Good value beginner scope for Imaging

[MrMorris]

Hi,

I've been wanting to get into Astronomy for a while now, specifically I'm very interesting into getting into Astrophotography (very basically at the moment anyway).

First off, I already have access to a Canon 500D which belongs to my father, however I don't have a telescope or any other astrology equipment. So I'm looking to get the whole package - telescope, any mounts I need to connect the camera to the scope, and anything else I need.

I also understand that I need an Equatorial Mount so that the telescope follows the rotation of the earth, which makes long exposures possible? Is that correct?

I don't really want to spend any more than £300, however that budget is flexible if needed. Also, at the moment the only things I want to picture will be the moon, and the other planets in the solar system. I'm not really that interested in taking pictures of any deep space objects at the moment. Looking at them myself though is a different matter.

So, as an overview, I'd like something that's decent for gazing at a large range of objects, and something which can take pictures of our surrounding planets at decent quality. I'm not expecting NASA like quality, just something that will give me alright results.

Thanks in advance .

[Zakalwe]

Hi,

I've been wanting to get into Astrology for a while now.

[MrMorris]

Haha, my mistake Changed now.

[Zakalwe]

Hi,

I've been wanting to get into Astronomy for a while now, specifically I'm very interesting into getting into Astrophotography (very basically at the moment anyway).

First off, I already have access to a Canon 500D which belongs to my father, however I don't have a telescope or any other astrology equipment. So I'm looking to get the whole package - telescope, any mounts I need to connect the camera to the scope, and anything else I need.

I also understand that I need an Equatorial Mount so that the telescope follows the rotation of the earth, which makes long exposures possible? Is that correct?

I don't really want to spend any more than £300, however that budget is flexible if needed. Also, at the moment the only things I want to picture will be the moon, and the other planets in the solar system. I'm not really that interested in taking pictures of any deep space objects at the moment. Looking at them myself though is a different matter.

So, as an overview, I'd like something that's decent for gazing at a large range of objects, and something which can take pictures of our surrounding planets at decent quality. I'm not expecting NASA like quality, just something that will give me alright results.

Thanks in advance .

An Eq mount is needed for long exposures, but you can get decent lunar and planetary images off a alt-az mount. You could go for a large Dob

For DSO stuff, you really won't see anything like the images in the Imaging section. The eye, even through a 'scope, isn't able to resolve or extract that level of detail.

You could try:

• Mount the EOS with a normal camera lens on standard tripod, and shoot widefield stars. A 200mm lens will also give decent lunar images, if you crop them far enough.
  
• Mount the EOS on an Eq mount, with a long camera lens. There are some stunning images in the Imaging section of DS objects like Andromeda taken in this way. Plus, investing in a decent Eq mount means that you can bung a small refractor on there if you want to get into DSO imaging in the future.
  
• Get a large Dob for visual work. Maybe mount a webcam in there for imaging. That would be within your budget, and will give you loads of "Wow" moments.
  
• Get a fork mounted GOTO SCT. SCTs are good for planetary and Lunar imaging due to the long focal length.
  

Hope that helps.

[jgs001]

First thing I'd suggest is invest some money in Books - Making Every Photon Count - Steve Richards.

You can try your hand at some widefield static shots with just the camera and tripod, you're limited in focal length and exposure time, but you can get some good results.

Then, the key thing to think about is where you want to end up, and build towards that as you go, buy smart... For deep sky imaging, it's considered that the HEQ5 is the minimum mount to use. You can image with lesser mounts, but you have to accept the limitations imparted by those mounts (I started with a £40 AltAz mount on Deep Sky, it got really frustrating very quickly).

You can mount you camera direct to the mount, and use normal lenses, there are some bargains to be had using older lens types (M42 mount for instance), that will get you up to decent focal lengths. Even the 50mm primes do a great job on things like constellations.

Then maybe add a telescope later, or even start with something like the ST80 (it's what I used on my AltAz mount) it's only £85.

The key thing is, for deep sky, the mount is really very very important, if the mount can't handle the scope, no matter how good the scope is, you are not going to get good results.

I hope that's of some help.

[Astro_Baby]

Hi and welcome from me......I would suggest if you want to image planets you'd do better with a webcam. I dont do imaging myself but I am sure the guys in the imaging section could advise.

I think the real problem with imaging is its not compatible with budget astronomy. It might be with a webcam but someone else would have ro advise.

[jgs001]

Missed that bit, sorry.. yes a webcam is the best bet for planets, but again, if you want to get anything like close, you need a sturdy mount. Then something like the Skymax is a good starting point. The SynScan AZ mounts will work within limits for that, and allow you tracking, but would limit you for deep sky. The dSLR will also work with the scope for single frame images of the moon, but the sensor size is too large for getting decent results on the planets without using way to many magnifiers, which degrades the image a bit and makes it really very very hard to focus.. (I've tried..)

[MrMorris]

Thanks for all the replies guys.

First of all, a webcam? Wow, I never thought that that would work, I always assumed that to get half decent images of planets you'd need to spend thousands on an SLR. So, any old webcam? And why are they a good idea for planet photography? (when attached to a telescope I assume).

Secondly, I'll definitely check out that book. From my short time looking up info about this, I've already come across two people recommending that book, so it must be a decent read.

So from what I've read so far, a webcam with a telescope would be my best bet for planets? If so, would getting one of these plus a webcam be a good choice? I'm not 100% sure about the telescope, I just looked around on there for a bit and judging from reviews it seems like a decent buy.

Thanks guys.

[Luke]

So, any old webcam? And why are they a good idea for planet photography?

To quote Stefan Seip, from his book 'Digital Astrophotography - A Guide To Capturing the Cosmos':

"The achievable image quality of planetary images [using a webcam] is - despite the low price - superior to that of a digital SLR, and even to that of an astronomical CCD camera! ... [because for one] planetary imaging requires taking as many single frames as possible within the shortest amount of time.

... Webcams with a CCD sensor are better suited for astrophotography than those with a CMOS sensor."

Hope that helps. Best of luck with the imaging!

[Zakalwe]

Thanks for all the replies guys.

Secondly, I'll definitely check out that book. From my short time looking up info about this, I've already come across two people recommending that book, so it must be a decent read.

Do it....I got mine on New Years Eve (I am very much a noob too).....it's a great read.

[RikM]

The Explorer 130 is nice starter scope and a good all-rounder for the price but it is not ideal if you are only interested in lunar/planetary imaging. You really want something with a longer focal length to give you higher magnification. I bought a Skymax 127 (£80 second hand) for webcam imaging of the moon and planets. Unfortunately, the weather has been too awful to try it out yet.

Rik

[jgs001]

For the webcam...

Cheap Philips SPC880 webcam - 49269 - discounts & offers

I'd suggest adding the adapter and IR filter also.

[MrMorris]

Sweet, I'll defo try and order that book tonight then.

Ok, so It's a webcam with a CCD sencor I need then? And I assume you can get an adapter or something to attach it to the telescope?

Ok, I guess that makes sense. Are there any telescopes like the one you posted, but maybe a tiny bit cheaper? (I know I said I had a budget of £300, but I wouldn't really like to max that out).

Edit:

For the webcam...

Cheap Philips SPC880 webcam - 49269 - discounts & offers

I'd suggest adding the adapter and IR filter also.

Cheers, I'll check it out

[jgs001]

You're gonna find it hard... the Skymax 102 is £270 Maksutov - Skywatcher Skymax 102 SynScan AZ GOTO, the 127 is £284 for the supatrak Maksutov - Skywatcher Skymax 127 SupaTrak

You could probably get away with Reflectors - Skywatcher Explorer 130P SupaTrak AUTO for £193, that's the tracking non goto mount.

Otherwise you'll end up probably having to buy motors on top of the scope and mount, or buying a heavier mount with motors installed...

Before you get anything else though, get that book, it's aimed at Deep Sky which has a different set of requirements, but even with Lunar/Planetary, you ideally want as accurate a tracking system as possible as it makes the processing so much easier later.

[MrMorris]

Yeh, guess I may end up spending that much. Oh well, as long as it's worth it I'm happy

Those scopes have just bought me onto another question - GoTo mounts. I've heard some bad things about them, but some good, what are they like? Do you think they're handy for someone like myself to quickly find the planets etc I want to see, or do you think it "takes away the joy of astronomy", as I've heard some people say. Personally I think they seem great, but I'm not sure if I need one.

[Astro_Baby]

Scope wise you could look at the Skywatcher 150PL on the EQ3-2 for planetary work or maybe the standard 150P, that would eat £250 though and you'd need a tracking motor. Thats why I said budget and astro imaging doesnt ally go together.

My best advice would be to call FLO (banner up top) and talk to Steve or James who will be able to give some solid advice and put some pricing at you and see what you think.

Problem is almost any really decent scope planetary scope and mount is going t be over the £300 mark. I was hoing to suggest a 2nd hand TAL 100 but go make it work you'd neec a minimum of an EQ5 mount with motors and the mount alone is going to run over £300

[Astro_Baby]

Well GoTo is going to be way out lf your budget really. It depends what your doing with it to a large extent. If all i was doing was planets i wouldng bother because i can easily find planets without any help. I would howevef have a tracking motor because it makes life a lot easier. For deep sky I find GoTo a must.

The 'joy of finding things yourself' is very short lived when you find you cant in fact find anything. Much depends on how much time you have available to leafn the sky BUT even if thats lots you have the UK weather to contend with.

Lots of people who are negative about it at the start soon change their minds later and for me I wouldnt be without it. Dont underestimate how tough it is to find objects.

As i say though if i were only interested in planets it would be pointless to have GoTo.

Dont let snob attitudes to GoTo influence you......buy what you think you need and be honest in your requirements.

[jgs001]

What Mel said... well put Mel.

[MrMorris]

Thanks for that, I'm still trying to get my head around GoTo mounts. So with this telescope, which jgs001 posted a few posts up, I would literally be able to select something from a list of objects and it would point at it? Or does it just point at a specific position in the sky which you enter? (I'm not even sure if such things exist).

[Zakalwe]

Thanks for that, I'm still trying to get my head around GoTo mounts. So with this telescope, which jgs001 posted a few posts up, I would literally be able to select something from a list of objects and it would point at it? Or does it just point at a specific position in the sky which you enter? (I'm not even sure if such things exist).

You "align" the scope by pointing it at specific stars. The 'scope then "maps" the sky. When you select an item (for example Jupiter) in the menu the 'scope will slew to that item.

[MrMorris]

You "align" the scope by pointing it at specific stars. The 'scope then "maps" the sky. When you select an item (for example Jupiter) in the menu the 'scope will slew to that item.

Ah, so I guess you just point it at something like the north star, press a button and then it's all aligned up?

Also, on a slightly different note, what's the difference between a conventional GoTo mount and the one on this? (the other telescope posted above). On this one, do you just control the telescope with the buttons instead of being able to choose objects from a list? (Unless I'm missing something and this is just the same idea as the previous scope).

[Zakalwe]

Ah, so I guess you just point it at something like the north star, press a button and then it's all aligned up?

Also, on a slightly different note, what's the difference between a conventional GoTo mount and the one on this? (the other telescope posted above). On this one, do you just control the telescope with the buttons instead of being able to choose objects from a list? (Unless I'm missing something and this is just the same idea as the previous scope).

There's a couple of different ways of aligning them. With my Celestron, for example, you just centre three bright objects (they don't even have to be stars...it can use Jupiter for instance) in the sky (you don't need to know what they are, or their names) and the mount will do everything else. Mine has a GPS link, so it even gets the current location and time from the GPS system....with some mounts you have to enter in the location and current time.

There's no real difference between the mounts that you have pointed out AFAIK....one is a bit "beefier" to carry a heavier scope.

<edit> My apologies...ignore ^^this bit^^. The SupaTrak is not a Goto mount....you level it and point it North. Then when you slw and find an object manually it tracks it. You don't select an item from a list and the scope slews to it. <end edit>

GOTO mounts are great, because you can get stuck in straight away and start seeing things. There can be a fairly steep learning curve with this hobby, and GOTO helps to make it a bit easier.

[MrMorris]

There's a couple of different ways of aligning them. With my Celestron, for example, you just centre three bright objects (they don't even have to be stars...it can use Jupiter for instance) in the sky (you don't need to know what they are, or their names) and the mount will do everything else. Mine has a GPS link, so it even gets the current location and time from the GPS system....with some mounts you have to enter in the location and current time.

There's no real difference between the mounts that you have pointed out AFAIK....one is a bit "beefier" to carry a heavier scope.

<edit> My apologies...ignore ^^this bit^^. The SupaTrak is not a Goto mount....you level it and point it North. Then when you slw and find an object manually it tracks it. You don't select an item from a list and the scope slews to it. <end edit>

GOTO mounts are great, because you can get stuck in straight away and start seeing things. There can be a fairly steep learning curve with this hobby, and GOTO helps to make it a bit easier.

Interesting, that's quite a smart way of doing it actually, very clever. On the topic of Celestron Telescopes, what about the 90 SLT? Do you think it would suit my needs?

[Zakalwe]

You might be better off going for a Dobsonian. Small aperture scopes like the one you have listed are great, but the GOTO is the same as on larger scopes....which means that the smaller scope will have loads of things listed that the scope will never be able to see.

Is there any astronomical clubs near you? It might be worthwhile popping along, as I am sure someone will be more than happy to let you have a peer through one of their scopes. Its better to hang on a little bit (especially as your budget is limited) to make sure that you buy the scope that you are totally happy with.

If it was my money, then I would be opting for something like a 250P Skywatcher Dobsonian, rather than the 90mm GOTO.

[MrMorris]

Well I definitely won't be buying anything for a while, I'll get that book and I'll probably just go outside with some binoculars (when the sky isn't full of clouds anyway) and see what I can see.

Also, I don't think there are astronomical clubs close to where I live, but I'll have a look around.