10th September: Best images yet but how do I improve clarity/detail?

[Mark2022]

9 minutes ago, Kon said:

The file seems tiff. Are these single frames?You should save the whole capture as a movie and allow as!3 to sort the best images.

Yes, you asked for .fits or .tif so I attached .tif. I can't attach the movies on here, they're too big.

[Kon]

Just now, Mark2022 said:

Yes, you asked for .fits or .tif so I attached .tif. I can't attach the movies on here, they're too big.

But pipp will not stack them. How where these generated? Pipp then as!3?

[Mark2022]

3 minutes ago, Cosmic Geoff said:

I had a quick play with one of your Saturn files. I am not clear what you have done here, as I don't use PIPP for planetary at all in most cases.  I loaded it into Registax as if it was a file pre-processed in Autostakkert from a video.  The colour balance was awful, with hardly any blue.  I have sharpened it up a bit but it still looks bad.  Oddly there is hardly any noise.

TBH, given the likely value of the other gear involved, it would not be overkill to buy a used Win10 business laptop, and use it for image capture and processing. Then you can use all the popular astro programs, e.g  Sharpcap > .ser video > Autostakkert >tif > Registax.

If you reduce your ROI that will cut your raw file size, increase capture rate, and avoid filling your storage with data representing black sky.

Ok hang on. I've sent already aligned files and i think that was a bad one. I've so many damned files from Pipp, Autostakkert, Registax,  Astrosurface  and  variations of variations including affinity photo, I've lost track. I'll post what I think you can use later once I've sorted them out in my brain!

[Mark2022]

3 minutes ago, Kon said:

But pipp will not stack them. How where these generated? Pipp then as!3?

Pipp then AS3 then registax I think or they could be astrosurface. I have absolutely tons of files and I have very little patience for arranging and renaming them! LOL

[Kon]

1 minute ago, Mark2022 said:

Ok hang on. I've sent already aligned files and i think that was a bad one. I've so many damned files from Pipp, Autostakkert, Registax,  Astrosurface  and  variations of variations including affinity photo, I've lost track. I'll post what I think you can use later once I've sorted them out in my brain!

The stacked tiff after autostakkert will do. Put a screenshot of the quality graph for the one you think is the best capture.

[Mark2022]

Just now, Kon said:

The stacked tiff after autostakkert will do. Put a screenshot of the quality graph for the one you think is the best capture.

Ok but later dude. Sometimes this just does my head in! haha

[Mandy D]

1 minute ago, Mark2022 said:

Yes, you asked for .fits or .tif so I attached .tif. I can't attach the movies on here, they're too big.

Try https://wetransfer.com/ You can send files up to 2 GB. Just mesage the link to whoever you want to access the download. Just use your own email address as recipient when uploading the files to WeTransfer.

[Mark2022]

14 minutes ago, Mandy D said:

Try https://wetransfer.com/ You can send files up to 2 GB. Just mesage the link to whoever you want to access the download. Just use your own email address as recipient when uploading the files to WeTransfer.

Mandy, the AVIs are up to 7 and 8GB.

[Mark2022]

19 minutes ago, Kon said:

The stacked tiff after autostakkert will do. Put a screenshot of the quality graph for the one you think is the best capture.

jupiter f6.3 prime focus__000005__00-14-04__data_pipp_lapl5_ap76.as3

I don't have the quality graphs. I didn't save them.

 

saturn prime focus__000002__22-53-34__data_pipp_lapl5_ap76.as3 saturn prime focus__000002__22-53-34__data_pipp_lapl5_ap76.as3 jupiter f6.3 prime focus__000005__00-14-04__data_pipp_lapl5_ap76.as3 saturn prime focus__000002__22-53-34__data_pipp_lapl5_ap76.as3 saturn prime focus__000007__23-33-32__data_pipp_lapl5_ap76.as3 jupiter f6.3 prime focus__000005__00-14-04__data_pipp_lapl5_ap76.as3 jupiter f6.3 prime focus__000001__23-52-13__data_pipp_lapl5_ap13.as3 jupiter f6.3 prime focus__000001__23-52-13__data_pipp_lapl5_ap13.as3 jupiter f6.3 prime focus__000001__23-52-13__data_pipp_lapl5_ap13.as3 jupiter f6.3 prime focus__000005__00-14-04__data_pipp_lapl5_ap76.as3 jupiter f6.3 prime focus__000005__00-14-04__data_pipp_lapl5_ap76.as3 jupiter f6.3 prime focus__000005__00-14-04__data_pipp_lapl5_ap76.as3 saturn prime focus__000002__22-53-34__data_pipp_lapl5_ap76.as3 saturn prime focus__000007__23-33-32__data_pipp_lapl5_ap76.as3

[Mark2022]

40 minutes ago, Cosmic Geoff said:

I had a quick play with one of your Saturn files. I am not clear what you have done here, as I don't use PIPP for planetary at all in most cases.  I loaded it into Registax as if it was a file pre-processed in Autostakkert from a video.  The colour balance was awful, with hardly any blue.  I have sharpened it up a bit but it still looks bad.  Oddly there is hardly any noise.

TBH, given the likely value of the other gear involved, it would not be overkill to buy a used Win10 business laptop, and use it for image capture and processing. Then you can use all the popular astro programs, e.g  Sharpcap > .ser video > Autostakkert >tif > Registax.

If you reduce your ROI that will cut your raw file size, increase capture rate, and avoid filling your storage with data representing black sky.

Geoff,  I  have a macbook pro which I  Currently capture on. I then have a Mele mini PC which, in time,  I will use as my main capture PC  (altho I bought a 1TB NVMe drive for it and it is not 'seeing' it so, so far, a waste of cash. The Mele just has 128GB storage). I transfer from the macbook to the Mele inside and use the Windows applications to process. I also have a Mac Mini M1, on which I have Affinity Photo and Siril. I don't need more computers, I just need to get everything sorted. However, I won't use the Mele  with the LX10 because the LX10  is fork mounted and not goto. I will use the Mele  with my Skywatcher EQ5 and either the StarTravel 120 or the SVBony 503 70ED. At present, I'm building an obsy/shed for the EQ5 on a todmorden mount and won't be working out how  to hook everything up  until I'm finished  that little  project. So, meanwhile, I'm transferring from this  to that and trying  to  keep abreast (not well) of  what file is  what and where.

[StevieDvd]

Here's a quick edit of one of the first set. I opened it in Siril which is available for Mac and used the wavelet function. It is subject to personal colouring and could do with a sharpen but shows that data is there.

 

[Mark2022]

Just now, StevieDvd said:

Here's a quick edit of one of the first set. I opened it in Siril which is available for Mac and used the wavelet function. It is subject to personal colouring and could do with a sharpen but shows that data is there.

 

Cheers Steve but it's no different to what I've already produced in terms of detail. I'm looking for that far  finer detail as in the very first video and trying to figure out how to achieve  it or the fine detail which Kon manages to achieve with his 8 inch Dob.

[Mandy D]

56 minutes ago, Mark2022 said:

Mandy, the AVIs are up to 7 and 8GB.

So? Split them into smaller sections and send the m one at a time.

[StevieDvd]

34 minutes ago, Mark2022 said:

Cheers Steve but it's no different to what I've already produced in terms of detail. I'm looking for that far  finer detail as in the very first video and trying to figure out how to achieve  it or the fine detail which Kon manages to achieve with his 8 inch Dob.

Sorry I mistook the tif files for your processed results and looked for a Mac solution in software I have used. The tweak's can be done in Siril and have some planetary processing videos on you tube that you could follow.

 

[Kon]

I had a go at your original tiffs that you had and this is the best I could get for your Jupiter. It is very soft meaning that either focus is off or seeing was really bad. Could you see good details when you focused or you could not achieve this; later will happen on bad seeing? Not much you can do with these. They are a good start to improve on.

 

[Cosmic Geoff]

1 hour ago, Mark2022 said:

Mandy, the AVIs are up to 7 and 8GB.

There is no need to have files that long. Most of mine are around 350MB (320x240 & 500 frames).

If you can save .ser files instead of .avi you won't have to do a de-bayering operation on them.

[Mark2022]

1 hour ago, Kon said:

I had a go at your original tiffs that you had and this is the best I could get for your Jupiter. It is very soft meaning that either focus is off or seeing was really bad. Could you see good details when you focused or you could not achieve this; later will happen on bad seeing? Not much you can do with these. They are a good start to improve on.

 

That result of yours is interesting in itself and tells me a lot. I too could (and did) get that with processing but  wanted more  detail so pushed it. What you're saying with this is, if the original capture doesn't have the detail then you're not going  to get it because what you've done here  (which I assume you do as your norm) is very light wavelets and pretty much nothing else which means your captures are already displaying  a lot of detail. Therefore, as you've suggested, the original capture has to be pretty much already there. Now my  question is how you  have so much better seeing in Wiltshire than I did the other night when, to me, it was crystal clear.  That  said, it has just  jogged my memory that, by the time I was done for the night, I noticed I had a decent amount of dew build up on the corrector - not terrible but a fair bit. Believe  it or not (and I'm sure you will) I don't have a dew shield or heater at the moment. I guess it would help! 🙂

[Mark2022]

Question: Is there no improvement of resolution by choosing a higher resolution capture mode? If not, what's the point of higher resolution settings?

[Mark2022]

1 hour ago, Cosmic Geoff said:

There is no need to have files that long. Most of mine are around 350MB (320x240 & 500 frames).

If you can save .ser files instead of .avi you won't have to do a de-bayering operation on them.

Lots of things to change.  I'm just approaching this step by step to understand, if possible, what are the basic things I need to concentrate on to improve the most. Then next step and next step after that. I'll experiment with everything of course but the issue is - as you know - we get so very few good capture nights to 'waste' on experimenting when we want to capture stuff. Hence why I turn to those of you who can help, give suggestions and  advice.

[Kon]

9 hours ago, Mark2022 said:

That result of yours is interesting in itself and tells me a lot. I too could (and did) get that with processing but  wanted more  detail so pushed it. What you're saying with this is, if the original capture doesn't have the detail then you're not going  to get it because what you've done here  (which I assume you do as your norm) is very light wavelets and pretty much nothing else which means your captures are already displaying  a lot of detail. Therefore, as you've suggested, the original capture has to be pretty much already there. Now my  question is how you  have so much better seeing in Wiltshire than I did the other night when, to me, it was crystal clear.  That  said, it has just  jogged my memory that, by the time I was done for the night, I noticed I had a decent amount of dew build up on the corrector - not terrible but a fair bit. Believe  it or not (and I'm sure you will) I don't have a dew shield or heater at the moment. I guess it would help! 🙂

Yes if you don't have the details you will not recover them. I tried to push your image but it's soft.

The dew might be an issue. I don't have one either. Do you cool your telescope long enough? I usually leave mine out for a good 1hr.

Regarding location, I have a friend 20miles from me and we have both been out imaging at the same time and target and one of us can have better or worse seeing than the other, so local conditions will affect your seeing.

By the way, what time did you image Jupiter? I usually aim at it's highest point. These days I am imagining between 4-530am.

[Kon]

9 hours ago, Mark2022 said:

Lots of things to change.  I'm just approaching this step by step to understand, if possible, what are the basic things I need to concentrate on to improve the most. Then next step and next step after that. I'll experiment with everything of course but the issue is - as you know - we get so very few good capture nights to 'waste' on experimenting when we want to capture stuff. Hence why I turn to those of you who can help, give suggestions and  advice.

Yes experiment with the bad seeing even then you will see some differences and when the good seeing comes you will have a good feeling what to try. Keep an eye on Jetstream charts too.

[Cosmic Geoff]

11 hours ago, Mark2022 said:

Lots of things to change.  I'm just approaching this step by step to understand, if possible, what are the basic things I need to concentrate on to improve the most. Then next step and next step after that. I'll experiment with everything of course but the issue is - as you know - we get so very few good capture nights to 'waste' on experimenting when we want to capture stuff. Hence why I turn to those of you who can help, give suggestions and  advice.

You need to adopt a systematic approach, instead of searching for a magic bullet.

Choose the right observing time, get the focus right, get the video recorded right. Then choose a set of tools (as used by others) and use them systematically, keeping a note of what settings you have used.  If you keep the source videos filed by date, you can go back at any time and try re-processing with different settings, or different tools. Sort processed files in sub-directories.

If the source videos are no good, the final results won't be either.

[Mark2022]

4 hours ago, Kon said:

Yes if you don't have the details you will not recover them. I tried to push your image but it's soft.

The dew might be an issue. I don't have one either. Do you cool your telescope long enough? I usually leave mine out for a good 1hr.

Regarding location, I have a friend 20miles from me and we have both been out imaging at the same time and target and one of us can have better or worse seeing than the other, so local conditions will affect your seeing.

By the way, what time did you image Jupiter? I usually aim at it's highest point. These days I am imagining between 4-530am.

I'm imaging at around midnight to 3am. Yes, the scope is cooled for a good hour or more beforehand. By 3am it's probably around 50 deg up in the south east. I can't view  it on the meridian or past it since my view is blocked.

[Mark2022]

2 hours ago, Cosmic Geoff said:

You need to adopt a systematic approach, instead of searching for a magic bullet.

Choose the right observing time, get the focus right, get the video recorded right. Then choose a set of tools (as used by others) and use them systematically, keeping a note of what settings you have used.  If you keep the source videos filed by date, you can go back at any time and try re-processing with different settings, or different tools. Sort processed files in sub-directories.

If the source videos are no good, the final results won't be either.

I'm not searching for a 'magic bullet' Geoff. I recognise full well, there will be multiple improvements to make but I'm trying to identify what would make the biggest improvement. There will be some things which will improve by smaller amounts. 

Re the observing time: We never know that until we're out there seeing the 'seeing' and, to me, I've never yet seen a night where, on screen during capture, I can see the detail (even slightly) that Kon has in his photos. Then again, once more, I am focusing manually using the stock Meade focuser to  get roughly focused and then using an inline helical focuser  (which only, then, needs the slightest of turns to be in or out of focus - lucky if I need to turn it a tenth or twentieth of its full ability. As it should be I suppose because it's then focusing on a target  which was already roughly in focus anyhow). The video recording is the easy bit, I think. Down to 10ms or less and enough gain where it's not too dark and not too bright. No issues there. I'll keep to around 2 mins from now on.

I need  to do something about storage and work on the directories issue but that is not affecting the quality of images.

[Mark2022]

4 hours ago, Kon said:

Yes if you don't have the details you will not recover them. I tried to push your image but it's soft.

The dew might be an issue. I don't have one either. Do you cool your telescope long enough? I usually leave mine out for a good 1hr.

Regarding location, I have a friend 20miles from me and we have both been out imaging at the same time and target and one of us can have better or worse seeing than the other, so local conditions will affect your seeing.

By the way, what time did you image Jupiter? I usually aim at it's highest point. These days I am imagining between 4-530am.

That softness appears to be the primary issue and, while I've tried to change focus ever so slightly from one capture to another, I can't seem to rid myself of it.