johnturley

Early last night (around 5pm), and before it clouded over, I looked at Jupiter for the first time with both the Tak 100 DZ and the ES 127 Refractor mounted on the AZ-EQ5 mount in AZ mode. I spent most of the time trying to get the two scopes, and their finders, aligned with each other, the secondary saddle on the AZ-EQ5 does have a fine adjustment in altitude, but not in azimuth, so the best I could achieve was the two scopes pointing within about a degree of each other (With my 14in Newtonian @Peter Drewmanufactured a device which enables a piggybacked scope to be exactly aligned with the main telescope).

Viewing conditions were not that good, which limited the optimum magnification to around 120x, plus the tracking on the AZ-EQ5 is not very good in AZ mode. At first I thought that the ES 127 had the advantage, delivering what I though was a brighter and more contrasty view, but this may have been due to the fact that I had put the ES127 out first and had cooled more, as the view through the 100DZ subsequently improved such that it was rivalling or possibly exceeding that through the ES 127.  I intend to carry out further comparisons including the moon in particular at the next couple of lunations.

As mentioned in another thread, I find it difficult to achieve sharp focus with the stock focuser on the Tak, and I intend to add on a high quality prism diagonal (Tak or Baader T2), and either a Micro Focuser or Baader Helical Focuser. 

Regardless of which scope performs best however, was the I find the 4kg Tak a doddle to carry out compared to the 9kg (with tube rings and diagonal) ES 127, which having had back problems, is one of the main reasons I decided to purchase the Tak. I may in the future also swap the AZ-EQ5 mount for something lighter to carry the Tak, such as the Skywatcher Star Adventurer GTi.

1 hour ago, dazza1639 said:

But as they are only in Sheffield its not too far for me to drop off & collect.

Just off the M1 near Junction 31. 

16 minutes ago, doublevodka said:

Maybe this recent video will help? To my eye the smaller scope has the advantage, but then it is a Tak...

 

I agree, based on the video files the advantage does seem to be with the Tak, would be interested to know how they compared visually.

Over the next few weeks (weather permitting), I hope to be able to do a few visual comparisons, on the Moon and Jupiter in particular, between my recently acquired Tak 100 DZ, and my ES 127 Refractor. I have rigged up my AZ-EQ5 mount in AZ mode so that both scopes can be mounted at the same time, making it easier to do the comparisons.

John 

I kept a look out whilst observing Jupiter at around 7pm last night, but didn't see a single meteor.

Unfortunately the weather forecast is not so good for tonight, expected to cloud over at around 5pm.

John 

4 minutes ago, Froeng said:

Has anyone seen any Andromedids tonight?

https://britastro.org/section_news_item/the-return-of-a-lost-meteor-shower

Looked up for a few minutes while I was observing Jupiter, but didn't spot anything, apparently they are only expecting at best a ZHR of around 200 meteors per hour (about twice the rate of the Perseids and the Geminids), not the meteor storm that some were predicting. 

John

Had an excellent view of the end of the Io shadow transit, conditions were not as steady as late last night, but not bad, although the Esprit 150 was giving a slightly better view than the 14in Newtonian. I was fortunate in so much that it didn't cloud over until the end of the transit.

John 

On 01/12/2023 at 16:50, PeterC65 said:

I've had quite a splurge recently which I'm blaming on the FLO Black Friday sale.

I've been using a Sky-Watcher SynScan AZ GOTO mount since I started observing in 2020. It's served me well but the 5kg payload limit has restricted what scopes I can use so I've been mulling over something beefier for a long time. This AZ-EQ5 was on offer after having its photo taken and the wife said "just buy it" so I did.

It's much more sturdy than the previous mount and can carry two proper scope. When I do EAA I've been enjoying having the FMA135 ride piggyback on a larger scope to give me both wide and narrow field images and this new mount will allow me to do that with any two of my scopes. I'm hoping it will also widen the possibilities for visual observing too, with two different scopes to use.

Having bought the mount, I then started thinking about what bigger aperture scopes it might carry, and then an Explorer 200PDS came up on offer. So that's now sitting on the new mount.

The AZ-EQ5 has its main saddle on the right as you look from the eyepiece end of the scope, so that's the side where the Explorer 200PDS is fitted, meaning the scope is upside down, with the finder shoe below the focuser. I have turned the focuser through 180 degrees so that I can use the fine focus with my right hand, but the finder is less accessible than I would like.

I've tried the mount briefly in EQ mode and as I expected that puts the Newtonian into an "interesting" position. Most photos of Newtonians on EQ mounts show then pointing towards Polaris, so with the saddle flat, side to side, and pointing upwards, front to back, with the focuser rotated to the left and the finder just above it. For me, observing the south and east as I do, the EQ mount also turns the Newtonian upside down.

Neither the mount nor the scope have seen first light yet as we have visitors and I still need to check the collimation and make a power cable harness to allow me to connect the (also new) Nevada power supply. The battery on the mount should be OK for visual sessions but is not powerful enough for the EAA kit and the dew heaters that I seem to be needing for the longer EAA sessions.

 

I have an AZ-EQ5 which I previously used for my ES 127 Refractor, and will in future be using for my recently acquired Tak 100 DZ, I've never bothered to go through any of the alignment procedures, in EQ mode I've simply set the angle to my latitude (53 degrees), and pointed the mount in the direction of Polaris, and found that objects (planets in my case) will stop in the field of view at medium-high power for 10-15 minutes, which is all I require for visual.

I'm currently in the process of carrying out a detailed comparison between the ES 127 and the 100 DZ, before I probably sell the former, so have set the mount up in AZ mode so I can mount both scopes at the same time. However I'm finding that it doesn't track the same in AZ mode, in fact I think the motor is only tracking in azimuth . I would be interested to hear how you get on with the mount, and whether you can get it to track in both altitude and azimuth when in AZ mode.

John 

1 hour ago, Mutley said:

With my EQ6 there is an option under the utility menu to display actual motor position rather than RA/Dec or alt/az. If you also have this option on the az-eq5, it should give you an idea of what the mount is doing.

It's under Utility -> Show Position -> AX1/AX2 option 

(Assuming you're using a handset )

Yes, the AZ-EQ5 does have this function, though not sure whether it will help with the tracking.

John 

3 hours ago, Franklin said:

Brrr.... Bitterly cold last night, out around midnight for only an hour. Still experimenting with the Svbony 3-8 zoom and the target was of course the Moon. I thought I'd try something a little more scientific😁, yeah right! and finally found a use for my Vixen flip-mirror diagonal, with the tripod extended higher than usual I was able to make instant comparisons between eyepieces by flipping between diagonal and straight through viewing. I alternated the positions as the straight through view holds an unfair advantage. I compared the 3-8 zoom on the 6mm, 4mm and 1/2 way between 3 and 4mm settings with my SLV 6mm, SLV 4mm and the HR 3.4mm eyepieces. Magnification used was 104x, 156x and 183x, all in the SD81S. The seeing was quite still last night and there was none of that high, hazy cloud around either, the conditions were good, apart from the cold. Firstly, the fov in the zoom is a bit wider than the SLV's and considerably more than the HR with it's "orthoscopic" sized 42deg. The view of the Luna terminator was etched, crisp dark shadows offering excellent relief, revealing features with high contrast, the SLV 6mm and zoom @6mm performed equally, I could see no difference. Upping the power with the SLV 4mm and the zoom @4mm, to my eye I could not see a noticeable difference between the image presented. This 156x power is taking the SD81S to around it's limits really with an exit pupil of 0.5mm and I could see a hint of CA appearing off-axis in the shadows of Luna craters but this was not noticeable in the straight through view, alternating SLV with zoom confirmed that this hint of CA must be coming from scatter from the mirror diagonal. Still, the views through both were very good and without noticeable difference. Finally I set the zoom about half-way between 3mm and 4mm and compared that to the HR3.4 giving a magnification of 183x and an exit pupil of 0.44mm. This is the point where things became interesting because although the Svbony held up very well and presented an image that was still useable, despite the slight over-power, the zoom image definitely had become softer. Whereas the HR3.4 presented an image that remained crisp and with the same high contrast that the others at lower power revealed. I think that if I'd been using my larger refractor this difference would have been less noticeable and that's something I will have to try at a later date but from doing this I've seen for myself that a "budget", "made in China" zoom can perform on a pretty much equal standing with more expensive "made in Japan" eyepieces. The better performance of the HR is obviously due to its more sophisticated design regards control and suppression of stray light, it's just a shame they can't design an eyepiece that suppresses floaters in the observers eye! An enjoyable hour despite the cold and the only conclusion I can draw is that the view through all eyepieces was very good indeed but the Svbony zoom cost £75 new and the three Vixen eyepieces set me back £400 used.

edit. just realised I've posted this in the "What did you see last night" thread and it's more of an eyepiece test post however, last night I saw the Moon😁.

I did a comparison a few years ago between a 4mm Vixen SLV and a 3-6mm Nagler Zoom at 4mm on the moon, there wasn't much difference between the sharpness and contrast of the two eyepieces, but I preferred the significantly wider field of the Nagler Zoom, although in theory they have the same APFOV. I subsequently decided to sell the SLV, partly because there wasn't enough room in my main eyepiece case for both.

John 

Had one of my best recent views of Jupiter between 9 and 10 pm last night, and was one of the relatively rare occasions when I could see more detail on the Jovian disc through the 14in Newtonian than the Esprit 150, the Great Red Spot being clearly visible through both instruments. My Neodymium filter helped with the view through the 14in, in particular reducing the glare from the very bright disc, which tends to mask out some of the surface detail. I really should have attempted some imaging with my ZWO ASI 462 through the 14in, but it was that bl**dy cold at -3 degrees, plus it started to cloud over at 10 pm. 

I was also able to compare the view with that through the recently acquired Tak 100 DZ, which put on quite a respectable display, and the GRS could just be made out, although to be honest it was some way behind the other instruments. However the difficulty in achieving precise focus with the standard Tak focuser put it at a disadvantage, and I'm going to get either a micro focuser (Tak or More Blue), or a Baader Helical Eyepiece focuser.

I've also rigged up my Skywatcher AZ-EQ5 mount in AZ mode so that I can mount both my Tak 100DZ, and my ES 127 simultaneously, and do a more detailed comparison between these two instruments. I am however finding that the tracking with the AZ-EQ5 is very poor in AZ mode, and I suspect that it is only moving the scope in Azimuth, unlike the Celestron CPC mounts, is anybody familiar with this mount.

John 

15 minutes ago, Stu said:

My view would be you’ve got a top notch scope, so remove any doubt about limiting factors and get the Zeiss T2. I’ve not compared with a standard version either but it just means I know there’s no issue with my diagonal.

Noted, although the cost of the T2 Zeiss Prism (£198), plus 2in Nosepiece (£30) and 1.25in to T2 Helical focuser (£40) would come to a total of £268, more than the £247 for the MEP3 Micro Edge Focuser.

John 

13 minutes ago, John said:

According to Baader the T2 Zeiss prism diagonal has a clear aperture of 35mm.

The non-Zeiss Baader T2 prism diagonal has a clear aperture of around 32mm I think.

 

 

Do you think that there is much difference in quality between the T2 Zeiss prism diagonal, and the non- Zeiss version apart from the different size. As mentioned, I was thinking of getting the latter with a built in 1.25in helical focuser, as an alternative to fitting a MEF3 Micro Edge Focuser. 

Note: I do have a Baader 2in Dielectric Diagonal I can use for low power wide field views, where focusing is not so critical.#

John 

1 hour ago, Mr Spock said:

I'm currently waiting for a Baader Zeiss T2 prism to arrive (should be here this week). It's enough with the 2" fitting to accommodate my 30mm UFF. That will replace completely my Baader 2" dielectric and Tak 1.25" prism. Makes sense just to have one quality diagonal.

Agree, presumably you also need to get a T2 to 2in eyepiece holder, and that this doesn't cause any vignetting with the 30mm UFF (which I also have), and which I think has a field stop of about 36mm. 

P.S. Just been looking on FLO's website again, and noticed that there are actually two different T2 Diagonals, one type, including the version with the built in helical focuser, has just a 1.25in prism, the other (which I assume is what you have on order) has a larger (I assume about 42mm prism), but you have to buy the nosepiece and eyepiece holder separate. 

Baader T-2 Prism Star-Diagonal | First Light Optics

This latter version  Baader T-2/90° diagonal features a prism manufactured to Zeiss specification from BaK4 glass, multi-coated, inside a solid metal case, and I assume can be used without vignetting with the 32mm UFF. Am I right in thinking that this has a better quality prism , and will be more comparable with the Tak Prism Diagonal quality wise, although of course the latter only has a 1.25 prism.

John 

On 26/11/2023 at 16:15, Franklin said:

The adjustment grubscrews are on the top of the focuser on both Vixen and Takahashi scopes. Older Vixen scopes in the hammered green livery had side adjusted focusers back in the early 90's. The DZ has two adjustment grubscrews either side of the lock-knob.

 

Managed to slacken off the two grubscrews shown above, I needed to use a bit of nail varnish remover and WD40 to remove the glue and get the Allen key to fit in .The focusing mechanism now moves a bit more freely, I didn't however access the 3rd grubscrew that @Mr Spock mentioned, as I gather you have to unscrew the whole focuser mechanism to access this, which I didn't really want to do. Incidentally if anybody wanted to know, its a 1.5 mm Allen key that fits these grubscrews.  

I had the opposite problem with my Esprit 150, the focusing mechanism was too slack and needed tightening up, I had problems with the focuser racking out on its own when viewing objects at high elevation, and in particular using 2in eyepieces. It was also a bit of a problem trying to find out how to do this, as like with the 100DZ, there were no instructions regarding how to do this in the manual that came with the scope. 

1 hour ago, JeremyS said:

I use an MEF-3 on two of my Taks (FC 100DZ and TSA 120). Not that I need to, but because I can 😊.

More seriously tho, I find the greatest benefit when using an unpowered mount. In such situations, the lighter touch needed with  the MEF-3 is less likely to impart vibration of the whole setup 

That's was the problem when I tried to view Jupiter for the first time through my 100 DZ, turning the focusing knob imparted vibrations to the setup making it difficult to try to achieve correct focus. Viewing conditions however weren't very good at the time, and it probably didn't help with the mount and tripod being place on decking, although I didn't find the latter a problem when I had my CPC 9.25. 

At the moment trying to decide between the Baader Focusing Eyepiece Holder (and T2 Prism Diagonal), the Tak MEF3 Micro Edge Focuser, or the More Blue version of the latter.

John 

1 hour ago, mikeDnight said:

Here's my micro focuser. Its very precise and has no spongey feeling to it. Although its helical in design it can even be used with binoviewers, as the movement needed is slight and makes negligible difference to the angle of the viewer. I used this baader helical focuser with the 1.6mm Vixen HR plus 2X Barlow on my DZ. Simply awesome! And as cheap as chips - almost!!

 

That's interesting, as you say quite cheap at just £40 from FLO, I'll give that idea some thought, but it looks like I would also need to purchase a 'Baader T' Prism Diagonal (£90), plus a 2in Nosepiece (£30), but you can buy the two combined for £117, and FLO currently have this in stock (unlike the Tak MEF3 Micro Edge Focuser) , and would work out about half the price of Tak MEF3, and avoid the fiddly job of fitting one of these or the More Blue version. I was also thinking of asking Rother Valley Optics (from whom I bought the 100 DZ) to fit an MEF3 if I bought one from them, don't know whether they would charge extra for fitting.

Baader T-2 90° Prism Star-Diagonal with Focusing Eyepiece Holder & 1.25" Nosepiece | First Light Optics

This would mean however that I would need to swap diagonals to use 2in eyepieces (I currently have a spare Baader Click Lock Dielectric Diagonal), but I probably won't use the 100 DZ much with 2in eyepieces, as my Esprit 150 is probably better suited to low power wide field views. I was however thinking of getting a Tak 1.25 Prism Diagonal anyway, as I think that @Mr Spocksaid this noticeably improved the visibility of the Jovian Cloud Belts over the Baader 2in Dielectric Diagonal. I don't know whether the Baader T2 Prism Diagonal would be as good, but I do know that several observers think quite highly of this diagonal.

John 

2 hours ago, mikeDnight said:

 

 Sometimes I think the best way to look at any Tak purchase, is that you're paying for the optics. Tak throw the tube and focuser in as a bonus.

Sounds a bit like the early (pre-Starfire) Astro Physics Refractors, which had very basic focusers.

John 

1 hour ago, The60mmKid said:

Has anyone used a Baader Steeltrack focuser with a Tak? They're such darn good focusers (I had the Newtonian version), and they're priced competitively with the Tak fine focusers.

I fitted one to my 14in  Newtonian, replacing the one supplied with the scope by Astro Systems (Luton). 

I agree, its much smoother than the focusers on my Esprit 150, ES 127, and Tak 100 DZ, although it does have a short distance of travel of only 40mm, but then you are limited on a Newtonian, unlike a Refractor. In addition with a Newtonian the weight of a heavy eyepiece is more pushing downwards on the focuser mechanism, rather than pulling outwards with a Refractor.  

John 

25 minutes ago, Franklin said:

The adjustment grubscrews are on the top of the focuser on both Vixen and Takahashi scopes. Older Vixen scopes in the hammered green livery had side adjusted focusers back in the early 90's. The DZ has two adjustment grubscrews either side of the lock-knob.

 

I've just had a look at my scope, and yes there are, I hadn't noticed them before, the lower one in particular was largely hidden by the lock-knob. So you need to slacken them off to make the focuser freer moving, any idea about the size of the Allen key required. 

John 

1 hour ago, Franklin said:

This is pretty much the same advice that I've seen on adjusting the Vixen R&P which is a similar design to the Takahashi. The idea is to allow the drawtube to run freely on the two lower rails, just being held there by the upper grubscrews and Teflon strip, rather than the pinion gear pressing up against the rack.

The adjustment screw holes on the side of the Vixen focuser actually look more similar to those on the Esprit 150 focuser, and not at all like on the Tak 100 DZ, where there aren't actually any adjustment screw holes on the side of the focuser.

Incidentally there were no instructions for adjusting the focuser in the manuals that came with either the 100 DZ or the Esprit 150.

John

8 minutes ago, MartianHill said:

Yes

Wasn't sure how to remove the metal plate, do you need a special tool, I assume that its screwed in.

John 

1 hour ago, MartianHill said:

I found adjusting the two screws evenly and slightly on the focuser pressure plate on the underside of the focuser allowed very good adjustment control for the focus tension.

There is a small round metal plate under the focuser, presumably this needs to be removed to expose the screws.

John

There doesn't seem to be anything on the BAA's website, best just keep a look out between 1st and 3rd December.

John 

Having recently acquired a Takahashi 100 DZ, I must confess to being a bit disappointed with the focusing mechanism, I found it to be very stiff even after slackening off the Drawtube clamp, and difficult to achieve correct focus, having only coarse focusing. I'm surprised that at this price point it doesn't come with a dual speed focuser, especially as most non-premium 100mm Refractors costing less than half the price, come with a dual speed focuser, and in order for me to carry out a meaningful comparison of the performance with my other refractors, I consider that a fine focus mechanism is essential. 

As I understand there are two Precision Focuser kits available for the Takahashi FC 100 Refractors, the genuine Takahashi MEF3 Micro Edge Focuser available from FLO at £247, or the More Blue Precision Focuser Retrofit Kit, currently in stock at FLO at £195.

I would be interested to receive any recommendations from observers that have fitted either of these fine focusing kits, including ease of fitting.

John 

On 16/11/2023 at 19:33, Mr Spock said:

Nice scope! You won't need the extension tube 👍 This is focused on Venus.

I would add for best planetary performance, the Tak prism shows Jupiter's belts easier and cleaner than the Baader. I just use that now for wide field and doubles.

Got my first fleeting glimpse through the 100 DZ last night, at Jupiter through a gap in the clouds, apart from making out the 2 main bands, I didn't have sufficient time to assess the performance before it clouded over again, and I don't think that atmospheric conditions were very good.

With the Baader diagonal (like yours, which has a light path of 112mm) and a Tele Vue 7mm T6 Nagler, it reached focus with the drawtube just 20mm out., some of my eyepieces focus further in. I didn't need the Tak 2in extension tube that came with the scope, which I assume you only need if you don't use a diagonal. I assume that the Tak 1.25 in Prism Diagonal has a shorter light path, so that the eyepieces will focus further out, do you know whether the Baader M72 Click Lock clamp has a longer or a shorter light path than the Tak M72 to 2in adaptor that came with the scope.

I also found the coarse focusing a bit hit and miss, and at some point will probably get a Precision Focuser Kit, at present a bit undecided between the More Blue, and the TaK version. 

John