Where Does M43/M42 Begin & End??

[EntropyStar]

I'm having a bit of dippy moment here regarding Messier 43 'De Mairan's Nebula', I've observed M42 extensively (even bagged the ellusive E & F stars in the Trapezium!) but for the life of me can't find a decent picture of M43 on it's own that doesn't feature M42 sprawling throughout the picture confusing things. As a result I can't be entirely sure where M42 stops and M43 begins!! I know M43 rests just above M42 and is basically a faint comma like smear, which I have observed on many occassions ( I think!). I think i'm letting pictures confuse me but could someone point me in the direction of a labelled photo or diagram that specifically details out where M42 begins and ends in comparison to M43?

All I seem to find in Google (under the terms 'M42' or 'De Mairan's Nebula') searches is endless images of M43 and the trapezium etc..

Thank you!!

PS....I know it's May not November but winter will be round soon enough and it'll all be in view again

[Stephen]

Does this help? http://messier.seds.org/m/m043.html

Seems to indicate there's a dark lane between the two which is the "division"

[Tinker1947]

As above.....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Messier_43

[acey]

Photos are often confusing because they show parts the eye can't see. Visually, M43 is completely detached from M42 and is rather like a fuzzy star.

I tried Googling "M42 drawing" to get something that would show what you want - a photo quite far down this page shows it pretty well:

http://homepage.mac.com/andjames/Page204.htm

[EntropyStar]

As above.....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Messier_43

That page confuses me....it states that the Trapezium is a notable feature, I thought the Trapezium was in M42????!!!

Thank you all for taking the time to reply, as you can see it's not easy bringing up clear images/diagrams of it. I believe this is a good one http://messier.seds.org/Pics/Jpg/m43n1973.jpg....M43 on top separated by the dark dust lane from the top of M42 below......correct???

[pajr777]

[EntropyStar]

Thank's paul....

So does that mean the wiki page has the Trapezium wrongly attributed to M43?

[acey]

Don't know about wiki but the Trapezium is in M42, not M43.

[Double Kick Drum]

It's given two different M numbers but in actual fact it is all the same gas cloud.

That said, it's one of the very best to look at.

[pajr777]

Wiki is wrong, Trapezium cluster is in M42 The star pattern in M43 resembles a rhomboid