Issues with eyepieces

[robstopper]

I'm having some problems with physically looking through my eyepieces. The ones I have at the moment have a flat surface, and I struggle to get my eyeball against it streadily enough to get a decent and consistent view. It's like I could do with a rubber surround to the eyepieces such as you get on binoculars, if you follow me? Do these exist?

[benjii]

What EP's do you have?

[robstopper]

10mm and 20mm Plossl's, and a 2x Barlow

[robstopper]

sorry, you probably meant which make.......I have no idea, I'm assuming Skywatcher

they look like these

[ChrisThePuma]

if they are the standard skywatcher ones they have a rubber bit that pulls/folds out to give that rubber surround that you get with binos. you might just not have realised its there?

[robstopper]

nope, deffo no rubber bit on the two I've got.

[LukeSkywatcher]

Those EP's dont look like they have the rubber ring on them. Rob, do you wear glasses or not?.

Ive never seen those EP's before. They look similar to the Kellner design (flat top with no rubber ring).

[robstopper]

Only for driving lol

[John]

I know those eyepieces. They are the older Skywatcher / Helios / Celestron models and quite decent plossls. They are not usually branded though. Finding the right eye position is a matter of practice. The 10mm will need your eye closer to the top of the eyepiece (around 7mm - 8mm away) than the 20mm one.

The rubber eyecups on the later designs can be useful for keeping stray light away from the eyelens of the eyepiece and finding the right position each time but many quality designs (eg: Baader Genuine Orthoscopics) work quite happily without them. I feel that, optically, these older plossls are a little better than the later ones.

[Moonshane]

you are 'suffering' from what is called short eye relief.

this affects some types of eyepiece more than others and plossls are at the 'affected more' end of the scale.

the barlow you have should push out the eye relief somewhat and of course increase magnification which in itself is sometimes good, sometimes bad.

I am not comfortable with plossls less than 15mm but can happily use other eyepiece types to 3mm.

for comfort I feel eye relief of 10mm or more is best and longer (perhaps 15-20mm) if you wear glasses to observe. most eyepiece ads tend to show the eye relief to give a rough idea of comfort. hope this helps a bit.

[LukeSkywatcher]

Only for driving lol

Which basically means that you SHOULD wear them for reading,watching tv,observing etc.

In that case then you will find it impossible to observe with these. For observing while wearing glasses, you really do need EP's with the rubber ring. Even if you decide not to wear glasses while observing then you will still struggle to use these.

Thats my experience with similar style EP's. I do wear glasses but not when observing. I just never got used to it.

Just looking online for those EP's, the closest i got was that they are Celestron Kellner. Not great but they look better then the modern version which really are not good at all.

[robstopper]

I'm shortsighted, and not too badly, so do only need them for driving and cinema - reading, tv, etc is fine without glasses.

Thanks for the advice chaps, now can anyone recommend me some worthwhile EP's to invest in which will suit my requirements?

[LukeSkywatcher]

My favourite EP's are the Vixen NPL:

http://www.firstlightoptics.com/vixen-eyepieces/vixen-npl-eyepieces.html

Top quality at affordable prices.

[robstopper]

very reasonable

[John]

If you need to wear glasses to observe then you may find eyepiece types with longer eye relief than plossls (including the very good Vixen NPL plossls) more comfortable to use.

The BST Explorers and TMB Planetary clones fall into this category as do a number of other designs. They also have twist up rubber eye cups so that the cup can be adjusted to suit both glasses wearers and those who don't.

[robstopper]

Thanks for the info

As for sizes, taken from the sticky on EP's in this section, would this be the sort of thing I'd need?

To summarize, for an f/8 scope, we suggest a kit consisting of 6, 10, 16 and 24mm

Doubt I'd want all that lot in one go, would try the 10mm and 24mm first I think?

[LukeSkywatcher]

If you need to wear glasses to observe then you may find eyepiece types with longer eye relief than plossls (including the very good Vixen NPL plossls) more comfortable to use.

The BST Explorers and TMB Planetary clones fall into this category as do a number of other designs. They also have twist up rubber eye cups so that the cup can be adjusted to suit both glasses wearers and those who don't.

Good point. On the NPL's there is a bit of eye relief compared to no eye relief,but its minimal. My 30mm NPL is the only one i have of the NPL range that has a twist up rubber cup. My 25mm Vixen NLV also has a twist up cup but they are like £140 each and the NPL are just as good (if not better).

[LukeSkywatcher]

Thanks for the info

As for sizes, taken from the sticky on EP's in this section, would this be the sort of thing I'd need?

Doubt I'd want all that lot in one go, would try the 10mm and 24mm first I think?

I think for ANY scope the least you need is a high mag,medium mag and low mag EP. That is basically a 8-9mm,15-20mm and a 30-32mm.

8-9mm (for observing planets,Moon)

15-20 (for observing nebulae,galaxies and DSO in general)

30-32mm (for scanning the night sky while hunting for DSO's)

[John]

I think it was Sir Patrick Moore who likened eyepieces to gears in a car. The car is not much use with 1 gear, 2-3 gears are somewhat more useful and 4 or 5 will get you more or less anywhere.

[LukeSkywatcher]

I think it was Sir Patrick Moore who likened eyepieces to gears in a car. The car is not much use with 1 gear, 2-3 gears are somewhat more useful and 4 or 5 will get you more or less anywhere.

So according to SPM......................lower mag EP's get the job done.

[John]

So according to SPM......................lower mag EP's get the job done.

I think it was having a number of options that he was highlighting

It's probably not an analogy that stands up to much scrutiny though

[robstopper]

If you need to wear glasses to observe then you may find eyepiece types with longer eye relief than plossls (including the very good Vixen NPL plossls) more comfortable to use.

The BST Explorers and TMB Planetary clones fall into this category as do a number of other designs. They also have twist up rubber eye cups so that the cup can be adjusted to suit both glasses wearers and those who don't.

Where is the best place to purchase these from? FLO seems well respected on here, but I can't see them listed on their site.

[benjii]

I think it was Sir Patrick Moore who likened eyepieces to gears in a car. The car is not much use with 1 gear, 2-3 gears are somewhat more useful and 4 or 5 will get you more or less anywhere.

I guess he didn't try taking off in 5th gear then.

[robstopper]

I guess he didn't try taking off in 5th gear then.

Having tried taking off in 3rd gear on my first run at Santa Pod, I don't think that would work lol

Thanks for all the advice everyone, really is much appreciated

[robstopper]

Good point. On the NPL's there is a bit of eye relief compared to no eye relief,but its minimal. My 30mm NPL is the only one i have of the NPL range that has a twist up rubber cup. My 25mm Vixen NLV also has a twist up cup but they are like £140 each and the NPL are just as good (if not better).

Would I be better off then with the BST Explorers and TMB Planetary clones or the NPL's?