suitable webcam advice

[pallas15]

Hya .can any one recommend a reasonable priced web cam suitable for connecting to a 1.25 focuser tube.Maybe one that would need minimum tinkering or an easily available adaptor to work.Also any advice on where i can get really long camera to usb cables made or supplied to connect the outside webcam to my inside laptop.Not looking for anything too expensive ,more of an experiment into photographing through a scope..(150p-200p--imminent purchase of one or the other).Also if I use a moon filter how will this connect with the lenseless barlow and/or webcam...thanks..

[Aenima]

Hello again,

Easy answer is yes, the Xbox live vision webcam - plenty wire, easy to mod (there is a thread with pics) costs a fiver and is a great intro to the whole thing - there is lots of software issues ahead! But yeah, can personally recommend the Xbox cam is a good one for £5 considering the others like spc900nc philips is rare and expensive and with a little effort the xbox does a similar job. Let me know if you'd like to see some pics of my early attempt with it, give you a rough idea.

Astronomy is expensive but a really great hobby, there is a lot to it and a lot to learn.

Regards

Jay

Edit: sorry forgot the webcam nosepiece (ebay £15) which allows perfect fit for scope and filters, and you'll likel;y want a IR block filter too (ebay £15) these are the expensive bits but will attach to any bits of kit you buy later - like a expensive webcam or another scope.

[JamesF]

A modded Xbox Live camera is fairly simple and just needs the nosepiece in addition. It is probably the cheapest and simplest option. It is possible to buy USB extension cables, but I think the maximum reliable length is five metres.

James

[pallas15]

thanks jay and james..priced the stuff on ebay for about £35 squid for cam,filter and adaptor and a usb lead is only a couple more quid not too bad.just gotta check the thread out on how to build and operate the gear....gonna be busy

ANY ONE POINT ME A THE XBOX MOD THREAD..THANX AGAIN...

[Aenima]

Hello pallas,

Cant work out the editor so had to just write the thread name.

xbox live cam mod(Cliff). Its in DIY astronomer forum on here, just do a search.

Its good to hear you found the stuff, the mod is easy and there are a lot of post that explain some of the less easy steps. Massive thread so browse through see what you can find that helps.

One thing I wasnt clear on, when you say usb extension - is it because you'll be using the scope a long way from the laptop? As you probably will have trouble with getting an object centered and focussed. It's fiddly and you'll need the laptop right there with your scpope so you can look at screen then fiddle wityh the scope whilst looking at the screen and so on. The best use of wire for me is a long mains extension lead, the Xbox cam comes with loads of wire bundled with it - a good few metres I believe.

When you get it take a long look at the xbox livecam mod(Cliff) thread before starting, asking questions as you go.

Good luck,

Regards

Aenima

[Aenima]

Hi there,

Glad to hear your getting on with your scope, things do fall into place sooner or later. Even better that your setting circles are working for you (I haven't tried mine yet, want to though.)

I took my 130p out last night for an hour, figured I'd try and image jupiter - something I hadn't yet accomplished - and knew also that you might like to see my 1st attempt with a webcam on Jupiter for future reference. Anyway, bit of fun for me so left my 200p inside and had a session with my "Little one".

I had to admit i'd missed the goto but it's irrelevent here anyways, soz.

The image is small so I might try a stronger barlow or two x2 barlows, but some detail is visible - remember I'm relatively new to this.

It's great you like your new telescope and there a strong poosibilty that you will most likely get hooked - there's a lot to like about stargazing.

Clearskies,

Jay

[pallas15]

Hi there,

Glad to hear your getting on with your scope, things do fall into place sooner or later. Even better that your setting circles are working for you (I haven't tried mine yet, want to though.)

I took my 130p out last night for an hour, figured I'd try and image jupiter - something I hadn't yet accomplished - and knew also that you might like to see my 1st attempt with a webcam on Jupiter for future reference. Anyway, bit of fun for me so left my 200p inside and had a session with my "Little one".

I had to admit i'd missed the goto but it's irrelevent here anyways, soz.

The image is small so I might try a stronger barlow or two x2 barlows, but some detail is visible - remember I'm relatively new to this.

It's great you like your new telescope and there a strong poosibilty that you will most likely get hooked - there's a lot to like about stargazing.

Clearskies,

Jay

nice one matey...got my x box cam on its way...not sure bout modding but ill have a go...cloudy ,hazy one tonight..only picked out alkaid ....oh well tomorrows another night...

[Aenima]

Yes! Tomorrow is another night. Absolutely. Do you like to look at stars for the sake of stars? There is a lot of people interested in wht they call 'splitting doubles' where they locate a double star and try to resolve the light into two seperate points, I saw Albireo first time the other night - had goto find it for me - and it was nice, a blue and slightly bigger red. Not sure if all 'doubles' are as pretty but I'd never even thought to look at 'just' stars before. Something to consider.

Dont worry about the xbox mod its easy, the hardest part is gently killing the led's without damaging the circuit, and keeping the ccd chip clean whilst it's exposed. There's nothing too technical if I managed it, twice in fact! I have a spare in case I ruined the first one.

So dont know if I said, but welcome to SGL and Clearskies.....

Aenima

[Spec-Chum]

I'm interested in the xbox cam for my 200p also. Anyone know if it works ok on ubuntu Linux?

[JamesF]

I got it to work on linux, but I had to hack the UVC driver a bit to do so. Without the hacked driver it's fairly unreliable. Hopefully the driver maintainers will accept my patches back into the development stream, but that remains to be seen.

James

[Spec-Chum]

Typical Linux lol

To be be honest, I do have windows on a partition so I'll just have to dust that off and swallow my pride and use that

[Aenima]

Hello James and co.

Just wanted to say that I use the xbox-cam on vista and it works well with sharpcap, though I do sometimes get problems with colour and tone. Its probably not relevant but the xbox seems to work fine using its basic drivers on normal win programs, but I dont use linux so i'm sorry that I cant be of any use.

Still, good excuse to say Hello to other postee's and fellow webcam imagers - being still very new to the subject.

I did have a good clear night two days ago and captured Jupiter with all four moons in the same frame, no other processing besides stacking. If anyone can improve the image I'd be grateful for the insight regarding your technique whilst doing so.

Yes, it's up-side down. Something I didn't think to correct, Doh.

[pallas15]

Hello James and co.

Just wanted to say that I use the xbox-cam on vista and it works well with sharpcap, though I do sometimes get problems with colour and tone. Its probably not relevant but the xbox seems to work fine using its basic drivers on normal win programs, but I dont use linux so i'm sorry that I cant be of any use.

Still, good excuse to say Hello to other postee's and fellow webcam imagers - being still very new to the subject.

I did have a good clear night two days ago and captured Jupiter with all four moons in the same frame, no other processing besides stacking. If anyone can improve the image I'd be grateful for the insight regarding your technique whilst doing so.

Yes, it's up-side down. Something I didn't think to correct, Doh.

nice pic j..what attachment have you on your cam...having issues with focus at the mo..

[Aenima]

Hi there,

Do you mean the spc-type-adapter nosepiece? This is the black thing joins the cam to the scope via screw-in to where the cam's old lens use to be, it should just be standard 1.25" fits all focusers, with thread that fits the cams thread the other end.

Sometimes the planet is hard to see due to not enough light as unfocused it looks like a faded donut. Its a nightmare mix of experimenting with focus, gain and centering - make sure 1st that your finder is as accurate as you can get it, then when your 10mm (and hopefully x2 barlow) shows planet as centered, take it out carefully and insert camera.. Then theres the whole business of getting the gain high enough to pick up faint light and trying to find that light which may well be too unfocussed to show up. Dont worry if at first you cant get all this to work - I have spent an entire night looking right at Jupiter with my EP but not once could I get it centered on the ccd chip, very frustrating. But when you get that circle/donut on screen STOP, do everything you can with that image and your scope adjusters to keep the image on screen, focussed or not. This way you'll find how to maintain centering on the chip - then you focus it and fine tune the settings, keeping the planet on the chip/screen using the control you used to begin with when you 1st got the image in view.

Occasionally the cam or scope has trouble with not enough reach (either inward, or outward) of the focuser - usually an extension sorts it out - like a tube or EP tube without lens, but for Inward its not as simple but could involve a different barlow - someone with more experience can hopefully fill you in on that one (I think it involves the horror of Math)

But never give up, like I said it will fall into place bit by bit, experiment and practice are needed to progress further.

Good luck with it all,

Regards

Aenima

[Aenima]

Hya .can any one recommend a reasonable priced web cam suitable for connecting to a 1.25 focuser tube.Maybe one that would need minimum tinkering or an easily available adaptor to work.Also any advice on where i can get really long camera to usb cables made or supplied to connect the outside webcam to my inside laptop.Not looking for anything too expensive ,more of an experiment into photographing through a scope..(150p-200p--imminent purchase of one or the other).Also if I use a moon filter how will this connect with the lenseless barlow and/or webcam...thanks..

Also, having re-read this post I thought you may be trying to go back n forth from scope to laptop trying to get your target centered. This would make the job harder than it would be already as you really need to see and fiddle at the same time and place, or it might be too difficult and end up being frustrating andd even put you off from trying it again.

If possible get a mains extension and with the long xbox lead try to get you, your laptop and your scope in the same place as much as you can.

If focus is a big problem you might be needing to collimate your scope, if you dont have a cheshire then put one near the top of future purchases, the newtonians really need to be as collimated as possible, especially for imaging. A good rough idea can be gotten from a milk bottle lid or a cap from the bottom of the ep's that came with the scope - white/almost see-through with a number on it, drill a 1mm hole in dead center to pop over a 1.25" ep tube/or similar to keep your eye centered while looking through the focuser. Its only part of the process but it helps a little. look up astro baby's collimating tutorial or andy's shot glass tutorial, these are good guides for learning

how to collimate.

All the best

Jay

[Aenima]

Some pics to help with the xbox mod

. HTH

The end result:

It fits in the back of barlow, then barlow into telescope. (Barlow is not totally necessary but recommended - ie cam will fit straight in focuser.) :

I find a small teaspoon fits in the crack and given a twist gets back off without damage:

There a 3 v small screws that allow you to remove board from back to gain access to the screws that undo lens housing which are on the back of board:

Once board is free and lens holder unscrewed, remove stock IR glass square, and while the peices are seperated use the opportunity to do the sanding - black lens-holder = take 4-6mm off the hole so the threads reach each other (ie nosepiece to inside black holder) - also take most of the white opening away from the front casing, back to near the colourless ring of plastic, then screw both board and lens-holder back together:

If you haven't already disabled the led's, nows the time - be careful - they are tiny and delicate but all you need is to pop a little hole gently in the glass case of the LED, a bit like putting a tiny hole into a lightbulb breaching it but not breaking it. I use a v small hand drill 1mm or 2mm and gently turn in the same place enough to make a hole but not so's it cracks. Some people have used needle pliers though it still needs great care. This is the hardest part of the mod, get this bit right and the rest will be easy.

To test the cam between led punctures plug in and run sharpcap, the remaining leds will light up, if the cam doesnt respond or show up in sharpcap this is bad news - you may have broke the circuit rather than the LED. WAH........

BUT....

Hopefully, then, the back is ready to be attached again to the front by pushing it so it clicks back in place.

Your eventual cam and the stages of modding it.

GOOD LUCK.

[Aenima]

nice pic j..what attachment have you on your cam...having issues with focus at the mo..

When the mod is done your cam will not focus until properly in the scope as the lens was removed - the scope becomes the lens.

Hope the pics help.

Regards

Jay

[pallas15]

When the mod is done your cam will not focus until properly in the scope as the lens was removed - the scope becomes the lens.

Hope the pics help.

Regards

Jay thanks again mate....just the job...chris..

[JamesF]

Finding focus can be tricky. Usually the webcam will require the focuser to be much further in than for an eyepiece. It helps to see "something" if you push the gain and brightness to full in the capture program. If you do that it is often possible to see a large blurred outline of the target.

James

[Aenima]

Finding focus can be tricky. Usually the webcam will require the focuser to be much further in than for an eyepiece. It helps to see "something" if you push the gain and brightness to full in the capture program. If you do that it is often possible to see a large blurred outline of the target.

James

Yes, good point James. I found that to test the focus out properly a nearby tree or roof isn't far away enough, so even if the chimney focuses your still going to have to re-focus for the moon or a planet. This is when you will work out the placement of the cam in your scope. On my 130p the moon was nearly the limit, I had to focus right up to the scope - very little room left on the inward travel. You'll need a good target to experiment properly.

How are you getting on with it, chris?

Aenima

[Aenima]

Hey man, no worries. I'm seriously happy to help, totally welcome.

Jay

[Spec-Chum]

Just ordered the xbox cam

Anyone tried this? item.mobileweb.ebay.co.uk/viewitem?itemId=230830433408&index=21&nav=SEARCH&nid=92932560125

Or just get the in from FLO?

Also, what ir filter do I need? Complete noob to this lol

[Aenima]

Hi,

It just needs to be an IR blocker filter, a lot of them on ebay are sold as 'webcam' filters or suitable for ... Sometimes they say 'IR/UV blocker' this is pretty much the same kind of thing, but usually an IR block filter will do the job.

Give ebay look.

Regards

Aenima

[JamesF]

That nosepiece looks like it should be fine. Not sure where I got mine. Probably FLO, though I know I picked up one just to avoid the postage on an astroboot order

As Aenima says, you just need an IR block filter (not an IR pass filter . Don't go for anything that "looks" cheap, but they're not that hideously expensive. I have a couple of these:

http://www.365astronomy.com/infrared-ir-cutoff-filter-317mm-125-p-3.html

James

[Spec-Chum]

Cool, gonna take a punt on this one http://item.mobileweb.ebay.co.uk/viewitem?itemId=380426029736&index=0&nav=SEARCH&nid=67547339969

Alan's stuff is usually quality