A Cunning Plan

[MikeP]

Similar experience to SteveL last night (see the thread on imaging the Cat's Eye) and a similar conclusion that I need an observatory. I have a possible cunning plan but before I run it up the flagpole to SWMBO, I'd like a bit of advice.

The back of our house faces south and slopes gently upwards to the back fence where it meets the neighbours garden and quite tall trees. I have four vegetable patches there, that just about get enough light to grow stuff. I could replace the worst one with a roll off roof shed, but its outlook would be limited to about 90^o only - north, north east and east.

We'll probably move house in the next three years. Also, I have other DIY projects that Mrs MikeP has been patiently waiting for that would have to take precedence, so my question is "is it worth it?". Is such a limited view worth having and for such a limited period?

Mike

[CELESCOPE]

That really is a tricky one Mike, Hmm 3 years and prob a move u say , with that info forgetting the outlook , i would say yes , but now we have to look at what you can see,through the autumn winter period. the main of my imaging is done North north east and east the exception being Orion which for me is in the south east, you need to figure out what is available to you , difficult for us to judge without being there really,

Hmmm ,if it was me i think i would go for the roll off jobbie ,after all 3 years is a long time and hopefully a lot of imaging in comfort, you would just have to pick your times to image is all, keep it low cost, make space for a warm room , Dave centoid has one its just tagged on the back of his Obs only very small just enough to sit in ,but at least he is free from the main obs, that way can keep the pier to a minimum, no overkill, just a straight bolt to floor jobbie as long as the base is around 8 inches thick , can jump up and down beside mine and no image shift. so there ya go Mike ,

START DIGGING EHHEHEHEHEH be up and running by Christmas.

Rog

[centroid]

There is the 'logic' Mike, that 'what goes around, comes around', that is to say that objects that appear in the South, have to rise in the East and set in the West, so they would appear in your bits of the sky at some time.

If you can get to 90 deg in the North, then you can see Polaris, for alignment purposes, and would have no problem with the circum polar stuff.

Your view to the South, is much like my view to the North, which is blocked by trees, albeit I can see Polaris from the obsy.

Is there no chance that your resident 'planning officer', would allow you to site the obsy a little further North in the garden?

I guess the 'bottom line' is that very few if any of us, have a 360 deg view of the sky from our gardens, and there will always be a compromise direction.

So, to answer your question, 'should I, or shouldn't I', IMO the answer is yes you should, because the benefits of having an obsy, far outweigh the visual restrictions that you have.

Apart from the Pier base, the rest you can take with you when you move. In this respect, bolt the pier to the concrete base, as opposed the concreting the Pier in (see my web-site for piccys).

Dave

[michaelmorris]

I concur with Dave (Centroid). Put in an observatory, you won't regret it.

Keep to a metal bolt-on pier and make sure you design your observatory such that it can relatively easily be taken down and re-erected at a different site. (i.e. screws and bolts, no nails or glue). You could use these either 'concrete in' or 'bolt down' fence post anchors to secure the roll off frame uprights, so you even take these with you.

To save time, money, and to save leaving a whole lot of conduit behind when you move you could dispense with permanent underground electrics and simply run a heavy duty extension lead out the observatory whenever you want to do some observing. You could create a plug-in electric system where sockets are installed in the observatory but these all lead (no pun intended) back to a flex with a plug on it. Just plug this into the extension and Robert is your mother's brother. I think this should also get around the need to comply with Specification P (outdoor wiring) of the Building Regs. The disadvantage of this is that you can't have frost protection running when your not using the observatory.

Build an observatory, you know it makes sense!

[The Warthog]

That's exactly how I wired my garden shed, with three lights, and an outlet. I want to put a 30 amp service into my next shed, though. Won't be able to do that with a flex.

[MikeP]

Thanks for the replies. It has now been discussed with the planning officer and (very) tentatively approved. The next stage will be to draw up some designs to check what I have described would not look too ugly. Think I need to incorporate plant pots and hanging baskets and stuff.

Unfortunately Dave, it really is not possible to site it further north. I've just taken my compass and stood roughly where the pier would go - the view extends from about 15^o west of north around to just barely due east. There are some tall pine trees the other side of my house that limit the horizon to about 30 ^o and a lone slender one in my neighbour's garden pretty much due north east that limits it to about 45 ^o. Could hope for a lot better, but it could be worse.

Rog, I don't think Orion will ever be visible because it will be too low in the east and obscured by trees once it is high enough. Good to hear that there are plenty of winter targets in the area that I can see though. There is no way I will even be able to start by Christmas with all the other commitments (and unfinished jobs) that I have - but at least that will ensure the construction won't eat into observing and imaging this winter.

Michael, I like the idea of "a shed with a plug" to connect to an extension lead. It's not really that different to what I do at present. As you say, it will avoid a lot of underground wiring.

I'll start thinking about designs - I will try to keep the quantity of concrete to an absolute minimum. I'm thinking of a blob to bolt the pier to and then as few blobs as possible to support the shed i.e. something similar to the way that decking is supported.

Thanks again

Mike

[The Warthog]

The back of our house faces south and slopes gently upwards to the back fence where it meets the neighbours garden and quite tall trees. I have four vegetable patches there, that just about get enough light to grow stuff. I could replace the worst one with a roll off roof shed, but its outlook would be limited to about 90^o only - north, north east and east.

We'll probably move house in the next three years.

I missed the bit about you moving in the next three years. I'd suggest you hold off on your observatory plans, and choose your next house with a view to improving your sky. Your situation is similar to (but worse than) mine. I have a good spot to put an observatory, if I could, but there are times I have to pick up the scope and move it to see something, because I'm just not willing to wait three hours or two months to have it move into a better position.

I'd pick a house with lower horizons all round if I could, next time out, but I may not have that choice, either.

I'd suggest you wait. A purpose-built observatory isn't a selling feature.

[michaelmorris]

I'm thinking of a blob to bolt the pier to .... i.e. something similar to the way that decking is supported.

I'm afraid you're going to need an awful lot more than 'a blob' to properly support a pier with a C11 on it! To make it worth while I think you should be looking at at least a tonne of concrete. That may sound a lot, but that's only a hole roughly 70cm x 70cm x 80cm deep (conversion factor is approx 2.4 tonnes per cubic metre of concrete). You can hire a cement mixer for a day for a little as £25.

[MikeP]

Michael,

I totally agree with what you sayl. I intended the comment about decking to apply to the foundations for the shed, not the pier. In other words different size blobs.

As The Warthog says, a purpose built observatory is not a selling feature, so if I do go ahead, I would like to be able to dismantle the shed and leave as little sign of its presence as possible. There is nothing I can do about the concrete for the pier other than (say) putting a statue or bird bath on it, but I'd hope to be able to "bury" the other blobs.

Thanks for the concrete conversion factor. A 3 foot by 3 foot by 3 foot hole seems to be the usual suggestion and I've often wondered what that would weigh - using your factor, I'd say its about 1.9 tons - almost double for what doesn't sound like a much bigger hole.

Thanks again for the comments guys.

Mike