Meade Infinity 102

[Mak the Night]

59 minutes ago, Dave In Vermont said:

Sounds good to me. I don't know if I tried that combo - yet. FK & Neodymium, that is. With my enormous outlay of filters, it's hard to tell. No Phasers though...Rats!

I own a condo myself. Ran the Condo-Association for 13 years before I threw the files at my neighbor. Now he's begging me to take it back!

No Way!

Dave

 

I'm guessing a condominium is like a block of flats or a maisonette right?

[Ray of LIght]

In my community there are only four units in a building. I have a townhouse, upstairs is two bedrooms and a bath and downstairs is another bedroom and a half bath. Plus of course a kitchen dining room and living room. My harley is in the garage. My driveway can fit three cars. That's about it!

[Mak the Night]

I think I understand. It's just the term 'condominium' isn't really used or understood here. I remember once trying to explain what an A to Z guidebook was to a friend of mine who was originally from New York. It took me a while to realise she was hearing the words 'A to Z' as 'A to Zed' (as we pronounce the letter 'z' as zed) and had no idea what it meant. It also took me a while to explain that  'subways' in the UK don't have trains in them lol. Don't get me started about trucks, lorries and juggernauts. ROTFL

In fact, I think it was the A to Z reference in this song by The Jam that was the source of her confusion.

[Dave In Vermont]

A condominium is a flat (or townhouse) you own, while the building & grounds are common-property that the Association (All the owners) owns and pays for the upkeep of. Some are the Ritz - Tennis Courts, Swimming Pools, Air-Conditioned Dog-Houses, etc. Mine is bare-bones. Just a matter of being frugal, like Vermont is famous for.

Dave

[Ray of LIght]

I am glad you explained my explanation. Lol ?

[Mak the Night]

Meanwhile ... the weather is still decidedly pants here. Talking of filters, although I have more Wratten coloured filters, only a No. 80A Blue and No.12 Deep Yellow usually get taken out in my box.

The Lumicons and TeleVue Bandmate are for use with the Big Cat.

I want to experiment more with the (Celestron, almost certainly GSO) 80A. The Deep Yellow No. 12 transmits 74% available light and I believe various yellow filters are utilised in ophthalmology and optometry and I believe the No. 12 was one of the earliest minus blue filters. It is also a longpass filter blocking visible wavelengths below 500 nm. They are often used in high contrast sunglasses for some sporting uses (e.g. target shooting). I've been mocked for spending 125 quid on the TeleVue Bandmate, but I've been told that with enough aperture it is like a neodymium on steroids. I may still see Mars with it with the Big Cat yet.

[Ray of LIght]

4 hours ago, Mak the Night said:

Meanwhile ... the weather is still decidedly pants here. Talking of filters, although I have more Wratten coloured filters, only a No. 80A Blue and No.12 Deep Yellow usually get taken out in my box.

The Lumicons and TeleVue Bandmate are for use with the Big Cat.

I want to experiment more with the (Celestron, almost certainly GSO) 80A. The Deep Yellow No. 12 transmits 74% available light and I believe various yellow filters are utilised in ophthalmology and optometry and I believe the No. 12 was one of the earliest minus blue filters. It is also a longpass filter blocking visible wavelengths below 500 nm. They are often used in high contrast sunglasses for some sporting uses (e.g. target shooting). I've been mocked for spending 125 quid on the TeleVue Bandmate, but I've been told that with enough aperture it is like a neodymium on steroids. I may still see Mars with it with the Big Cat yet.

I also have the 80A blue and, I believe, 12 yellow, so thanks for the great info! My Wratten filters, all four of them, are not the best quality (Gosky, Astromania or some such), but I can use them for now. I will check and let you know. 

[Ray of LIght]

Ok, I have a set of four. Besides the above 80A blue and no 12 yellow, I have a red and green. Other than the Wratten number there is no maker on the filters or the case. I will go on line and check my past orders.

[Ray of LIght]

They are imported by Gosky. The other two are 21 red and 56 green. I don't know how good they are. What's your take Mak?

[Mak the Night]

1 hour ago, Ray of LIght said:

They are imported by Gosky. The other two are 21 red and 56 green. I don't know how good they are. What's your take Mak?

Difficult to say without seeing them. I'm pretty convinced Celestron, TS Optics and Orion Wratten filters are all GSO. Although, the GSO and TS Optics seem to be made in Taiwan rather than mainland China. GSO is a Taiwanese company with factories in China. Either way, they all look suspiciously the same, except my Celestrons have 'China' written on them. I think yours should be fine Ray, I don't think it's worth spending too much on Wratten filters. Unless you find one or two that really work well for you. Then it might be worth upgrading, otherwise I'd just use what you've got. The Celestron ones look pretty decent to me.

Wratten filters are named after the British inventor Frederick Wratten who founded the first photographic company around 1877. Later, along with C. E. Kenneth Mees, dyed gelatin coloured filters were developed by the company and became known as Wratten filters. Their company was acquired by Eastman Kodak in 1912. Hence why filters are often referred to as Kodak Wratten filters.

The No. 21 Orange can work well on the Moon in daylight, although it does tend to make it look like a Terry's Chocolate Orange lol. I often thought the 21 gave a brighter lunar image than the No. 12, which is odd considering it is 28% less efficient with the available light. I'm a bit ambivalent about using Wratten filters for planetary viewing as I'm convinced at least a 2.5mm exit pupil would be preferable. My experiments on Jupiter last year with the 102mm Mak were not particularly successful. It may be different with a faster scope or bigger aperture though.

The info below is mostly gleaned from the Celestron Filter Guide. I've found the 80A useful sometimes on a bright Full Moon as it can reveal some features difficult to perceive if there is a glare. The No.12 is also useful on the Moon during daylight or twilight as it tends to turn the background sky black. Also, at a 74% transmission it is much less aggressive than a traditional 13% transmission No. 0.9 Neutral Density Moon filter (I have both Celestron and Baader 0.9 filters). I'm itching to try a Deep Yellow on Venus as well, although that will have to wait until next year. 

12 Deep Yellow (74% light transmission): Minus blue filter. Improves contrast.

Jupiter: Darkens atmospheric currents, enhances orange & red features.

Mars: Reduces blue & green light, darkens maria & oases, lightens desert regions.

Saturn: Darkens atmospheric currents, enhances red features of the belts.

Venus: Reveals low contrast surface features.

21 Orange (46% light transmission): Contrast filter for blue and blue-green absorption. Longpass filter blocking visible wavelengths below 530 nm.

Jupiter: Improves belt detail, enhances polar regions.

Mars: Similar to Wratten 12, also sharpens yellow dust cloud boundaries.

Saturn: Improves band structure, highlights blue polar regions.

Venus: Good for daylight observation to reduce sky brightness.

25 Red (Tricolour A, 14% light transmission): Used for colour separation and infrared photography. Longpass filter blocking below 580 nm.  

Jupiter: Useful on blue clouds.

Mars: Useful in observation of polar caps, sharpens boundaries of dust clouds.

Saturn: Useful on blue clouds.

Venus: Useful in daylight observing, can also make deformations in the terminator visible.

 

56 Light Green (53% light transmission).

Jupiter: Increases visibility of the Great Red Spot.

Mars: Increases contrast of polar caps.

Venus: Useful for studying cloud formations.

58 Green (Tricolour B, 24% light transmission): Colour separation.

Jupiter: Increases GRS visibility, useful for low contrast blue & red atmospheric hues.

Mars: Increases contrast of polar caps & low clouds.

Saturn: Enhances white atmospheric features.

Venus: Useful for cloud studies.

80A Blue (30% light transmission): Colour Conversion. Raises the colour temperature.

Jupiter: Enhances boundaries between the reddish belts, useful for GRS.

Mars: Very useful during the *Violet Clearing, helps studying surface features and polar caps.

Saturn: Enhances low contrast features.

Venus: Increases contrast in dark shadings in upper atmospheric clouds.

 

*Violet Clearing ~ an infrequent or rare clearing where surface features can allegedly be observed with a blue or violet filter which some have speculated to be an optical illusion.

[Ray of LIght]

Once again great info Mak! It seems the four filters in the set I bought are fairly useful I imagine. They look well made. Considering the Baader filters I have (and will have) and the moon filter I also have, I doubt I will be using these a whole lot. I can use the chart for certain applications of course. I'm sure they are good to have in my kit. Back in a bit.

[Mak the Night]

3 hours ago, Ray of LIght said:

Once again great info Mak! It seems the four filters in the set I bought are fairly useful I imagine. They look well made. Considering the Baader filters I have (and will have) and the moon filter I also have, I doubt I will be using these a whole lot. I can use the chart for certain applications of course. I'm sure they are good to have in my kit. Back in a bit.

I'm not sure how useful Wratten filters are generally, but I am interested in their lunar use in varying conditions. The blurb below is from GSO I think. The Light Yellow has an 83% transmission.

The # 8 Light Yellow Filter enhances detail of red and orange-coloured phenomena in the belts of Jupiter. It increases contrast of the blue-coloured Maria on Mars by reducing scattered light from these areas, while allowing passage of more green light thus highlighting yellow dust clouds as well. The light yellow filter is popularly used to enhance lunar features, particularly in small telescopes (below 8"). In comets, it brings out highlights in yellowish dust tails and enhances the coma.

The #11 Yellow-Green Filter colour contrasts well with the red and blue characteristics of surface features on Jupiter and, to some degree, Saturn. It darkens the Maria visible on Mars and accentuates the Cassini Division in Saturn's rings.

I'm thinking of pulling the trigger on these, they aren't expensive, Agena sell the GSO badged ones and TS Optics also sell them.

I've added a couple of PDF's that you may find interesting.

 

 

SAS-The-Use-of-Astronomical-Filters1.pdf

Eastman Kodak Company ~ Transmission of Wratten Filters.pdf

[Ray of LIght]

Great Mak! Agena has them for 12.50 US, thats good. If I was to order just one of the two today, which one would you get? I will probably order the UHC-S tomorrow. 

[Ray of LIght]

I'm thinking no 11 yellow-green, and that's it.  But I would love your opinion first. I'm reading conflicting descriptions about large apertures etc, but that it is good with fast refracters. Oh boy.

[Ray of LIght]

I am ordering the no 11 yellow-green for now. After the UHC-S I can always get the other, no 8. Hopefully be done with filters after that, otherwise I will be proving Dave right, lol ? !

[Ray of LIght]

Well, the no 8 was OOS at Agena so I got what they had for now. I guess 12.50 well spent, we will see! Talk later.

[Mak the Night]

12 minutes ago, Ray of LIght said:

Well, the no 8 was OOS at Agena so I got what they had for now. I guess 12.50 well spent, we will see! Talk later.

I was just curios about the No. 8 and the No. 11. Primarily as the No.8 is supposed to work well with smaller apertures and absorbs more blue than No. 3. It is also a longpass K2 filter blocking visible wavelengths below 465 nm. I found the No. 12 Deep Yellow a bit aggressive at high magnifications on a 102mm Mak. I want to try it with the Bazooka, although I think the No. 8 might be a better bet with apertures under 150mm. The No. 11 is a bit of a curiosity in itself. It is considered to be a colour correction filter and is not a longpass filter. Although both filters are considered as contrast filters. Finally, my curiosity got the better of me, so I pulled the trigger on both of them. lol

[Ray of LIght]

I got the one in stock, so will give it a try. Can this be used on the eyepiece and still keep my neodynium and FK on my diagonal? Or, at least give it a try?

[Mak the Night]

IDK about the No. 11, it's 78% transmission so might be OK for a 102mm scope when stacked with others. I've got a funny feeling it acts a bit like a fringe killer anyway. I don't plan on stacking it with anything. The Baader Neodymium doesn't seem to do a great deal for Saturn, I'm glad Stu verified this, as I thought it was just me, so I want to try it there.

[Ray of LIght]

Oh well, I got the one Agena had in stock. Won't get it for a couple of days anyway. Perhaps I can experiment with it by itself, like you, and see what it does. When the no 8 is in stock I can get that and put it to bed. In the meantime I can use the Baader filters I have.

[Mak the Night]

Unfortunately, with the the thunderstorms, I won't be experimenting with filters anytime soon!

[Dave In Vermont]

Today was looking good, weather-wise, for getting in some viewing. The temperature was rising. And it was starting to get dark - YAY! And then I looked up and saw a wide belt of black clouds heading straight for my location. This wasn't in my local forecast! It arrived.....

The rain has been pouring for a few hours now. And the pathological-liar, er - ummmm - 'Weather-Man' on the news is telling us on TV-News that the forecast for tomorrow is looking great!

Back to working on my ark..... Oh wait a moment!

You have that Barlowed-Beast you call your 'Bazooka' MTN? Meet my Little-Friend! It my 'Howitzer!' That's the GSO ED 2" Barlow, and my 80° 30mm 2" ST80 (it calls itself) 1rpd. EP. Many thought these were as good as a TV Nagler. Came out around 2003 - and then vanished. No one seems to know who was behind these.

'Til later -

Dave

 

 

[Ray of LIght]

Your weather is pants, my arm is pants ?. What a nightmare. Oh well, guess I'm gonna have to order the Baader UHC-S now ?! Agena here I come!

[Dave In Vermont]

40 minutes ago, Ray of LIght said:

Your weather is pants, my arm is pants ?. What a nightmare. Oh well, guess I'm gonna have to order the Baader UHC-S now ?! Agena here I come!

Sounds like a plan to me - Go For It!

<Us Filter-Nuts love to see our affliction spread!>

And I too pulled the trigger yesterday, after sitting on the proverbial 'fence' long enough to qualify for a "At least I tried to resist!" justification! I went ahead and ordered the 1.25" 80° 11mm from University Optics out in Michigan. Now I won't have to wander about with my 10mm 80° Speer-Waler. The 11mm will fit that niche in my collection quite well. And it will be just a hair less power than the 10mm in my Maksutov 150mm F/12. I'd prefer a bit under 180X as it will be more usable on 'iffy' 'seeing' nights. On the rare occasions of spectacular 'seeing' nights, I have plenty of high-powered EP's to work with.

Lordy!

Dave

[Ray of LIght]

7 hours ago, Dave In Vermont said:

Sounds like a plan to me - Go For It!

<Us Filter-Nuts love to see our affliction spread!>

And I too pulled the trigger yesterday, after sitting on the proverbial 'fence' long enough to qualify for a "At least I tried to resist!" justification! I went ahead and ordered the 1.25" 80° 11mm from University Optics out in Michigan. Now I won't have to wander about with my 10mm 80° Speer-Waler. The 11mm will fit that niche in my collection quite well. And it will be just a hair less power than the 10mm in my Maksutov 150mm F/12. I'd prefer a bit under 180X as it will be more usable on 'iffy' 'seeing' nights. On the rare occasions of spectacular 'seeing' nights, I have plenty of high-powered EP's to work with.

Lordy!

Dave

I guess it was that kind of day! If I'm not mistaken Mak got a couple of filters too. If the pain and swelling in my arm goes down a little, the entire weekend looks clear down here. Will see. Good luck with the 11mm UO. With my scope, if I use either my 2.5x HPS or my new TV 3x with the X-Cel 9mm I will get 166x or 200x respectively. Of course I have many combinations at this point, but unless I am looking at DSO's, a Barlow will be needed to get me to higher magnifications. I can remove the Barlow for DSO's. All in all I am happy with the upgrades and additions I have made to my 102. Your weather still pants Mak? Talk to you guys later.