PeterStudz

Interesting. I also have a 200p Dob, although my experience is slightly different. I’m in Bortle 7 so can struggle with globular clusters but I really enjoy observing them. Using M13 as an example. To get the best out of it I’ll wait until it’s high in the sky, even if that means waiting until 2am. I’ll also observe for at least an hour, changing eyepieces, using adverted vision, letting my eye relax, making sure I’m well use to the dark. Still, it’ll depend on the night and I’ll need decent transparency. But overall, and this goes against what some have suggested here, I’ll get the best views with a 5mm eyepiece. Then M13 fills the FOV and under good conditions I can see 25-30 stars “winking in and out” over a fuzzy background. A bit like a glitter ball.

Hi Linton, I’ve got some but been a little busy. But will let you know how I get on.

I wonder if alcohol was involved 🤔

Yes, I recently got one of those for £10 via Gumtree. As has been pointed out to me on here already it’s originally an Ikea product which is sadly no longer made. Although being Ikea there must be quite a lot hanging about in people homes. Worth looking secondhand.

@SuburbanMak Good knowledge and information. I know the area around the Drift Inn quite well but hadn’t thought of it as a potential site. Might well check it out. Lepe Beach is another spot that I know well. I had thought about that one before, although wasn’t sure if it was far enough away from the glow of Southampton and the docks.

I just had another look and was going to say the same thing. It’s criminal not to use it as an observing stool There’s one on Gumtree here… https://www.gumtree.com/p/for-sale/ikea-swivel-height-adjustable-wooden-stool/1425995858?utm_campaign=socialbuttons&utm_campaign=socialbuttons&utm_content=app_ios&utm_medium=social&utm_source=email

Search for “artists screw stool”, “painters screw stool”, or “adjustable artists stool”. I got mine secondhand locally for £10 off Gumtree. And it’s in very good condition. I don’t think that the wooden ones are made anyone. I really like it. With the 200p I can quickly adjust it from near horizontal to zenith with some to spare. It also looks good as indoor furniture. In fact when indoors my daughter uses it for painting and drawing at her easel. Keep a look out on places like Gumtree and eBay. I just had a look and there’s one on eBay for £25. Although there’s slight damage (you’re not going to notice that) and it’s collection only from Gravesend. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Solid-Wood-Artists-Stool-Screw-Swivel-Adjustable-Height-3-Legs-Working-Condition-/275227237637?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p2349624.m2548.l6249&mkrid=710-127635-2958-0

It does look more like impact chips rather than corrosion. Although apart from pictures I haven’t seen corrosion on a mirror. There are 6 “chips” in total. All on one side of the mirror. Not sure if something could bounce that many times if dropped. Although an Allen key is obviously bent at right angles so it’s possible that one impact could create two marks. No marks that I can see on the secondary, although when I got it the secondary it was way done the centre bolt towards the primary, so it’s been fiddled with.

Thanks for that. I actually don’t like DIY, eg putting up shelves isn’t for me. But when it’s a toy it’s a different matter! I use to make model aircraft so it probably comes from there. Incidentally, some of the screws and brackets etc came from my late fathers shed. It’s one reason I didn’t fill and paint over the screws on the rocker box. They are my fathers old screws. It’s nice to be reminded that there’s something of him in there!

That’s it… it’s done! Well as good as. Is a Dob ever finished? I might just make and add an EQ platform too. I’ve got so much help and advise via this forum. Spend ages searching for info. It would have been so much harder without this.

Just a few more finishing touches. I like to use a simple RDF with a RACI finder scope. Out of scraps (metal bracket & ply) I made a bracket for a little RDF. Painted and bolted to the RACI bracket. It’s simple, light, tight together and quick to swap from one to the other. I also added an eyecup to the finder. It’s a DK-19 rubber eyecup for NIKON DSLR viewfinder. Tight fit but then it’s better that way. Why oh why these can’t be included, or even offered as an extra, I have no idea. It’s so much more comfortable. But more than that I often, not always, observe wearing glasses. My daughter always does. My glasses cost £220 and for obvious I really don’t want a solid hard tube rubbing up against the lenses.

The next day I flocked the OTA with flocking material from FLO. This was done in 3 sections using 2 rolls. Top and bottom then finally the middle section. I got this method from another forum member - @Spile - thanks for that! I went slowly but it was easier than I expected. And the flocking material wasn’t as sticky as I imagined. I found a head torch useful as looking down the tube is just so dark. After I’d finished I cut holes for the focuser, bolts etc using a very sharp surgical knife. Then finally vacuumed the inside of the tube in order to remove any loose fibres. Hopefully you can see the improvement. For good measure I also flocked the inside of the focuser drawtube. It was only a 5 minute job. I had also planned to give the primary a wash. But it wasn’t that dirty and in the end a chickened out and just gave it a quick rinse. More than it needed anyway. Putting everything back together went well apart from one issue. The night was going be clear and I wanted, if possible and to ease my mind, test the telescope out ASAP. The only issue I had was that the mirror clips weren’t quite tight enough and I spent a good half hour chasing the donut around before it clicked. So out with the primary mirror cell once again. It’s not removing the cell that I find tricky it’s getting it back in again. This time I got it right. Testing the telescope on the moon revealed that all was well. And I love the handle - no more slippery “fish” - every Dob should include at least one handle!

In the middle of January I had some spare time (I took a day off) to strip down the OTA. The plan was to flock the OTA, do the milk bottle mod to the secondary, blacken the edges & back of the secondary, remove the focuser & give it a clean, blacken the draw tube and add a handle to the OTA. I stripped down the OTA the afternoon/night before. I’d already had the secondary assembly out several times before so I could get dimensions for the milk bottle washers etc. Just a year before collimation was some sort of mysterious, frightening dark art. Now I could happily take the mirrors out, fiddle with them, replace everything and collimate without looking up instructions - like riding a bike. The secondary and draw tube were blackened with blackboard paint and left to dry overnight. Milk bottle washers installed, Bobs knobs added. Interestingly I was going to include a metal washer with the milk bottle washers but the gap was too small. Maybe more about that later. I had got a small sample of Black 3.0 paint (blackest and mattest acrylic paint on the planet - apparently) but adhesion is pants. Sneeze on it and it flakes off. I wouldn’t have it anywhere near optics. Once cured the blackboard paint stuck down hard. Amazing how much gunk, dead bits of spider and detritus that there was in the focuser. These telescopes are great in that everything comes apart with ease. Unusual for this day and age. The OTA was now just a metal tube. Scary stuff! Could I get it all back together without screwing up and/or breaking something? I’d got a handle from the ever useful WDS Components. Curved brackets to fit the inside of the OTA made earlier and blacked with blackboard paint. I drilled holes in the OTA using a step drill after drilling a pilot hole. Far easier to do than I thought, the step drill cutting through the thin steel like butter all in one go. If you look down the OTA you can see why I decided to flock the whole OTA. There are some white marks that I just could not remove. Even after cleaning and scrubbing. And the more I cleaned the more shinny the inside of the tube became. What made these white stains I haven’t a clue.

I’ve been meaning to finish writing this up for months but life got in the way, so here goes… I managed to get a second hand Skyliner primary with mirror cell (plus secondary & spider) for £50 from a forum member back at the end of last October. Thanks again @CraigT82! As soon as I received it I couldn’t wait and (going against my advice of being patient) immediately installed it into my mirror cell and OTA. To my surprise I only needed to adjust one primary adjustment screw in order to get it collimated. You can see the state of the old mirror. It’s not just dirt, but also about half a dozen spots with corrosion plus scratches. Hard to get a picture with my phone camera but if you looked at the back light was getting through in these areas. Surprisingly I got decent views of Jupiter and Saturn with this. The secondary is fine and just needed a quick wash in order to remove dust and cobwebs. Quite how it got like this I haven’t a clue. Someone had obviously removed the mirror cell before as it had been forced back incorrectly - there’s a notch in the cell to accommodate the OTA tube seam. It also looked like someone had tried to remove a corrosion spot or two and in the process scratched the surface. I’ve included some pictures of the old and “new” mirror in its cell. Now I also have a spare secondary + spider assemblers, primary + cell. Hmmm… at some time in the future I might try and get the primary recoated and make a compact “folds into a case” travel Dob. How hard can it be?

When I started making my Dob base for a 200p a year ago I did have a look to see if there was anything commercially made in the UK. I couldn’t find anything. And these things really need to be custom made for a particular telescope. It’s not easy to make one that would fit a variety of OTA’s. Even if someone did there would need to be annoying compromises. Of course the whole point of a Dob base is that it could be simply constructed largely from bits and bobs people already have down their sheds. If you don’t have these parts sitting around at home, or can’t pinch them off someone that has, then even just purchasing the parts can add up. I’m not surprised at the price of the Orion Optics examples. Eg - I did buy some quite cheap plywood for mine. I needed two sections of plywood at £18 each. I’ve noticed that these are now £19.90. If I’d added a reasonable lazy susan then this would have cost about £35. That’s about £75 before you’ve even started. Personally I prefer Teflon pads and some sort of Formica or equivalent (which I used) but that’s not much cheaper. Then you add paint, glue, screws, nuts and bolts, washers, rubber feet… You often need to buy bolts in, for example, packs of 10 when you only need one. Fortunately I have a big shed and already had a lot of stuff. If you aren’t careful it can soon add up. And of course time is money so there’s labour. I guess it might be possible to find someone (maybe on this forum) who could make one for you.

Awesome report! I actually prefer spending longer on targets anyway. If something is looking good, at its best or close to, I can spend an hour just observing that one thing. Often you’ll see more as your eyes adjust to what you are looking at. I got this wooden adjustable stool for £10 via Gumtree from a guy in Southampton. Works a charm. I also drilled some holes (what can go wrong?) in the OTA and attached a handle. It’s the best mod I’ve done and wouldn’t be without it - no more slippery “fish”.

I guess it depends on if you find it fun. Personally I would find driving (I don’t like driving) more than 30mins to go to a dark site just for a night of observing all on my own too much like work. But I would if, for example, it also involved camping with a group of friends, family or meeting fellow astronomers. Others might disagree and find it enjoyable. Last year we managed to go to a tiny place in Southern Crete. Bortle 2 and the sky was stunning. But it was all last minute, I had no idea what to expect and the moon was around for most of the time. Although I did take binoculars. We are going back there this year for a holiday. Now I’ve made sure we are going when the moon will be out of the way most of the time, I know what to expect and I’ll do some planning. Might even pack a travel telescope. However, I’m not going there because it’s dark. I’m going there because it’s a holiday with family plus friends, my wife likes the beach and my daughter likes it there too. Incidentally, you can get a direct ferry to a small island not far away thats Bortle 1. But I doubt I’ll bother doing that unless I can get my whole family and friends to go along too - doubtful as there’s not much there. The mention of M44 reminds me. My back garden in Southampton is Bortle 7, although last yr ClearOutside had it as Bortle 8. Bortle 7 is probably more accurate. However, this time last year there were about 3 nights in a row when I could see M44 naked eye. And my eyes aren’t great. Some nights, even with light pollution, are better than others. I do find observing from my own garden fun. It’s a bit of…”wow… I can actually see that from my house”.

Went out with my 10 yr old daughter in order to check out a darker site about 30mins drive. To keep things simple I just took our 8x42 binoculars. If anyone knows the area it’s Bolderwood Deer Sanctuary in the New Forest. Supposed to be Bortle 4 compared to my garden in Southampton which is Bortle 7. Although the gate is locked at night there is access to the top of the track and an adjacent accessible open area. Got there at about 9:45pm. It was cold (below freezing) but hardly any wind. One issue, even after 10pm and even though it’s relatively remote, was the number of cars going past. Roughly one every 3-4 mins, which made it impossible to get truly dark adapted. Still, the sky was obviously far darker than home, but as my daughter pointed out, “it’s not Crete”. You could, after sometime in the dark, just make out the Milky Way, although of course it’s not in a great position at the moment. Did a quick tour with the binoculars and just scanning the sky. Mainly old favourites like the Pleiades, Beehive, Orion, Hyades…. There was far more going on around Orion’s sword than we can see at home. I managed to just be able to see M81 & M82 (which I can’t see in the binoculars at home), although Alice couldn’t make them out. M3 looked brighter too. We also spotted a couple of shooting stars. Definitely possible to take the Dob there, although car headlights would be annoying. And it was obvious that Alice wasn’t comfortable being there just with me. If there was one more person/astronomer(s) it would have been fine. Because of that we didn’t stay too long. Camping in an official campsite would probably be a better option. I also know the head chef at one of the New Forest hotels, but of course you’ve got the hotel lights. Maybe preferable to car headlights. Took a quick snap of Orion with my iPhone at the beginning using the Nocturne app. Not convinced by it but worth experimenting. Interestingly a car drove past with full beam while the app was in the process of capturing the picture. Somehow it’s removed it. All in all worth the effort, yet another late night but better than being stuck indoors. The hoodie that Alice is wearing is great. Warm, fake fur lined and with a large horizontal pocket that’s handy for eyepieces, caps, various bits and bobs. I have an adult version too. Of hand I can’t remember where it’s from as my wife bought them. But if anyone is interested I can find out.

I agree. I have been looking at another pair in the last few days. Alice also likes bird and wildlife spotting so it would be a win all round. And thanks for the nice comments!

I agree with what you say about “best way to get them engaged”. Camping somewhere dark/darker is a must. I thought about doing that last year, but COVID and other things got in the way. Alice does like the outdoors and camping anyway so it wouldn’t be difficult. From a past job I do know Dorset quite well so that’s a possibility. I guess the issue in the UK is going somewhere and finding it’s cloudy, but even then it wouldn’t be a total loss. The New Forest is close to me and at least that’s a bit darker - around Bortle 4. In fact we checked a possible Darker site about a 25mins drive from me on Saturday night. Might write that one up tomorrow. Camping there would be easy although the campsites can get booked up quickly. Last August we did go to Southern Crete. The location is Bortle 2. It was all a bit last minute so little planning. We were also there during a full moon period but had a couple of days at the end without the moon. Then the sky was stunning and there every night was clear. At that time of year you are unlucky if you see a cloud. We are going back this year, again in August, for two weeks. But this time I’ve made sure it’s during the new moon. There’s also a tiny island called Gavdos with a direct ferry link near where we are staying. Apparently it’s Bortle 1 and the southern most part of Europe. However, I have a feeling I/we won’t get a pass to go there for a night!

Thanks Dave. Should do more but often time is against me. I do enjoy reading other peoples. The gaming, it’s annoying, it is something we suffer with too. I think all kids do it these days. But with astronomy she definitely has an interest, although impossible to say if it’ll last. It’s the excuse I had for getting into this. Although as a boy my parents bought me a cheap reflector, I sadly got no further. Until now that is. And I’d completely forgotten how much I enjoyed it. My wife on the other hand has no interest what so ever. Things like the cold, short attention spans and equipment (especially if it’s also new to you) work against kids. One thing I learnt was to try and make it an event, with the telescope just part of it. Eg I thought that summer, due to lack of darkness, would be disappointing for us both. But I was completely wrong. What I didn’t realise was how much she’d be into planets, particularly Jupiter and Saturn. As soon they got high enough for our garden (about mid-June) it was every opportunity. She enjoys camping, so we’d camp out in the garden (no tent), look for shooting stars, sleep, wake up (then it was about 2am), view Jupiter and Saturn until the sun came up. The dawn chorus, foxes jumping our fence, hedgehogs going off to sleep added to the event. It was the first time she’d heard the dawn chorus too. Most of this was in the school holidays so she could lie in. For me I had to work and was often knackered! A while back Alice did a tour of her potential new school. Unusually they do a GCSE in astronomy course there too. When one of the science teaches found out that she’d used a telescope to see Jupiter/Saturn he asked her a few questions. Eg… “Have you seen Jupiter’s moons?”; “Yes and shadow transits”. “Did you see any bands on Jupiter?; Yes and the Great Red Spot”. “Have you seen Saturns ring?; “Yes and the Cassini Division”. I stayed silent. But I could tell from his face it was “what have we got here?” Quite amusing!

Had a 3.5-ish hours session last night from my back garden in Southampton. Bortle 7, 8x42 binoculars, Skywatcher Skyliner 200p Dob. Seeing decent, transparency average. Suffered a little from thin high cloud, that came and went, especially towards the end. Temperature 1C to -1.5C, wind - light breeze. Not a whole lot of targets, but I like to take my time. Started off using the binoculars as the Dob cooled. Also giving my 10 yr daughter a little tour of the constellations. At the same time jogging my own memory of some star names which I still struggled with. It would be easy if they were called names like “Fred”, “Sid”, “Poppy”, “Vicky”. Visited old favourites like the Pleiades and Hyades which to me look their best in binoculars anyway. Also the Beehive which is a little harder to locate. Orion too which is rapidly sinking to the horizon. Interesting how Alice can easily star hop via simple instructions from me. Far, Far easier than using a telescope. Although practically it would be better with a couple of binoculars, swapping one pair back and forth is a bit of a faff. I practiced a few star hops using the binoculars too, before using the Dob, although on that I was also getting the hang of (third time I’ve used it) the PushTo feature in PS Align Pro. Works really well and I should do a little write up. M37, M36, M39 started off with these star clusters in Auriga using the Dob and 32mm 2inch PanaView. M37 is my favourite cluster and looks great in the 2inch. Looks like what I imagined a globular cluster to look like before I’d seen a globular. Mind, I have seen these better. Alice seems to like them too. Swapping between a 2 & 1.25 inch is a bit of a faff but I find it convenient to have the 1.25 inch that I’m next likely to use ready locked into the 2-1.25 adapter. M44, beehive cluster. Obviously much brighter than the above but I prefer M37 & the Auriga clusters in the Dob as they are surrounded by a good amount of black space. My daughter does prefer the beehive. Alice then went back inside in the dark to “play”. Told her that se he could go to bed but she wanted to stay up. It wasn’t a school night. M81 & M82 next up. Easy to see as two smudges. Again I’ve seen these better, with a little detail, when transparency was better. But these are the only two galaxies that I can see from my back garden. Still, spent some time observing and changing eyepieces. Called Alice put to have a look. She wasn’t that impressed! Then ruined all night vision by having a break - toasting marshmallows and drinking hot chocolate. M3, M5 and M13. I do like globular clusters. First up M3 which was now at a good height. I could just make out a sprinkling of stars using a 12mm and above. Then M13 which was now at a height that was doable. I hadn’t seen this since last year. A good sprinkling of stars in and around the core using the 12mm. A 5mm eyepiece filled the VOF but can be getting on for a “glitter ball” at this power even in my sky. Got Alice out from our dark house to have a look. Both spent a bit of time on it and watched as the view improved as it slowly gained height. Alice was getting cold now despite being well wrapped up but it’s difficult keeping children still, outside in the cold, so she called it a night. I finished off with M5 which by now was possible. Again, hadn’t seen that since last year. Could just make out a few stars in and around the fuzzy ball by it was rather low. Finally packing up just after 1am. Had a bit of a lie in! Must go and check some darker sites that aren’t too far from me. On a practical note. Kids do find a 2inch eyepiece easier to use. Looking down an eyepiece is a skill that we can take for-granted.

Managed a quick session this afternoon between the clouds and snow showers. Literally had to grab everything back inside as it started snowing. There’s a lot going on now. iPhone single shot doesn’t do it justice although conditions not ideal. iPhone 12 single shot hand held, standard camera app, Skywatcher Skyhawk 1145p on EQ1 plus cheap motor drive, BST StarGuider 12mm.

That’s what I do for M44. I have a cheap red dot finder and 9x50 RACI finderscope on my Dob. I’m in Bortle 7. Another example is M3. To find that I point the red dot as close to half way between Arcturus & Cor Caroli, the only two stars that I can see naked eye from my garden that are anywhere near M3. It’s quite a big gap. Then look in my RACI finderscope. Most of the time I can see M3 as a faint fuzzy patch of light somewhere in the finderscope. If it’s not there I try again with the red dot. At most it’ll take me 3 attempts but 50% of the time I get it first go.

@Stu I like those! I’ve done a little experimenting with electronic sketches too. I do have an iPad plus Pencil and what I tried doing was drawing over a smartphone image of a DSO (I used one I’d taken of the Orion Nebula) using a very basic/rubbish pencil sketch I’d taken at the eyepiece for reference. The original image does mean I can get the stars in the exactly the right place. Will see how it goes.