camera dramarama

[TiffsAndAstro]

at a slight tangent, svbony have a rotator that should work in theory though id need m63 down to m54 adapter between focus tube adapter and flattener, then the filter drawer between the flattener and their uncooled 585 camera. whether that all fits im currently trying to work out, plus, my focus tube is at focus about an inch our of the ota which doesn't leave much leeway. there's probably more to it than that but im new to all this

so many adapters and sizes and lengths and threads its a bit annoying. luckily im in a good mood as i took 15 x 60 sec subs last night lol. before the clouds came in my guiding was my best ever at 0.82".  its annoying seeing it hover under 0.50" for a while before jumping up, but i think that means it has potential, but i won't be sweating over it again if next few sessions it still around 0.8 or 1.0. tilt might be slightly improved but, as i hope to get a cheap astro cam im not gonna sweat that either. i can sweat about any tilt i get once i upgrade camera.

Edited June 11 by TiffsAndAstro

[Stuart1971]

£287 on Amazon all fees included….tempting

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Svbony-Telescope-Sensitivity-Planetary-Photography/dp/B0BJ6XKBDB/ref=sr_1_3?crid=1EK5270BYHCWH&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.VY-NElWJCPSNTojEP6mOrzTFkFLg48HNsEIADGJRBjI.PDvuPv9jxETVPCjDqvnIPS57SHfYzWmpCNaNdnQlMqI&dib_tag=se&keywords=SV705c&qid=1718100610&sprefix=sv705c%2Caps%2C84&sr=8-3&ufe=app_do%3Aamzn1.fos.4c560c31-6601-464f-a219-d10a40a4ca65

[Stuart1971]

Apparently the price is the 585 camera from the Svbony website, included the VAT, so it is a bargain…. They just confirmed this with me…

[TiffsAndAstro]

2 hours ago, Stuart1971 said:

Apparently the price is the 585 camera from the Svbony website, included the VAT, so it is a bargain…. They just confirmed this with me…

I want to get camera, filter drawer,  UV/it cut filter and rotator and any adapters I need from one place.

As svbony have a UK headquarters I'd hope vat is included and no Brexit taxes but I'll check with them.

I'll post an amazing crayoned working drawing with dimensions/m adapter numbers and stuff here as soon as I get a chance and hope some kind soul can give me a sanity check on it as I'm bound to mess something up with this. Maybe still in time for a bit more 'zoom' on some galaxies

[TiffsAndAstro]

2 hours ago, Stuart1971 said:

Apparently the price is the 585 camera from the Svbony website, included the VAT, so it is a bargain…. They just confirmed this with me…

https://www.svbony.com/sv705c-color-planetary-camera-imx585/#F9198J-W9184A

Is what I'm thinking but maybe not as good a deal as I though. Free filter drawer and an ir/uv cut filter for £7 more. Rotator looks nice, if it will fit for £20 too.

The svbony cs lady who emailed replied to me at 4am is called Nina. I have a feeling she'll have a colleague name Ciril. Maybe he has two PhDs?

Looking at it a bit more I think I might have to not try and get everything in one go, prices aren't quite as low as I hoped. If I can attach an ir/UV cut filter without a drawer for now, I'll just get camera and that filter leave it place inside the updated optical train somewhere and hope I can fit a rotator, filter drawer and dual narrowband filter at a later date that will all magically fit together first time.

Edited June 11 by TiffsAndAstro

[TiffsAndAstro]

so below is a diagram hopefully help explain some of my questions if anyone is so kind:

ideally i'd like to retain as much as possible from stage 1 if/when i eventually move to stage 2.

questions, sorry :

1 the svbony camera diagram is below. i assume the camera nose peice can be removed to gain 6mm more backspace if needed?

2 stage 1 needs an M42 to Mxy adapter of 37.5mm length to make 12.50 +37.50 = 55mm. maybe need some thin shims too if any backspace issues.  what is the Mxy thread or adaptor name id need?

3 stage 2 needs a M42 filter drawer to M42 camera rotator to M42 to Mxy adapter which need to total either 37.50mm,  or 43.50mm if i remove the camera nose piece?

4 flo website says a 2 inch filter fits inside the flattener nose piece (though if you look at my pics of it above it looks like it will also fit between back of the flattener and the t2 adapter?) will it also fit inside stage 2 filter draw? not high priority as uv/ir cut filters seem fairly cheap? i won't be using the nose peice so i can continue to have everything from the back of the focus tube screwed together. 

5 er that's it i think? though i've probably missed something obvious  

links to the equipment:

 svbony SV705C Planetary Camera    https://www.svbony.com/sv705c-color-planetary-camera-imx585/#F9198J

Astro Essentials M48 adapter for Sky-Watcher Newtonians and 72ED Refractor (M54) with 10mm Backfocus https://www.firstlightoptics.com/adapters/astro-essentials-m48-adapter-for-sky-watcher-newtonians-and-72ed-refractor-m54-with-10mm-backfocus.html?_gl=1*1am6k7j*_up*MQ..*_ga*NDg0MTg5MjczLjE3MTgxMzAzMjA.*_ga_F6VGWQ0MW9*MTcxODEzMDMxOS4xLjEuMTcxODEzMDMyMy4wLjAuMA..

sw 72ed https://www.firstlightoptics.com/telescopes-in-stock/sky-watcher-evostar-72ed-ds-pro-ota.html?_gl=1*1arqiqx*_up*MQ..*_ga*NDg0MTg5MjczLjE3MTgxMzAzMjA.*_ga_F6VGWQ0MW9*MTcxODEzMDMxOS4xLjEuMTcxODEzMDMzNC4wLjAuMA..

StellaMira 2" Field Flattener with T / M42  https://www.firstlightoptics.com/stellamira-telescopes/stellamira-2-inch-field-flattener-with-m42-adapter.html?_gl=1*1arqiqx*_up*MQ..*_ga*NDg0MTg5MjczLjE3MTgxMzAzMjA.*_ga_F6VGWQ0MW9*MTcxODEzMDMxOS4xLjEuMTcxODEzMDMzNC4wLjAuMA..

thanks for anyhelp

 

[Elp]

If the SVbony camera is like the ZWO 294/183/533/585 type cameras they have an 11mm m42 female to female black ring on the male threaded nose of the camera (the 6mm you're referring to for the SVbony though I find it odd there doesn't seem to be a technical drawing on the product listing at initial glance).

So all you'd need is a set of m42 spacer rings, FLO sell two sets of Astro Essential ones, one in 1mm increments and another in 5mm ones, useful to have both if you're planning on buying more scopes in future. The camera should come with delrin rings for fine spacing if they're packaged like zwo, otherwise you may need some, I got the three set metal Baader ones but now there are other metal versions again in sets of three, FLO stock them all.

[TiffsAndAstro]

so ive decided to "reach out" to svbony's "We Love Experience" program as i have an entire 1 follower on astrobin and i'm pretty certain that legally makes me an influencer  

just on the slight chance svbony aren't convinced,  i've asked them to stick everything i need to connect the camera, rotator, filter drawer and adapters onto the back of my flattener into a shopping basket for me. and if i have to add vat and brexit taxes to it (which will be a deal breaker i think).

will be interesting to see their response. 

[Elp]

Usually if a seller sells international, they'll only list the unit price without taxes because taxes vary around the world. So expect the 20pc UK VAT to be added to the list price, and you'll have duties (maybe ballpark 10pc) and maybe around 10-15 to the courier whom handles the delivery once it enters the country.

[TiffsAndAstro]

45 minutes ago, Elp said:

If the SVbony camera is like the ZWO 294/183/533/585 type cameras they have an 11mm m42 female to female black ring on the male threaded nose of the camera (the 6mm you're referring to for the SVbony though I find it odd there doesn't seem to be a technical drawing on the product listing at initial glance).

So all you'd need is a set of m42 spacer rings, FLO sell two sets of Astro Essential ones, one in 1mm increments and another in 5mm ones, useful to have both if you're planning on buying more scopes in future. The camera should come with delrin rings for fine spacing if they're packaged like zwo, otherwise you may need some, I got the three set metal Baader ones but now there are other metal versions again in sets of three, FLO stock them all.

the technical drawing of the svbony version i plonked in my post above. its more than possible i've misinterpreted it as i've never touched an astro cam in my life. it looks very similar to the one for the zwo camera on flo website. shockingly  

my first option would be to do to flo what i've done to svbony (see my post above)  but with zwo/astro essentials equivalents, but after a quick look its a lot more expensive. better quality and support im certain, but not something i can do right now.

having said that, i think after i read svbony's reply/shopping basket, there's a decent chance ill wait a bit longer and buy the zwo version and an uv/ir cut and the bits you suggest from flo. maybe i get lucky and there's a customer return. 

if i was harry hill there would be only one way to decide this....

[Elp]

Goal?

[TiffsAndAstro]

1 minute ago, Elp said:

Goal?

world peace and a cure for cancer. but im learning to manage my expectations.

[Elp]

That technical drawing isn't very technical. The exploded diagram photo clearly shows a male threaded nose in front of the camera but the drawing doesn't show it, or that a thread even exists.

[Stuart1971]

5 minutes ago, Elp said:

Usually if a seller sells international, they'll only list the unit price without taxes because taxes vary around the world. So expect the 20pc UK VAT to be added to the list price, and you'll have duties (maybe ballpark 10pc) and maybe around 10-15 to the courier whom handles the delivery once it enters the country.

I asked Svbony today, and there prices on there website include UK VAT as long as you select the correct currency from the drop down list..👍🏻

[TiffsAndAstro]

1 minute ago, Elp said:

That technical drawing isn't very technical. The exploded diagram photo clearly shows a male threaded nose in front of the camera but the drawing doesn't show it, or that a thread even exists.

yeah it just confused the hell out of me. i reckon a lot of new people buy it, get it after two weeks, then buy adapters, find they don't work, repeat.

[TiffsAndAstro]

4 minutes ago, Stuart1971 said:

I asked Svbony today, and there prices on there website include UK VAT as long as you select the correct currency from the drop down list..👍🏻

noice ty  i mean, they list a uk address on their website for their uk hq, there must be a reason for that. id guess. still a bit odd that Nina from their CS replied to me at like 4am this morning. must be doing the CS night shift

Edited June 11 by TiffsAndAstro

[TiffsAndAstro]

6 minutes ago, Elp said:

Goal?

 

[Elp]

31 minutes ago, Stuart1971 said:

I asked Svbony today, and there prices on there website include UK VAT as long as you select the correct currency from the drop down list..👍🏻

I'll reserve judgement, because if you choose USD there's only one price, USA state taxes vary from state to state, so it can't be one listed price. Their FAQ also states the following:

"Import duties, taxes, and customs fees might apply to your purchase, depending on the item's value and classification. To make the entire online shopping process easier for you, the SVBONY website has preset the shipping mode including double clearing and tax inclusive and self-clearance for you to choose. Customers can check the available Tariff information on the checkout page."

Oddly you have to create an account to buy, only then will you be able to go through and check the above.

[TiffsAndAstro]

47 minutes ago, Elp said:

I'll reserve judgement, because if you choose USD there's only one price, USA state taxes vary from state to state, so it can't be one listed price. Their FAQ also states the following:

"Import duties, taxes, and customs fees might apply to your purchase, depending on the item's value and classification. To make the entire online shopping process easier for you, the SVBONY website has preset the shipping mode including double clearing and tax inclusive and self-clearance for you to choose. Customers can check the available Tariff information on the checkout page."

Oddly you have to create an account to buy, only then will you be able to go through and check the above.

yeah i made an account and there's no obvious way to set a default currency. i'd hope it gets it from the address i put it, but who knows. svbony do list a uk hq with a uk address. 

im tempted to ask player one (as they do a similar camera but have a cooler name and colour scheme) the same question. probably work out even more expensive than svbony or zwo, but, it would help me achieve my ultimate goal in having as many different coloured anodised metal parts on my rig at one time as is humanly possible. so far i only really have white black green and red. and silver. oh and stainless non brushed steel.  just need pink, light blue and gold for the full set.

Edited June 11 by TiffsAndAstro

[PhilB61]

Apologies if you have have already considered and dismissed it but have you thought about having your DSLR astro modded rather than buying an uncooled camera. I can't help but feel you could be disappointed with the massively reduced field of view the 585 will provide, no more wide field nebula images without mosaics and the additional time and pain that entails in both acquisition and processing. 

Just a thought..

 

[TiffsAndAstro]

36 minutes ago, PhilB61 said:

Apologies if you have have already considered and dismissed it but have you thought about having your DSLR astro modded rather than buying an uncooled camera. I can't help but feel you could be disappointed with the massively reduced field of view the 585 will provide, no more wide field nebula images without mosaics and the additional time and pain that entails in both acquisition and processing. 

Just a thought..

 

no need at apologise at all. i have considered it but it costs at least £200. for not much more i can get a modern low noise sensor camera (sort of) designed for the job. and smaller and usb powered so one less power lead to manage. 

the smaller field of view is definitely going to be an issue, especially as its going to take time just to learn how to process mosaics, let alone be decent at it.  an  imx533 would be a wiser choice, but there's not a lot of other budget choices. i can concentrate on the smaller juicier nebulas

i have been looking and comparing a lot on telescopius for lots of objects and i agree its a pretty major issue, but im on a tight budget and 585 is probably the least worse option. at least it will help with smaller galaxies...

another issue could be my guiding. last session it was 0.8" so should be ok, but it if reverts back to 1.5 ish could be problems.

Edited June 12 by TiffsAndAstro

[TiffsAndAstro]

not sure how scientific this comparison is. i thought my rayleigh limit was about 1.6

Edited June 12 by TiffsAndAstro

[Vroobel]

7 hours ago, PhilB61 said:

Apologies if you have have already considered and dismissed it but have you thought about having your DSLR astro modded rather than buying an uncooled camera. I can't help but feel you could be disappointed with the massively reduced field of view the 585 will provide, no more wide field nebula images without mosaics and the additional time and pain that entails in both acquisition and processing. 

Just a thought..

 

 

@TiffsAndAstro, as you see I'm not alone in my opinion that you would regret your decision. Thousands of people still make beautiful pics using DSLR.

I'll repeat what I already wrote: buy the dual-narrowband filter now and try your unmodified DSLR with it. You should buy it anyway, so you lose nothing while your emission nebulae should change massively. 

[Elp]

The 585 will be restrictive due to its 16:9 aspect ratio, it's one of the reasons I let my 485 go (other reason being it didn't well match my other 3:2 cameras so combining data would have had to conform to the 485s FOV). With it you do however have better framing options if using shorter FL camera lenses.

Edited June 12 by Elp

[TiffsAndAstro]

2 hours ago, Vroobel said:

 

@TiffsAndAstro, as you see I'm not alone in my opinion that you would regret your decision. Thousands of people still make beautiful pics using DSLR.

I'll repeat what I already wrote: buy the dual-narrowband filter now and try your unmodified DSLR with it. You should buy it anyway, so you lose nothing while your emission nebulae should change massively. 

i can't use a filter drawer with my set up and i don't want to regularly put in and take out a filter into the back of the flattener. im likely to smudge it or worse  if my dslr was modded i would still want a filter drawer. also i haven't even looked at how to process nb data yet or maybe combine broadband and nb. 

also, also,  i was bored and rotated ota in its rings so its back to normal, but this means my dslr is now almost upside down. if i unthread the flattener enough to rotate the dslr back to 'normal' it gets very wobbly. so i also need a rotator....that i can't use with my current set up with my dslr

even if you were the sole voice warning me, i've seen your images and help/advice on other threads and take your advice very very seriously. im trying to deal with multiple "minor issues" in one go for as little cash as possible right now  and uncooled 585 and some accessories for £300 seemed a quick easy win. but i got a reply from svbony earlier and ill post about it soon as i get a chance

Edited June 12 by TiffsAndAstro