NGC7000 from central Guildford

[PortableAstronomer]

I thought I'd have a go at this target.

I only have about two hours out with the scope (after driving it out to the site, setup and dismantling/drive home afterwards). The site is about the worst you can get for light pollution but at least it's somewhere safe I can go.

Stack 5x5min exposures

IDAS filter

QHY8

WO Megrez 90, FF III

QHY5 + PHD guiding

EQ6 + EQMOD + StellariumScope

Processing: DeepSkyStacker, PixInsight LE

The image desperately needs more exposure time ; it looks over-processed (too stretched) and grainy, and the edge stars have some serious coma problems probably because of the FF spacing.

But it's a good example of what can be done from the city with just freeware processing.

The problem was that there were so few dark areas in the frame, so the dynamic background extraction in PixInsight won't work so well.

I used to drive out of the city to the Surrey hills, but it's not safe anymore. Such a shame!

[Aza]

Looks like you have done well to pull out what you did!

I feel your pain, I myself have started driving away from home for better conditions.

If you are driving anyway, surely you should go somewhere that is as dark as possible for you, otherwise seems a bit of a waste!

To pick my sites I used the Philips Dark Sky Map, and also used a night light overlay in Google Earth.

Google Earth is great to use, as I can find various sites before going to check them out during the day to see if it really is suitable!

The overlay is called DMSP Global Composites. It is very slow, but worthwhile.

I think you should go back to finding a decent dark site...it really does make all the difference in your imaging!

Check this thread for a test I did before:

http://stargazerslounge.com/imaging-discussion/79114-dark-skies-vs-lp-skies-comparison-images.html

[MartinB]

Worth all the effort I would say. I know it's only a small image but it is looking good.

It's always worth adjusting your exposure time to match your sky glow, so shorter and more with bad LP and longer but fewer without. You could try 3 minutes and compare the results. Some people on here obsess about long expsures for individual subs but they aren't always the best bet.

As Arran says though, worth hunting out those dark skies.

[Aza]

I think if you are travelling, you may as well travel to the best, yet nearest spot.

Looking on Google Earth with the overlay, it seems you have quite a lot of choice for decent skies around Guildford!

[PortableAstronomer]

Thanks for the feedback everyone.

"I think if you are travelling, you may as well travel to the best, yet nearest spot.

[ ... ] it seems you have quite a lot of choice for decent skies around Guildford!"

I beg to differ. My friend and I used to observe in the Surrey hills when it was clear, but in the end we became harassed by teenagers in their noise-making cars with huge exhausts, other people walking around in the dark making us feel unsafe, and if it's not that then we have to deal with the police who have to serve a paranoid public. You definately don't want to be out there on your own with valuable imaging kit.

My local club tries to do observing evenings in the hills once a month but it's usually clouded out and they typically get 5 group observing evenings a YEAR. If it's clouded out one weekend then that's it for the month. Last time at a club observing meeting at a reasonably dark site there were about 20 of us and the police turned up again as well as lots of Kevs in their Vauxhall Novas with 'go faster exhaust pipes', setting their headlights on us wherever we settled.

The urban car park location I drive to at the moment is actually more light polluted than my back yard at home. But unlike at home, I don't have paranoid neighbours to deal with. My friend works at the hospital and knows the security guards there. So although the LP sucks, that security is worth 100 "dark but dodgy" sites to me.

We can't do the "safety in numbers" out at dark skies either, because most of the members at our local club have gardens of their own, and they wouldn't want to be dragged away from their hard-earned home observatories and drive somewhere else just for the sake of a couple of newbies like me. It's a tough one. I saw Hants Astro have some agreements with some dark-ish sites (e.g. Butsers ancient farm) which looks amazing but that's a bit far from my flat in Woking!

With more apartments being built than houses, I fear the next generation of amateur astronmers will have even greater challenges finding somewhere safe (net alone dark).

Anyway, clear skies to you all ! :-)

Chris

[Aza]

The same problems are happening to me too.

I am sure you could find somewhere with a little investigating.

Locate your preferred spots, then drive there in the daytime and ask the farmer for permission.

Steer clear away from car parks and places frequented by the boy racers!

Good luck though which ever way you go

[PortableAstronomer]

Thanks Arran, your advice most appreciated.

Cheers, Chris

[profees]

SURRY HILLS ?? Why is it not safe ???

[profees]

Scrap that last post i read the whole thread - im in bracknell about 40 mins from guildford - the might be a site half way if you are interested.

[profees]

Windsor great park might be an option - Its usually very dark and empty

[PortableAstronomer]

It's beginning to sound like we're starting a Surrey & Berkshire "meet-up for observing" service :-)

My friend in Guildford started an SMS ring-round, we have about 20 people on it, although usually only 2-3 turn up on average. The idea is to be able to go observing whenever the weather is clear, at short notice, during the week or weekends.

I never thought of Windsor or the Bracknell forest/Bagshot area though; if there's lots of you in Berkshire interested in meeting up then I'm only in Woking. Does anyone know any friendly farmers ? lol

[PortableAstronomer]

Reprocessed, a bit better this time!

Almost looking like those semi-rural pics

[Aza]

Wow that is a much finer result!

Just goes to show how much processing goes into imaging.

Good work

[minimalist]

That's fantastic results, especially the reprocess, given the original results. If you manage to eliminate the gradient towards the left and right, it would definitely rival some of the best out there. Very impressive.

I would make one suggestion though if I may. The LPS is a very good filter, but it seems to me more suited for light to medium LP. Yours seems fairly strong. I would sugggest trying the Astronomik CLS filter. It is a little stronger, so it might cut out some more of the LP you are fighting. The downside is that the star colors are a bit harder to match, mostly because it does supress green quite a bit. But I think in your situation is well worth a try.

Daniel

[PortableAstronomer]

Thanks for the tip about the CLS filter, Daniel,

It's a shame there's no mono version of the QHY8; otherwise I'll be doing tri-colour narrowband imaging.

Chris

[Aza]

You could get very good results with a Ha filter.

Even better than using an LP filter, but of course that is if you are happy with mono images.

[Starstrike]

That is a very nice reworked image Chris, I used a cls filter on the same target recently the results are posted on this site. I obtained a similar image initially and then reworked it looking at Greg Parker's work at the New Forest Observatory. I had to partially desaturate and then balance magenta and red in colours to achieve the similar result to Gregs.

[minimalist]

Chris, I thought there was a mono version called the qhy8 pro or something like that. I could be wrong though.

Daniel

[Aza]

The pro is the same chip as the QHY8. It has set point cooling though.

[MikeWilson]

This thread may be over a year old, but are any of the local participants still around and looking for observing buddies and/or know of any good safe local dark sites?

I'm in the Farnborough area and it's massively light polluted here. What with one of the area's biggest and worst lit business parks, some of the heaviest social housing in the county and an airport with a fake air traffic control tower that's lit up 24x7 like a Christmas Tree just for show at an airport that you cannot use...

I'm thinking about creating a new web (2.0..) site which catalogues local knowledge about dark sky sites and I'll kick it off with a few of my own. I was going to suggest Surrey Hills until I searched SGL and saw PortableAstronomer's experiences of the area. Ack, can't be doing with chavs. Police aren't strictly a problem but I suppose they're going to bathe the area in white and blue lights, aren't they? ....

edit: I second Aza's opinion about getting an Astronomik CLS-CCD filter. They're very good at cutting out a lot of the visible light pollution, although an IDAS filter would be less obtrusive and harsh, it's more expensive and somewhat harder to come by.

[PortableAstronomer]

Hi Mike,

It's sad to see that a year after I left the UK, there is still a pressing issue where 'the rest of us' want somewhere safe to meet-up away from the city lights. One of the reasons why my friend and I setup an informal observing group a couple of years ago, was because we lived in apartments and didn't have big rural mansion houses with our own observatories. Unfortunately we both found out that if you join a local astro club where most of the members choose to do their observing in the privacy of their own rural gardens, that's great for them, and I'm sure they worked hard for it, but it's not so helpful for the average joe. We kept asking if other members wanted to come out observing with us if the skies were clear, but the responses were usually that they'd prefer to do their observing from home. We understood that, respected that, but we had to do something about it for the average joe.

Now I see a post 12 months later asking for observing buddies; it brings back so many memories of my struggles. I find it very depressing that access to a safe patch of grass outside a city is so difficult.

[MikeWilson]

I find it very depressing that access to a safe patch of grass outside a city is so difficult.

Hello PortableAstronomer.

It is rather depressing, isn't it? I hope things have improved where you are now, if you're still stargazing?

I take your point about those with observatories. I was thinking myself, "If only I had a long dark garden, I'd build an observatory. Oh what fun I could have. I could image this and that with increase ease and comfort". Although if I had such a dark garden, I would certainly host some observing/imaging sessions from it, if I could (not saying there's an issue with anyone who doesn't choose to do that!).

My pain point is that it really is proving very difficult to find a patch of grass in a safe area that isn't brightly lit or populated by either city dwellers, chavs or doggers. And it's also rather sad that one cannot seemingly gaze at the stars without attracting unwanted attention. I haven't struggled yet as such, since all the dark sites I've earmarked have had obvious problems (evidence of late night activities by others - beer cans, litter, etc) or a quick Googling (e.g. Surrey Hills) shows potential problems.

When I started this hobby at the end of the summer, I had originally assumed (I'm not sure why I had this presupposed idea) that astronomy clubs organised or owned land for the purpose of this sort of thing. I've just the last week noticed that an astronomy society in Guildford, borrowing the car park of a local national trust property, ran an open 'night' for star gazing. That's encouraging, but what I was rather hoping for was something that works like this:

"Hi, I'm going out to xxxx this evening for yyyy hours. Are you free and would you like to come, too?"

"Sure" or "Not tonight"

"Great, see you there"

And thus, the intrepid mini-group of astronomers meet up at the dark site and with safety and added social enjoyment, partake of their hobby individually or collectively.

I'm pleased that I have a garden at all, even if it's only just big enough to swing a cat (don't worry, I have three). Technically speaking, I'm writing this >from< the garden as my home office and utility room take up most of the space out here and the shed and patio the rest, leaving just a small patch of grass beneath floodlit sky to view the objects around zenith (I've been lucky lately that a lot of interesting objects have been in the line of sight!).

I found the perfect field near my in laws last week, but it had horses in it. I was thinking if I could find the land owner, I could ask not just if he/she had a bit of grass I could use but also if he/she knew anyone else nearby who might be able to host me (and/or a couple of others?).

If anyone reads this and would like to potentially get an observing group together, please get in touch!

Mike

[PortableAstronomer]

I think this thread has gone a bit off-topic, largely my own fault though. It was originally an example of showing how NGC7000 can be captured from the city, this giving some hope to city dwellers. More of a sort of extension to this older thread

http://stargazerslounge.com/imaging-tips-tricks-techniques/93728-examples-extreme-processing-extreme-light-pollution.html

But considering the UK is a country where 69% of the land area is owned by just 0.6% of the population, average joe is not going to realistically gain night-time access to safe public areas without attracting some unwanted attention, and you're better off knowing some buddies who do have nice rural gardens.

Here in the Netherlands the light pollution is about the same as SE England but astronomers seem to just pull over with their mobile equipment out of the car, and some ask some farmers if they can setup in a corner of their field on clear nights. There doesn't seem to be a 'get orrf moiy laaaand' culture here. Maybe it's just my own experience though!