Seestar s50 or less portable/convenient rig

[ckp82]

I'll start off by saying I'm currently doing e.a.a using the following set up

Skywatcher st80

Skywatcher azgti

Skywatcher wedge

Asi585mc

Asiair plus

I found this a highly portable rig until I stumbled across the seestar s50. The images it produces are on par with what I can see with my setup.

The part I like best is no polar aligning necessary. It seems to take me forever to tune in using the wedge and asiair app. I don't normally get alot of time outside due to clouds or commitments so time is an important factor for me.

I'd like to hear anyone's opinions on this as if there isn't much difference between them I'm considering getting a seestar and sell my current rig. 

Thanks.

 

[Artik]

I actually use very similar (but lower end) setup

• Mount AZ GTi (+8xAA rechargeable batteries) 
• Scope svbony sv501p achromat 60/400
• asi224mc and Meade mono camera (imx178)
• I use Android tablet for stacking, capture and all processing using OpenLiveStacker app connected directly to a camera (see disclaimer below)

I do not use EQ mode - only AZ - so alignment is very fast. I can easily have 10s exposure times (for narrowband imaging) and 5s for normal (mostly because with heavy light pollution there is no much advantages in very long exposures)

I do recommend you getting svbony sv231 color fringe filter to improve CA especially for achromat - it is quite cheap and I use it as drop in replacement of IR/UV cut. In addition to cutting some of the blue that achromat does not correct well it has double threads so I can add various visual filters on top of it like UHC and OIII.

The biggest advantage in comparison to SeeStar flexibility - sometimes I put my larger 102/660 achromat to image smaller galaxies - so flexibility is key. AZ mode allows quite fast alignment and setup - but if one day you want longer exposures for narrow band filters you can have one. You can buy a better scope in future (some ED) and still the rig will be relavant. While SeeStar may be more appealing you'll find out that while it is cheaper it is more limited. For example I find my images when taken with flats and real time gradient removal have much more uniform field in comparison to some of SeeStar images I have seen.

So I'd recommend keep your current setup - because in EAA/AP upgrades is something you'll always want.

I also learned that 30x6 RACI finder makes it way easier to align everything since it allows to see stars way easier and point it more accurately (but I align manually - you probably with ASIAir)

 

 

Here some images I captured recently and posted on cloudy nights all but M8 lagoon taken with 5s exposures az mode with flats/darks with sv231 filter and all goodies

M8 lagoon was taken with sv220 dual narrowband filter with 10s exposures. All real time EAA

 

 

Disclaimer: I'm the author of OpenLiveStacker app. It is free and open-source app. 

 

Edited July 30 by Artik

[PeterC65]

You don't need to use EQ mode for EAA. I have an AZ-EQ5 mount and only ever use it in AZ mode with up to 15s exposures. Sticking with AZ mode would make your setup time shorter.

I don't have a Seestar S50 but have used one, and I don't think the image quality or range of targets you could capture would be as good as with your current setup. If you were starting from scratch and just wanted a basic hassle free EAA setup then I'd recommend the S50, but since you already have a better set of kit I would stick with that and just make setup easier.

The big downside of the S50 is that there is no room for expansion. You get what you get and cannot change camera / scope / filters. In particular the field of view with the S50 is quite wide and there isn't much you can do about that.

 

[Elp]

3 hours ago, ckp82 said:

It seems to take me forever to tune in using the wedge and asiair app

How long does it take you?

[happy-kat]

4 hours ago, ckp82 said:

,....., the seestar s50. The images it produces are on par with what I can see with my setup.

The part I like best is no polar aligning necessary.

The seestar is 50mm lens working in altaz. You have a bigger lens and camera sensor size (pixels are both 2 .9 I think). Try using your rig without the wedge in altaz mode, you can still use the pro version of the synscan app, just level the tripod with the telescope horizontal and facing North and turn on and use altaz.

I don't know if the asair plus can be used in an altaz configuration though.

[Elp]

5 minutes ago, happy-kat said:

don't know if the asair plus can be used in an altaz configuration though.

It won't control the mount as it uses RA/Dec coordinate system, but likely you can still have it connected to camera only and use live mode, can't remember whether it performs a goto though prior.

[happy-kat]

The synscan is hands off if select one star as it then slews to where the mount thinks the star is, then you could use the camera view to tweak the star and align, repeat on different stars on each alignment.

[ckp82]

Thanks for everybody's replies. After reading through I think I may have avoided an impulsive decision.

It seems asi air does support alt az,  just not for the az gti. I could use the alt az in synscan and asiair for the camera, but I do like the accuracy of the asi air goto and would prefer only to use one app, again the asi air does this perfectly. @Elp the polar alignment takes me about 10-15 minutes to do, maybe I'm just feeling a bit impatient after learning I could cut this out with the s50! I do like the idea of being able to upgrade, add, swap things around with my current set up. Obviously this is something I wouldn't be able to do this with the s50.

Thanks again for helping me decide.

 

[Geoff Lister]

2 hours ago, ckp82 said:

After reading through I think I may have avoided an impulsive decision.

Up to the beginning of this year, I was essentially a visual astronomer, with occasional use of a camera instead of an eyepiece. Last December, I read several favourable reviews, and I bought my Dwarf 2, and shortly after, my Seestar. I have no regrets on either setup. Watching the image build on my tablet's screen, is like viewing with averted vision - the longer you look, the more you see. The Dwarf, with its little padded bag is about the same volume and weight as my 50-year old 10x50 binoculars, and is almost as versatile for bird watching. The Seestar app requires less work by the user, and, to my mind, has a better user interface. Some evenings I have both running, imaging different targets. I particularly like the Seestar's "Mark" function to identify targets.

Neither system is much good for planets, but both have helped me to see faint fuzzies that would be a challenge even for my 10" Dobsonian. I have enjoyed the images of comets, often with the core elongating as the comet moves with respect to the background stars. I have a large external hard disk filling up with the raw FIT images, and perhaps I will spend some time with the likes of Siril and GIMP, but at the moment I am happy with the images downloaded to my tablet.

Geoff

[Elp]

3 hours ago, ckp82 said:

the polar alignment takes me about 10-15 minutes to do

I suspect your SW wedge is part of the problem. Some people use it okay and I guess it depends on payload and FL being used, I've used various types of setups on it, and four different types of wedges and the SW one ranked near bottom. If you're going to use the azgti long term, just get the William Optics wedge, trust me.

I've read a few posts about using the asiair in alt az, most people eventually admitted they used Synscan to align (so not using the air). One or two people have said they use it fine in alt az but I don't know how plate solving and goto will work with one in alt az.

[ckp82]

2 hours ago, Elp said:

I suspect your SW wedge is part of the problem. Some people use it okay and I guess it depends on payload and FL being used, I've used various types of setups on it, and four different types of wedges and the SW one ranked near bottom. If you're going to use the azgti long term, just get the William Optics wedge, trust me.

I've read a few posts about using the asiair in alt az, most people eventually admitted they used Synscan to align (so not using the air). One or two people have said they use it fine in alt az but I don't know how plate solving and goto will work with one in alt az.

I was thinking the same to be honest. I can do a small adjustment but the numbers say I've gone alot further than it should have if that makes sense?

[Elp]

It used to be super easy prior to the firmware associated with app v1.9, I could easily do it within 2-3 minutes with the WO wedge. Now it takes around 5 minutes (up to 10 minutes if it's being a swine), and I usually have to do it in two stages, first to get very close azimuth adjustment and manually move the tripod as I run out of azimuth bolt adjustment thread (this happens with all my mounts, it never used to), then start again. They've changed the sensitivity of the procedure now, the slightest adjustments push it far out even at stage 2 or so, it only used to be that sensitive at the final stage when you're trying to get less than 50 arc seconds. There's a lot more to and froing with the latest software/firmware.

[MonsterMagnet]

3 hours ago, Elp said:

I suspect your SW wedge is part of the problem. Some people use it okay and I guess it depends on payload and FL being used, I've used various types of setups on it, and four different types of wedges and the SW one ranked near bottom. If you're going to use the azgti long term, just get the William Optics wedge, trust me.

I've read a few posts about using the asiair in alt az, most people eventually admitted they used Synscan to align (so not using the air). One or two people have said they use it fine in alt az but I don't know how plate solving and goto will work with one in alt az.

Think this is likely the case, it's not sensitive enough.  I changed to a WO wedge and it was easier and I have an AM3 now and it's night and day on how easy it is to make the adjustments.

MM

[ckp82]

I've done some reading online and it seems the skywatcher mount has to much slop in it, I thought it was just me! As this is the weakest link, I think I'll look into getting the William optics wedge as my first upgrade. It's expensive but it's half the cost of the s50 and will still be a better set up overall.

[Elp]

4 hours ago, ckp82 said:

It's expensive

If you're very patient they do come up used cheaper. I had the black ioptron one which I'd class as second best out of the four I used, I believe they do a newer one which looks a lot like the WO one, but I haven't used the newer version.

Edited July 31 by Elp

[ckp82]

1 hour ago, Elp said:

If you're very patient they do come up used cheaper. I had the black ioptron one which I'd class as second best out of the four I used, I believe they do a newer one which looks a lot like the WO one, but I haven't used the newer version.

Patience isn't my strongest point. It's something I'll have to work on I think!