Color or Mono... The age old question.

[gorann]

18 hours ago, oymd said:

I did stress on QUALITY in the example I gave above. By quality cameras, I meant a high end top quality camera, like a 6200MM or 2600MM. 

Those are rare as hens teeth on the used market, as there probably isn’t a BETTER step up camera than those two in the amateur AP market. Those two examples are usually bought by imagers who have some years of experience in the hobby, and would not go back to just OSC. 
 

I would not count any of the 1600MMs or older CCD mono cameras in the search. I will take an educated guess that almost all those selling a 1600 or older mono CCD camera are probably upgrading to a better mono setup, like the 294MM or 2600MM. 
 

Very rarely you will see a quality high end mono full setup for sale, including camera, FW and filters. Those are usually up for sale by a beginner who enthusiastically got into the hobby, spent a lot upfront, got overwhelmed by the whole process, and either chose to just give up and go back to visual, or go the easier route of an OSC.

 

This reply will be a bit provokative and I know I am in deep water with not much on my shoes, but I have both an ASi 6200MM and an ASI2600MM (athough my specimen is called QHY268M), and three ASI2600MC. Most clear nights the ASI2600MCs are sitting on my scopes. I have not had enough clear nights yet to seriously find out if the mono cameras are doing a better job, but deep inside I doubt it since the ASI2600MC data is just so good and I am now feeling a bit unsure why I bought all those filter wheels and Baader and Astrodon filters.

Edited October 27, 2021 by gorann

[vlaiv]

1 minute ago, gorann said:

I am now feeling a bit unsure why I bought all those filter wheels and Baader and Astrodon filters.

You can always donate those if you don't see much use for them

 

[gorann]

Just now, vlaiv said:

You can always donate those if you don't see much use for them

 

Well, the Astrodons just came to me very cheaply recently and I could not resist. Maybe in a few years.......

[GalaxyGael]

21 hours ago, dmki said:

Then we have that quite a few of the higher end colour sensors each colour pixel is a  2x2 binned under the mask, so the mono version can be run a 4 times the resolution at the cost of well depth and bit resolution. And i guess for the right set of circumstances this could lead to a decent change in image quality.

Yes, which camera is that BTW, as I think there was a report where that could be undone to increase fwc and resolution? 

[dmki]

i was thinking specifically of the 294 camera which use the Sony IMX492 and IMG294 sensors for mono and colour respectively. by default the are supplied bin 2x2, providing 11mp, however the mono version can be un-binned to 47 mp with a corresponding loss of wheel depth and dynamic range. I must admit that ive assumed other sony  sensors based on the same construction would also provide an un-binned mode... and we all know what assumptions can be wrong:).

Another difference between osc and mono, is the rgb filters, which tend to proper data filters with sharp crisp bandpasses are that RGB, whilst those in osc tend to march the crap band passes of human rgb retina dyes. I suspect that there is a reason for osc filters to work this way and its probably something to do with rendering an image which is as close to what we would see in the flesh.

which feeds into that our photos consist of three influences, the data(object reality), a desire to make a thing of beauty, our perception.... what that unique to you visual cortex does to the data as its converts it into sensation. In the case of that latter influence, there is a horizon program that goes into the detail
Horizon Do You See What I See Part 1-4

[vlaiv]

7 minutes ago, dmki said:

I suspect that there is a reason for osc filters to work this way and its probably something to do with rendering an image which is as close to what we would see in the flesh.

I think it has more to do with the fact that it would take seriously complex process to make 10-20 dielectric layers on pixel that is couple of microns by couple of microns.

You simply can't make effective interference filter on top of such small electron - so you need to settle for absorption filter.

[69boss302]

Just as an update, I decided to get the ASI2600MM pro OSC. It seems like it will fit my needs well for now, and if I decide down the road that I need better quality, Ill get the mono and a color wheel. From what Im hearing it should do quite well! Now Im just waiting for my darn ASAIR Plus to come in but who knows when that will be   Once I get that, Ill be good to go and give it a nice test. I probably can now with my laptop setup but here in New England, its getting too cold to sit out there for any extended period of time. So at this point I may just wait until the AA+ comes in.  When I start shooting, Ill report back!

[Stefek]

On 24/10/2021 at 14:23, 69boss302 said:

Thank you, That is great information. Do you have a good filter recommendation for dual band? I see a ton of them out there.

bob

So far I only tried Optolong L-Extreme and the filter does nicely what is made for. You can get reasonable images from light polluted place.  It can't do miracles and blue channel will be affected by moonlight or by strong LED streetlights , but still reasonable images.

Stars color will be messed up though, but that can be handled either with synthetic green  or by simply taking RGB frames for stars .

[69boss302]

Just as a followup Ive been having amazing luck with the 2600 MC Pro OSC.  Last night I went out for a while and took some shots, but when my target went below the horizon I switched to a new one,  The Horsehead Nebula. Well, as it turns out, I got exactly ONE shot out of it before my battery box died so most of the night was wasted. Just for kicks, I processed that single frame in PI in a real hasty and crappy manner just to see what it would come out like.  As luck would have it, a meteor went through it. For a single 180 second shot, Im just amazed how well it came out!   Again its just a really quick processing to see what one frame can do...

 

 

Edited November 30, 2021 by 69boss302