Skywatcher 130 vs 130p

[bcsteele]

Schorhr, My main focus (no pun intended) is on the Planets, and perhaps Nebula

As for location, it is town, but I have a very large field at the bottom of my garden, and although I can't get onto that (without a bit of very hard work),

It makes the difference in that that part of the garden is quite dark, and you see a good few stars about.

Though I suspect to get to good views of  some stuff I would have to do that hard work!

As for the EQ mount thing, I have no idea on that - eventually it will come-down to price, what can I get for my money, that will be worthwhile, and do what I want!

However this caught my eye in FLO

http://www.firstlightoptics.com/reflectors/skywatcher-explorer-130p-supatrak-auto.html

???

[tingting44]

ive had the 130p for a while now, i like it for a cheap scope, dont think i could bring myself to get rid of it lol, these are some images i have got with it mate

saturn - 20/02/13 4:58am by tingting44, on Flickr

saturn - 20/02/13 4:50am by tingting44, on Flickr

Jupiter - 06/02/13 - 9:45pm by tingting44, on Flickr

Jupiter - 06/02/13 - 9:11pm by tingting44, on Flickr

Latest stack(4) attempt of M43-M43 (JPEG for WEBSITES) by tingting44, on Flickr

[Schorhr]

Hello bcsteele,

the rule of thumb is, that if you can't see the milkyway, it's not dark ;-)

And if you can see lit windows or street lights, it can cause problems especially for nebulae observations.

About the "SupaTrak";

I have the Nexstar SLT from Celestron, it is comparable regarding the stability. The combination is acceptable.

The SupaTrak does not offer the Goto-functionality. The Skywatcher-mount with GoTo hand-controller or the Celestron Nexstar will start at £170, with GoTo and 130/650 about £280.

The difference between a AltAz Goto-Mount and a EQ-Mount is, that the AltAz mount with tracking will not compensate for the field-rotation. You will always see the target in the center, but if you where to take longer exposures the stars around the object will rotate, smudging.

http://www.weasner.com/etx/astrophotography/astrophotography_types.html <- see last image on page for exampple

http://www.astronomyasylum.com/telescopemountstutorial.html

If you have to carry your telescope a long way, make sure to plan in weight and dimensions.

Often these are underestimated. Especially with additional accessories (maps/books, red light, eyepieces, collimation tools, food, aditional clothing...)

Of course you could always attend a local star party or visit an observatory. Then you can try things first hand, without buying something you may regret. But of course everyone will recommend their own equipment, as you can allready see :-) But that's the good thing about discussions like this. Lot to learn, seeing different arguments and oppinions.

For nebulae, aperture is key. For planets, everything will show nice views, at around 4.5 to 5" aperture it gets interesting, often the seeing conditions are limiting the observations more then the telescope optics.

My main focus (no pun intended)

;-)

Good luck choosing the right telescope!

[Schorhr]

Tingting44: Very nice!

For Bcsteele it might be necessary to point out this is with stacking (adding multiple single frames/photos on the computer), even though it's on the image link description.

[LouisJB]

There's some great advice here.

Also consider the speed of setup. If you're a casual observer you could get put off if every time you think about using it you've a lot of effort and time to get setup and ready.

@schorhr - you can't get prime focus on the standard 130P without something in the path, I'm using a 2x barlow in order to get started. I'd like to move up to something like an 8" astrograph but 1-step at a time, trying to get each bit working methodically before upgrading. I agree with you on the EQ2, it's a compromise. Given you can get a bundle for +£30 over the tabletop heritage I think it's something to learn the ropes on for a beginner. For me, I was going to get a dob originally but then realised I wanted to image. How could I justify spending $$ on GEM mounts without knowing at least how to use one, so for me it was a cheap stepping stone rather than a long term solution. Everyone is different. If  you don't want to image, maybe you'd never consider an GEM at all, in which case a dob could make more sense.

@tingting44 - those are fantastic pictures. I'd be very pleased to start getting images like that - that gives me some hope

[tingting44]

@tingting44 - those are fantastic pictures. I'd be very pleased to start getting images like that - that gives me some hope

thanks not bad considering they were all taking from my garden with an awful lamp post shining at me, just show's what the trusty 130p can do tho

[bcsteele]

Schorhr £280 is above my range, I'm pushing it really with the £217 of the one I linked.

( It took me ages to convince 'She who Rules the House' that I needed £200 )

oh, and on a clear night I do see the old MK - Perhaps not as good as it should be though.

For  I know what you mean.  I lived out in the sticks for a [very] short while a few years back - no lights around at all -  and the MK was almost just a solid band of stars!

Tingting44: Great Pictures, as LouiseJB said.. Gives us ALL hope!

[Schorhr]

The 6" dobsonian will be £199-£219,

the 130p on EQ2 £165,

the Heritage 130p £130-135.

Visually, the the two £130 will show the same thing.

The 6" a tad more, but not that much. But cheap eyepieces perform better in it, it's higher, and rock-solid :-)

If you want to dabble with photography, the EQ will be a way (rocky road ;-) ). Astronomy imaging is more complex then most people think at first.

If visual is all you want, go with the cheapest solution. The extra cash can be useful for accessories (eyepieces, maps/books, red adjustable flashlight, clothing, better finder/telrad/rigel).

BUT: Wait. Don't spend everything at once. You'll see what you'll need after time. Many jump to conclusions, buying eyepiece case kits regretting most purchases afterwards.

Heritage 130p, 13gbp barlow, printed maps, 2gbp red flashlight, DIY collimation cap, and 15gbp 10x50 Lidl or 24gbp 8x60 Bresser binoculars will go a long, long way.

Before you ever need to consider expensive accessories, imaging devices and larger aperture.

Comparison with different apertures

http://clarkvision.com/visastro/m51-apert/

http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=de&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=de&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.binoviewer.at%2Fbeobachtungspraxis%2Fteleskopvergleich_deepsky.htm (translate)

IMHO, under good conditions, 5.1" is closer to 6" then it is to 4". It's a good, portable compromise.

[Beardy30]

I have had a 130 for a while it was a good set up not sure the goto would be any better and I hear the 130 p is bit much of an upgrade. What about the 150 dob thAt would combine simplistic observation with a reasonable spend

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - now Free

[Schorhr]

Agreed, I just mentioned the Goto mount as it's an acceptable combination and makes more sense then the supatrak, but really it's more a wait-to compared to the simplicity of manually moving the telescope.

Plus the goto solution costs more then the larger dobsonian, for visual astronomy, that's a pretty good argument towards the 150p - if it can be moved to a truly dark location. Usually it only appears to us after getting into astronomy and setting up our first telescope how much light pollution is everywhere around us :-)

[bcsteele]

Thanks for that info Schorhr - the one thing that puts me off a DOB (it's silly but I think you'll understand)  is it doesn't look like a real telescope on a little stand like that, I'm old-school (a lot older than you probably think) and a Telescope should be on a Tripod.... lol!

I think I'm Settling toward the 130p, it'll give me a few quid to play with as well.

[tingting44]

Tingting44: Great Pictures, as LouiseJB said.. Gives us ALL hope!

Thanks bud, yes if i can do it anyone can, and i mean that!

a Telescope should be on a Tripod.... lol!

you just made me lol i know where your coming from

[Schorhr]

Oh well, if that is a criteria, I can't help you with that :-)

I know what you mean though. The thing is, that the dobsonian Rockerbox offers a stable mount for little cash, giving you the best solution. Especially for larger telescopes you'd need to spend as much as for the telescope - or more - just for a sturdy eq mount, while the rockerbox costs a couple of quids.

It's up to you in the end.

4.5" or 5" on a STURDY eq mount cost more then 6"-8".

And visually, aperture is the most important.

Under 8" galaxies rarely show any details such as spiral structures or dust lanes. Perhaps a few glimps, smudges. For planets the additional resolution and larger exit pupil at identical magnification helps too.

So most visual observers decide against the cliche tripod and for a better solution.

For 5", its debatable I suppose if you can tollerate the eq2.

But starting with 6", a sturdy mount is a must.

[bcsteele]

Schorhr - I understand what you are getting at.  and your no-doubt right.

it's really just doesn't seem right, however, although I said Leaning towards the 130p - The DOBs is still in the running.!!

[Schorhr]

Sorry for ranting :-)

Here, I'll make it a bit easier...

Portability: 5"

Deepsky: 6-8".

Not negotiable :-D

Just kidding.

[rowan46]

I have tried the p next to a non p and there isn't a lot in it  the p gives a wider brighter image with the same eyepiece but at the same magnification they are much the same.  with larger appartures it makes a difference certainly at 8" it does as I tried a skywatcher 200p next to a visionary 200 and the skywatcher was much better at higher powers on planets

[LouisJB]

I think it's fair to say dobs give the biggest optical bang for your buck, it's because basically you're buying a tube and the simplest mount, almost no mount.

It also depends why you're getting into it, it it's to learn as you go (there's much to learn) then you may get more out of the flimsy EQ for the simple reason you can practice polar alignment, tracking, heck even drift alignment if you were brave.

Be sure the cheaper EQ mounts are what they are, lights and wobbly. You can get by for visuals, for any imaging (other than the Sun and Moon) you need something better. You might get away with a go at planets because stacking software can re-align the pictures, but you'll be limited to how long the object stays in the frame. At high magnifications you'll be amazed how quickly the objects in eyepiece move along!

When it comes to tubes, it's a bit like this (to keep things in perspective) - the difference between a 5" and an 8" and a 10" is insignificant compared to the _massive_ difference any (half-decent) scope has over your eyes. So when considered like that, as long as it has sufficient objective size (for a reflector > 5" and for a refractor > 3") to resolve enough detail to be useful, then as much as anything you'll probably want decent image quality. Cheaper refractors will probably have colour aberrations. Nearly all reflectors have cool down times (some have fans, are made of carbon fibre etc = more expensive) and all will need colminating. So it's all a compromise in some respect. Which also leads to one other thing, accessories!

What ever you get, you're going to need some, allow some budget for that. I think you'd best get a slightly cheaper tube and a pair of binoculars and maybe you might want an eyepiece, a colmiation tool, a book, a torch and so on. Definitely factor that in. Sure you can get them over time, but don't think you'll make the one purchase and be done

Also, if you get into it, it's unlikely to be the last telescope you have too. So better to get something and start using it than wonder for ages (which is what I did and in hindsight getting something and having a play around was really the best way to start working out what is what).

[Special K]

Thanks for that info Schorhr - the one thing that puts me off a DOB (it's silly but I think you'll understand)  is it doesn't look like a real telescope on a little stand like that, I'm old-school (a lot older than you probably think) and a Telescope should be on a Tripod.... lol!

I think I'm Settling toward the 130p, it'll give me a few quid to play with as well.

This is the most convincing comment I hear anyone saying who is considering a new scope: there is budget for the little extras to go with it! Just beware of those little extras that start to get expensive

[Special K]

ive had the 130p for a while now, i like it for a cheap scope, dont think i could bring myself to get rid of it lol, these are some images i have got with it mate

saturn - 20/02/13 4:58am by tingting44, on Flickr

saturn - 20/02/13 4:50am by tingting44, on Flickr

Jupiter - 06/02/13 - 9:45pm by tingting44, on Flickr

Jupiter - 06/02/13 - 9:11pm by tingting44, on Flickr

Latest stack(4) attempt of M43-M43 (JPEG for WEBSITES) by tingting44, on Flickr

Yo TingTing, you've been super busy at that 130P and putting me way to shame!!! Those pictures are great! I'm inspired to give AP a shot with my rig sometime. Been too busy picking my Xmas binocs though

[Special K]

I read somewhere that the the astromaster had a parabolic mirror this was the first link I found when I googled to check I think you will agree they are a respectable telescope sales shophttp://www.teleskop-...n-Teleskop.html and here is the thread where I read it originallyhttp://stargazerslounge.com/topic/133179-celestron-130eq-info/

Here is the link to the Parabolic I was referring to, for what it's worth. Either way, its a great time to buy!!! (enter Debit Card from stage left.....)

[tingting44]

Yo TingTing, you've been super busy at that 130P and putting me way to shame!!! Those pictures are great! I'm inspired to give AP a shot with my rig sometime. Been too busy picking my Xmas binocs though

haha yes i was super busy with the 130p work horse during february not had much use since then realllly.....im well into shooting widefield with just my DSLR at the moment, but when i do go back to the planets it will be very interesting to see how they have changed since my last images above

good luck tho OP, im sure you will love what ever you go for, and get in on this roller coaster of a ride they call AP