, that vane is distinctly bent. The pin that holds the outer end in the tensioner is also not properly in place. Someone has been messing around with tht scope. The focuser should run smoothly, taking very little effort to turn the knob; it is a friction drive, so no gears in there.

In light of all these problems, I think you are right to seek a refund and return this. It's a shame, as these are generally such good scopes.

I've attached a photo of mine to show how the spider should look. You can clearly see the fixings at the outer ends.