Mount Power Fuse Box

[Gina]

Well, I'm not sure there's anything I can do now until I get a new battery - both my 45AH SLA batteries seem to be useless

[Oddsocks]

Well at least you have eliminated several possible sources of the problem, so what is left?

Poor compatibility between the USB chip set on the laptop and the EQ serial adaptor, does your laptop have a Cardbus or PCMCIA slot that could take a cheap Maplins USB plug-in extender card for a test.

Damaged EQ cable adaptor electronics if there has been an earth leakage problem in the past?

Software error in Windows that is locking up the USB ports or other software running in the background at the same time that is trying to grab the USB port when CdC is using it, do you have a clean Windows install that you can roll back to or an old PC lying about that you can set up with CdC and Ascom etc.

(I know this is not relevant at this time but my Paramount MX used to regularly lose contact with the Sky X when the QSI camera was downloading an image, I found I had to run separate USB cables back to the laptop from the mount and from the camera, could never get it to maintaining contact with the Sky when I used a hub and single USB cable, guess I was exceeding the data transfer capacity of a single USB port)

Which services and programs are seen to be running in Windows when you go to Windows Task Manager and view "Processes", anything showing that is unkown?

Is there anything in Windows error logs that might give a clue?

Possible defect with the EQ8 electronics but I don't really want to go there....

I can keep thinking of possible things to check all day but it is not me who has to verify them all.... ....It is a shame you are so far away otherwise I would have dropped around an old Windows XP laptop I have that is not being used.

William

[Oddsocks]

OK, how about this?

Run the mount and the laptop only on external PSU's but connect an external single wire of about 1.0mm sq between the mount 0V / Chassis and the laptop chassis, you should be able to pick up the chassis connection on the housing used for the external VGA port, this would clean up the USB shielding of any leakage currents flowing between the two PSU's and allow you to test at the correct mount voltage, bit of a long shot really, can't really believe the EQ8 is unable to tolerate 12V?

[Gina]

Thank you William   I'll reply to all that shortly.  ATM I have a 45AH SLA battery with my jump starter in parallel (that was flat too) currently being charged from the Maplin PSU in the scope room plugged into one of the scope room wall sockets.  With the PSU charging the mount lost contact after a couple of minutes.  Guess I ought to charge the laptop battery too

The laptop has SD card slot, two USB (one USB 2 and one USB 3), Ethernet and external display and CD slot.

I have another laptop and a netbook.  The netbook is already set up for astro imaging.  Now... where did i put it?

[Gina]

Just popped out and put the laptop on charge (just as well - the battery indicatoe said 16m remaining).

[Gina]

Well at least you have eliminated several possible sources of the problem, so what is left?

Poor compatibility between the USB chip set on the laptop and the EQ serial adaptor, does your laptop have a Cardbus or PCMCIA slot that could take a cheap Maplins USB plug-in extender card for a test.

Damaged EQ cable adaptor electronics if there has been an earth leakage problem in the past?

Software error in Windows that is locking up the USB ports or other software running in the background at the same time that is trying to grab the USB port when CdC is using it, do you have a clean Windows install that you can roll back to or an old PC lying about that you can set up with CdC and Ascom etc.

(I know this is not relevant at this time but my Paramount MX used to regularly lose contact with the Sky X when the QSI camera was downloading an image, I found I had to run separate USB cables back to the laptop from the mount and from the camera, could never get it to maintaining contact with the Sky when I used a hub and single USB cable, guess I was exceeding the data transfer capacity of a single USB port)

Which services and programs are seen to be running in Windows when you go to Windows Task Manager and view "Processes", anything showing that is unkown?

Is there anything in Windows error logs that might give a clue?

Possible defect with the EQ8 electronics but I don't really want to go there....

I can keep thinking of possible things to check all day but it is not me who has to verify them all.... ....It is a shame you are so far away otherwise I would have dropped around an old Windows XP laptop I have that is not being used.

William

My laptop does not have a Cardbus or PCMCIA slot.  I have a brand new unopened Hitecastro EQ Direct adapter cable I bought from FLO so can try that once I'm sure I don't have damaging leakage currents.

I wondered if there was a problem in Windows myself.  Here's screenshots of Task Manager.  There are a few processes I don't know...

[Gina]

Once batteries are charged I'm going to try the laptop connected directly to the mount with the EQ Dir adapter as below.  Two possible USB sockets to try.  That will eliminate the long USB cable and and PSU problems.  Getting down to the bare minimum now

[Gina]

I don't think low voltage is the problem as the EQ8 spec says 11-16v

Power Requirement  DC11~16V 4A

I found the NEQ6 wouldn't work below 12.5v but never noticed a low voltage problem with the EQ8.  The latter appears to have a much better tolerance.

[Oddsocks]

In the process list the only item that could possibly cause problems on the USB ports is the vsnpstd3.exe which is a "listener" program looking for a Sonix or MSI webcam and waiting for it to be plugged in, might be worth getting rid of that one, you can stop that process in task manger before running the next test, it will restart next time you reboot the PC so if it does make a difference then remove it permanently.

Link for further info: 

http://www.neuber.com/taskmanager/process/vsnpstd3.exe.html

The two suspicious processes in the list are variously described as malware, spyware, key loggers or trojans are; OptProReminder.exe, installed with PC Optimiser Pro, and InternetEnhancer.exe and you should remove these.

InternetEnhancer.exe has many variants and it is not worth trying to link to any particular Google search result as they only apply to a particular variant so I would suggest downloading the free version of Panda Cloud AV, scan the PC with Panda, hopefully it will remove InternetEnhancer.exe for you, then uninstall Panda once done. Panda Cloud AV only works while connected to the internet, it does not keep a full list of virus signatures locally so you have to be on line while scanning.

Link for further info: 

http://pctipsandfixes.blogspot.co.uk/2012/05/remove-pc-optimizer-pro-virus-from-your.html

William.

[Oddsocks]

Actually, having looked a little further it seems that Optimiser Pro Speed Guard does interfere with running programs and it installs itself in a way that makes it difficult to remove.

Found this video of how to remove it from Win 7:

[Gina]

Thank you William   I did have a go at removing Optimiser Pro but couldn't find it - your post explains it.

The laptop battery was up to 75% and the other batteries partly charged.  So I moved the laptop into the scope room near the pier and commected the EQ Dir USB adapter.  Although plugged into the same port win 7 bumped it up one so I had to go into Properties in EQASCOM and set it from com 14 to com 15.  Then the device was recognised and I was able to connect to the mount.  I had disconnected the charging wires from the Maplin PSU so mount was on battery power only.  The battery voltage dropped to 12.4v - well within spec for the EQ8.

A very short time after slewing to the moon with CdC it dropped out again.  So I disconnected stuff and brought the laptop indoors with its PSU.  I'll play with the laptop indoors.  Finished out in the obsy for tonight - it's pouring with rain and the wind's getting up

[Gina]

Actually, having looked a little further it seems that Optimiser Pro Speed Guard does interfere with running programs and it installs itself in a way that makes it difficult to remove.

Found this video of how to remove it from Win 7:

Thanks again   That video is rather poor resolution but I think I can just about make it out

I'll remove everything suspicious and if that doesn't cure it I'll start with a fresh Windows installation, probably on a different computer.  I have several old desktops, on or two with XP on.  The netbook was also running XP.  For a completely fresh install, I think I have an XP CD somewhere.

[Gina]

Had a thought...  I have the NEQ6 set up in the living room and if I brought one of the 13.8v PSUs indoors I could test with a different mount   I don't think I'm going to venture out into the weather tonight though - it can wait until tomorrow

Later...  Just realised I've got my variable bench PSU indoors - 0-20v at up to 5A -  that'll do

[Gina]

Running NEQ6 plus different EQ Direct adapter (different connector on mount).  Laptop on battery power, mount on Maplin bench PSU set to 13.6v, drawing 0.56A with lunar tracking.  It's drifting off target a bit but not having set up PA (other than very approximately) that's no surprise

Been going 7 mins and counting...

Of course with the tripod on the carpet there's no earth leakage

15 minutes and counting...

30 minutes and counting...

[Gina]

Looked again at that video and there are parts I can't make out   Think I need a textual explanation.  It doesn't seem to be stopping the NEQ6 mount from continuing to work though.  This is not necessarily good - doesn't explain the problem with the EQ8.  In fact it creates a suspicion that the EQ8 could be at fault   But it could be the EQ Direct adapter.

Been running an hour now and the power was getting low so I've connected the laptop PSU.  Still going and responding to control.

[Oddsocks]

Since the rogue software is still on the laptop and all is well at the moment then it does rather look like the EQ direct adaptor or the EQ8 board......

I have been perusing the EQMOD website for a while, didn't know they did a Bluetooth version.

The components look fairly inexpensive for the standard RS232 version and I have an unused USB to RS232 adaptor with drivers for Win XP/ Win7, I might have a go at making one up for my old HEQ5 PRO to do some astronomy from the back of the car in the New Forest, I can do so little astronomy from home these days now that the pub opposite my house is open and flood lit till 2 or 3 AM most every day.....

[Gina]

I seem to have removed Optimizer Pro just by using the standard Uninstall facility.  I wonder if I actually have

NEQ6 still running fine from CdC.  At one point when it had drifted off target I used the CdC Slew function and the mount did a meridian flip and settled back on the moon - fine.

[Oddsocks]

I seem to have removed Optimizer Pro just by using the standard Uninstall facility.  I wonder if I actually have

If you haven't it will still show in the running processes tab next time you reboot.

[Gina]

Ah, right.  Maybe I'll try a reboot and see if it comes back.  I think I can probably conclude that the NEQ6 with its own EQ Dir adapter is working alright.  At least it doesn't die within minutes.  I don't see any need to continue this test ATM.

Not much later   Rebooted laptop and Optimizer Pro is not showing in processes   At least that unwanted rubbish seems to be gone

Ran CdC, connected to mount and slewed to moon all fine.  I'll think about what I can do about the EQ8 tomorrow...

[Gina]

I've ordered 6m of 4mm earth cable from ebay - should arrive Tuesday.  I intend to fix any earthing problems

[Gina]

I'm thinking of using the following earthing wiring.  I'm proposing a copper pipe as an earth rod driven into the ground just outside the observatory.  The end of the pipe flattened and drilled for nut and bolt cable connection.  The ground around the observatory is usually damp or wet so I would expect a good earth - definitely far better than any earthing through damp concrete

[Gina]

I'm just wondering whether to connect the 0v line to the USB hub to the earth wire or not.  Would I be creating a troublesome earth loop? Actually there are already earth loops through the USB 0v line and the power 0v.  Perhaps a better idea might be to remove the 0v power and USB lines and connect everything to the 4mm earth/ground/0v cable.  OR have separate power and data grounding?  Diagram coming...

[Gina]

[Gina]

Now I want to sort something out to do today to check out the EQ8 mount.  I think I shall power the EQ8 from my variable bench PSU - that has separate -ve +ve and Gnd terminals so I presume the output is floating.  I can have the laptop beside the pier and plug the EQ Dir adapter into a USB on the laptop.  The laptop battery is now fully charged so should by alright for an hour or two and won't need the mains power.

[Gina]

Hmmm...  Running EQ8 from bench PSU with batteries in parallel, laptop on battery, connected mount with CdC and ASCOM.  Ran for a minute or two and then dropped out

Disconnected PSU and tried again - checking the mount was responding to small manual slew every minute or so.  Ran for 8 minutes then dropped out.  Battery reading 12.3v. 

Summary

1. PSU caused almost immediate problem with O/P voltage 13.8v and battery reading 13.4v, current about an amp with lunar tracking, 1.25 with additional slow slewing.
2. EQ8 stays connected running off battery power above 12.3v.

Conclusions :- There must be noise or leakage with all these PSUs that isn't currently cured by putting a battery across the output and the EQ8 mount seems to have acquired a fault whereby it won't run off 12.3v or less.  Seemed quite happy at 12.4v  (As indicated by the digital A/V meter).

I don't know what to try next.  I'm running the mount with nothing on it except the weight bar so I could take that off and possibly see if I can insulate it from the pier head mounting.  I can just about lift it but don't know about inserting insulation.