I'm sure it was space debri ?

[wesdon1]

Last night, around 9:30pm BST Liverpool, UK, i saw what looked like a shooting star, so to speak, but was moving much slower than i'm used to seeing, and had two white bright balls at front, somehow connected with a rectangular shaped white bright section between them? It was a bizarre shape, and travelled very fast, but by shooting star standards was quite slow? It came from behind me, over my head, and disappeared about 30 degrees above the southern horizon, which at the time i was viewing, looking at Jupiter with telescope. I had looked away from eye piece to give my eye a break and change eyepiece when the object shot over my head towards the south. it was awesome. But i also heard a whooshing sound about 10 seconds after seeing it? The sky wasn't even properly dark at the time, but still it shone brighter than a full moon! it was amazing, but strange in it's behaviour and appearance, not to mention the whooshing sound that followed short time later! lol I'm convinced it must have been space debri due to the lower velocity and unusual shape? Whatever it was it was awesome to see and hear! If anyone else saw it, or has any knowledge of these things, i'd really appreciate your comments! Thanks!

 

Open Skies to all...

[alan potts]

I have often heard shooting stars make noise but I live in the middle of nowhere and it is very quiet apart from the odd dog, I guess space junk must come down all the time, maybe some others saw it too.

Alan

[wesdon1]

I live on a busy main road, and although the road wasn't particularly busy at the time, as far as i can recall, it's still a noisy urban city residential area. So for me to hear a whooshing must mean it was quite loud? It was very large by "Shooting Star" standards, and as described previousely was a bizarre shape? I so wish i had footage of it, as it's really got my brain hurtin g trying to fathom what it was? lol. My best guess is space debri.

[Carbon Brush]

Interesting stuff. I have never been near enough to space junk or meteors to hear them. A comment on noises that I have been reported may be useful.

If you hear a noise AFTER seeing the object, then it is a genuine sound wave (physical noise) created by the object passing through the air.
For example on a calm day I often notice that high altitude aircraft are flying significantly ahead of their sound.

There have been many reports of sounds from aurorae. Observed by multiple people in a group, but not necessarily all members.
This is put down to an effect caused by the aurora generating low frequency radio waves that can be absorbed in the body, triggering nerve impulses.
These sounds are of course co-incident with the visual effect.

I know that the ionised trails left by meteors are active in the radio spectrum (not radioactive!).
Radio amateurs sometimes try to bounce/relay radio signals off meteors.
Whether the ionisation can trigger low frequency radio waves like the aurora, I have no idea.

To wesdon1. Was the (probable space junk) noise behind the object, or coincident?

To Alan. Are you able to say if your meteor noises are behind the object?
 

Fascinating stuff.

David.

 

 

Edited August 19, 2019 by Carbon Brush

[wesdon1]

On 19/08/2019 at 10:36, Carbon Brush said:

Interesting stuff. I have never been near enough to space junk or meteors to hear them. A comment on noises that I have been reported may be useful.

If you hear a noise AFTER seeing the object, then it is a genuine sound wave (physical noise) created by the object passing through the air.
For example on a calm day I often notice that high altitude aircraft are flying significantly ahead of their sound.

There have been many reports of sounds from aurorae. Observed by multiple people in a group, but not necessarily all members.
This is put down to an effect caused by the aurora generating low frequency radio waves that can be absorbed in the body, triggering nerve impulses.
These sounds are of course co-incident with the visual effect.

I know that the ionised trails left by meteors are active in the radio spectrum (not radioactive!).
Radio amateurs sometimes try to bounce/relay radio signals off meteors.
Whether the ionisation can trigger low frequency radio waves like the aurora, I have no idea.

To wesdon1. Was the (probable space junk) noise behind the object, or coincident?

To Alan. Are you able to say if your meteor noises are behind the object?
 

Fascinating stuff.

David.

 

 

Hi David. You seem very knowledgable about Science in general. The sound came about 5-8 seconds after the "Space Junk" shot over my head. My timings are very rough because in a moment of shock, time perception can vary massively. It might have been 1 or 2 seconds after object shot over me? As stated, it all happened so quickly, and it's driven me crazy re-living the experience and trying to "See" in my minds eye what exactly it was and what exactly happened etc. The best way i can describe the sound is this...You know when a very large haulage truck stops at traffic lights and you hear the release of pressurised air from the braking system? Well it was exactly like that but stretched out to a few seconds. It was/is actually my second unexplained experience! a few years back, while standing near Liverpool FC's ground in Anfield, i noticed what can best be described as a star made of yellow flames, in a ball and little flares coming out from it's edges all around the disk? It was there for about 1 minute, then it simply disappeared? I asked a man stood next to me to look at it and confirm i wasn't hallucinating, and he said my goodness yes! How strange!?? It was about 3 times the size of our brightest star Sirius, and looked to be either in low earth orbit or extremely high altitude? but then it could have been light years away from me for all i knew? but then the very obvious flares spurting out the disk all the way around would not have been so obvious at such huge distances, surely? so my best guestimate was/is high altitude or low earth orbit?  it is so difficult to judge distance when you don't have any idea of the size of the object you're looking at, unless it is very close to you? Anyway i didn't tell anyone about the flaming "Star" in the sky because i didn't think people would believe me. I even considered contacting a local University for help in making sense of what i had seen. Sorry for long message, i just thought best try explain everything.

Thanks David, I look forward to your thoughts on my reply.

Wes, Liverpool, UK.

[Carbon Brush]

Hi Wes.

Thank you for the compliment on my science knowledge. It is actually quite thin. I just know a few intellectual-sounding words and recount stories!

It certainly seems that your 'space junk' sighting was accompied by a genuine sound. The time delay giving an approximate indication of altitude.
Though whether it was a falling object, or a noisy aircaft it is impossible for me to comment.

There are various possible explanations for the Anfield flaming star. A bright object yes. Could it have been an 'iridium flare'? Nothing to do with the element iridium.
That is a sunlight reflection from one of the iridiuim sat phone satellites. There are a lot in orbit. They have a large (3M long I think) shiny slab of aluminium as part of the antenna.
The orbits and attitudes are well known, and controlled, which makes prediction easy - if you know how.
These are extremely bright reflections and usually last a few seconds to the static observer.

In your case if it was an iridium sighting, cloud or water droplets, or pollutants, in the upper air could distort the image and modify the colour to you.

https://www.heavens-above.com/IridiumFlares.aspx

Another possibility is a high altitude aircraft carrying our fuel dumping. Miltary aircraft don't necessarily dump liquid fuel - they sometimes burn it.
I have only seen this at low altitude. Once at an air display (RAF Finninglet, Doncaster) I saw an F111 (a US swing wing jet long obsolete) fuel dump during the display.
There was a flame about one and half times the length of the aircraft, a roaring noise and I swear I felt the heat.
The display commentator was not expecting this and was clearly flustered as he hastily explained what had happened.
For the couple of seconds it was taking place I thought that a crash was inevitable. But being in a crowd of 1000 000 people, where can you run?
From memory he said the fuel was being dumped at around 100 000 pounds (weight) per hour, almost a ton a minute!

David.

[wesdon1]

Hi David. You have suggested some very plausible explanations there. I've just looked up the iridium flares, and it definately didn't look like those. It was perfectly round, and very yellow in colour. I'm thinking maybe a fuel burning/dump directly in front of my line of sight, which would account for the round shape maybe? I wish back then i had a camera phone! lol. As for the space junk object, i can say hand on heart it couldn't have been an aircraft cos that too just disappeared, though not like an on/off light switch, but rather it reduced in size/brightness very quickly until not visible. Maybe it was some sort of top secret military aircraft as yet unknown to public? That would account for the sound it made i would guess? my goodness what a riddle! lol. Thank you for all the help and advice David! Open Skies to you Sir...

Wes.

[michaelmorris]

The speed of sound is approx. 343 m/s.  Average sized meteors are typically seen at an altitude of approx. 70 to 100 km, meaning any sound delay would be at least 70,000/343 = 204 seconds.  For there to be even a 10 second delay between seeing an object in the sky and hearing it it would have to have an altitude of no more than 3430 metres (around 10,000 feet).

There is a really interesting phenomena where the brain fills in information it expects to receive, even if it isn't real. We all do it all the time. 

[wesdon1]

On 24/08/2019 at 08:55, michaelmorris said:

The speed of sound is approx. 343 m/s.  Average sized meteors are typically seen at an altitude of approx. 70 to 100 km, meaning any sound delay would be at least 70,000/343 = 204 seconds.  For there to be even a 10 second delay between seeing an object in the sky and hearing it it would have to have an altitude of no more than 3430 metres (around 10,000 feet).

There is a really interesting phenomena where the brain fills in information it expects to receive, even if it isn't real. We all do it all the time. 

Hi Michael. What a fascinating insight into my experience! It could well have been my brain creating sound to make sense of what i was seeing/had just seen. It was beyond strange what i saw in terms of it's shape, constitution and trajectory. It's just so incredibly frustrating when something like that happens so fast, without warning, and you basically re-live it dozens of times in your minds eye trying to "See" what happened and what it was etc! Your Maths are fascinating btw! I will add though, it looked quite close to me as i looked up and saw it shooting above my head, but again it could have been 30'000 feet high and i still could have perceived it to be close due to speed and shock of the experience? If i was any good with animations i'd make a video showing what i saw/experienced! lol Thank you for your amazing comments/insight! Wes.