alanjgreen

Mark,

Firstly, I dont want to get into one of these "my setup is best so lets write something to make me fell good about what I spent on all this kit".

The first thing is you need to state what solar scope you own? Then we can offer a targeted response to whether double stacking will offer a "better" visual view.

As stated above double stacking does dim the image (this is a disadvantage) - if your scope has small aperture and the image is already dim then this may push you over the edge. If you decide to add a front etalon that is not full aperture such as adding a front 50mm to a 60mm scope then this is also going to cut your brightness by an increased amount.

To the question "will I see more" then it is a fact that a double etalon changes the bandpass and allows more to be seen.

My history in solar:

I started with a single stack tilt tune LS60 (in 2013 when the sun was active on the surface) and liked the view but wanted to see more surface detail (detail that I could turn the focuser and actually see in sharp focus).

I sold that scope.

Next I purchased a double stack pressure tuned LS60 (with DS60 front etalon) as a "matched" pair from Lunt. The view was beyond compare to what the single stack LS60 could provide. The sheer amount of features available to be seen on the solar surface was increased many fold. I was able to tune the scope and focus in sharply on these features. Sure the image was slightly darker but it never bothered me in any way.

Now I am binoviewing the DS60 setup which has further dimmed the image but not to my dissactisfaction and the view IMHO is better than one eye with the same scope.

Finaly, I added a "rotator" and discovered that rotating the front etalon also allows more solar features to come in and out of view. This would be impossible in a single stack scope.

I have absolutely no intention of selling this solar scope and love the views it has given me over the 4 years that I have owned it. I would not go back to single stack and find it odd that anyone says they would (but thats my humble opinion and I am entitled to it!).

I have never tried an LS80 so whether thats better or not I cannot say. But I did plenty of research on DEDICATED solar forums before I spent £1000s and the opinion there was that double stack "shows more stuff".

I suggest that you tell us what solar scope you have (if you have one) and that you seek out these dedicated solar forums where you will quickly be able to search out 100s of posts of people asking the same question and read the responses they received but do take some responses with a "pinch of salt". Solar is an expensive hobby and unfortunately there are too many people wanting to convince themselves they spent wisely and bought the best kit or state opinions after having spent 5 minutes looking through someone elses scope  (not referring to anyone above in this comment but its a fact).

Finally, bear in mind that the sun is not doing much in Ha at the moment (compared to solar max in 2014) so what you are going to see is pretty thin gruel on offer. You may be better getting a good single stack scope and planning to add a full aperture double stack later when the solar cycle increases (may be a few years yet )

If you don't own a scope then second hand bargains do come up but most second hand scopes are for sale "over priced" so consider carefully before jumping on one of them.

HTH,

Alan

Here is my updated eyepiece case for a summer of "night vision exploration"...

Back row: Televue 55mm Plossl, 35mm Panoptic, 27mm Panoptic, 14mm Delos, 18.2mm Delite, Paracorr2

Front row: TNVC afocal adapter (connects PVS-14 to Televue Dioptrx), PVS-14 Night Vision Device, Televue Ethos 10mm

Now on with the voyage of discovery...

Alan

Just received a 2 inch "Astronomik H-alpha 6nm Narrowband CCD Filter" from Modern Astronomy (Thanks Bernard)

Another piece in the Night Vision puzzle...

Alan

26 minutes ago, Louis D said:

Are the axes clutched on that AZ Pronto mount in some manner such that you don't have to turn the slow motion controls to move the scope from one target to another in the sky?

If you watch the video then you will see that the mount has clutches for large manual movements  

10 minutes ago, britto765 said:

Thanks for the advice all, im not sure what to buy yet. 130p flextube looks good but what tripod would i need for it? 

You could put it on a pronto or az5 but why bother when you can get the same 130mm reflector if you get either 130ps bundles.

check the prices for a standalone az5 or pronto (just the tripod, no scope)... The bundles linked above offer you the best value, they are almost giving the scope away at the bundle prices!

29 minutes ago, britto765 said:

Would the Celestron PS1000 Newtonian Reflector be any good? 

No. You need to buy a telescope from a telescope specialist not Jessops!

if FLO don’t stock it then it’s no good.

the ps1000 is yet another cheap scope on a cheap EQ mount.

go with the 130ps on AZ pronto mount. You won’t get better for 200£

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/sky-watcher-az-pronto/sky-watcher-explorer-130ps-az-pronto.html

as @Ricochet says, get the AZ5 mount for the extra 50£ if you can afford it.

BUT STAY AWAY FROM JESSOPS, you are not buying a camera!

Alan

1 hour ago, Alan White said:

I am considering delites or naglers too.

The delite's are very comfy to use and lightweight for sure. But 18.2 is as low as they go. Nothing around 24mm? 20mm eye relief if you wear glasses but do you want 60 degree for a low power EP?

They are super comfortable and like the Ethos, your eye can be anywhere and you get a view (I found it impossible to get a blackout in mine, I tried and tried  )

I only sold them as I needed the cash for more Ethos when I got the big dob.

( Still have the pan24's though - would never part with them  )

24 Panoptic is a great EP. A definite "keeper". I have two as I also binoview with them.

The benefits are far more than just "weight"!

They show minute details so clearly. Its great at splitting tight double stars.

love mine, would never sell!

don't let people who don't have one put you off  

15 minutes ago, Mr niall said:

is there a way you can tell which way is the “right way round” on initial setup?

Yep, make sure you mount the scope tube pointing in the same direction as in this picture (you can see the BACK of the MOUNT in the pic)

Looks like the red button is on the front of the scope side - I would use that as the "guide"

HTH, Alan

Just download and install "cfm", run this with the scope connected. It will find and download the correct updates for you...

http://www.nexstarsite.com/OddsNEnds/HCFirmwareUpgradeHowToNexStarPlus.htm

16 minutes ago, RobertI said:

I have used a dictaphone on many occasions to record my observations at the scope. I have found this a very good way of capturing a lot of information including comments I probably wouldn’t write down at the eyepiece. This helps to bring the observing reports alive when I share them on SGL. Apart from my SGL reports I don’t really record my obs (perhaps I should), but I have created an Observing list in Sky Safari and I include all the objects I have observed for future reference. 

I talk (mutter, sing, swear) to myself too much for this to work   People would think I am insane if I played it back (maybe I am to be out in the cold at night).

I even talk to the cat when she decides to hop up on the shed side!

I always keep a log. I note down date, start time (& end time), moon size at the top

then 

target, ( eyepiece&filter, observation notes ) repeat per EP or filter 

I keep them brief and may just note differences from one EP to another.

Sometimes I sketch (they are rough and crap drawings of galaxy arms and x marks the spot for galaxy contents usually). I always sketched planet Mars and wrote the time so I could compare to sky safari later. I try to get something that's just good enough to compare to an image in the morning  when I rejoin the dots.

I used to rarely reread mine unless it was 12 months later and I just wanted to check what was hot at the same time last year.

I use them now to drive a write up on sgl the next day. My write up will have more info that comes to mind from the brief notes that I took in my pad.

Since I have been writing them up on SGL, I feel that I have more of a memory of previous outings when next at the eyepiece. Plus I enjoy trying to add in bits of humour...

Here are some pages from my pad...

Of course, the luxury of a shed with a desk really helps with all this

Alan

3 hours ago, Live_Steam_Mad said:

I notice that Baader do a 1.25x GPC for your Mark V ;-

http://www.baader-planetarium.com/en/accessories/optical-accessories/barlow-lenses-coma-and-glaspathcorrectors/glaspathcorrectorr-1125-for-baader-mark-v-großfeld-binocular.html

...as well as one for the MaxBright binoviewer. Have you tried or thought of trying this to reduce the magnification with your LS60? I wonder if it would allow eyepieces to come to focus with a Mark V or MaxBright in my smaller Lunt 50 ?

Regards,

Alistair G.

No, I do not own the x1.25. I did not think it would be enough for me to reach focus so I have not bought one  

As my main binoviewer eyepieces are the 24 and 19 panoptics, the x1.7 works well to hit the sweet spot magnifications for my double stack setup. Although i dream of a pair of 18.2 delite to try with my setup, I just cannot justify buying them when I already have the panoptic 19s and Delos 17.3 pairs  )

The ls60 produces a much brighter image than the ls50 so magnification is less of an issue. Plus I am not a believer in too much magnification for the sun. The panoptic24mm acting as a 15mm picks out so many details with a crisp sharp focus, that I always end up coming back to them (after trying more magnification) they give a wonderful immersive relaxed view.

You can test your setup as it is now. If you can almost reach focus then a x1.25 may be ok. If you are nowhere near then better buy x1.7 instead. Or play around with some barlows... if you own some barlows try them as they are for the full stated x whatever magnification value, then remove the lens from the Barlow and attach it direct to bino for a reduced magnification x value.

Alan

13 hours ago, Paul73 said:

So what is going to fill all of that spare space?

Eyepice cases abhor a vacuum....

Paul

Thats my "filter" space!

I remove them from their boxes and place them there - UHC (left), O3 (right) and Hb (centre) - then I can grab them in the dark

It also gives me a "soft landing" zone should I drop a filter while fitting/removing them to the Paracorr2!

Here is my 100 degree eyepiece collection that I use with my big dob!

I just added a "used" 6mm Ethos to the box (fitted with a TeleVue "barrel extension" & "2 inch parfocal ring" to allow me to use it in the Paracorr2 at the same setting as the Ethos 13 & 10mm)

Now looking forward to using it in Big Dob to see what it can do !

Alan

To anyone buying new Manfrotto gear. Manfrotto have a free gift offer running until 31 December 

https://www.manfrotto.co.uk/completechristmas

Simply apply online using link above. You will need to upload your sales invoice and fill in a few fields in... takes only a minute or two 

My free gift (tripod head) arrived in less than a week!

Merry Xmas, Alan

On 06/10/2017 at 15:45, 25585 said:

I would like to try a 31mm Nagler as it's eye relief is 19mm. Need a store with it in stock. 

Used to own one. A lovely EP. Very comfortable to use. Find a picture on here of one next to a baked bean can, they are very big ( the Terminagler)

only sold mine as the Ethos 21 was a better match to my super fast Dob. They do come up occasionally second hand.

Alan

Nice one John.

Astronomy is about patience and perseverance for sure. Glad you have seen this object with your own mark one eyeball !

And great write-up too.

Now you have your reward, it's time to dream of the next target or perhaps now you can sell up and retire ? (Only joking)

Alan

18 hours ago, Hairy Gazer said:

The bit I'm missing is if most people use a low magnification, then why bother buying powerful scopes, if your only going to use the same magnification as that of a smaller scopes. 

I know you get a lot more light through, but at low magnification, does the extra light really make that much difference? 

Hi Hairy Gazer,

I like the sound of "powerful scopes"!

The key you are missing, is APERTURE

Imagine your pupil at a size of 1-5mm looking up at the night sky, you see X stars

Now imagine your pupil at 130mm (like a 130mm aperture scope) looking up at the night sky, you see 10X stars

Now imagine your pupil at 500mm (like my 20" dobsonian scope) looking up at the night sky, you see 100X stars

The "power" of the scope is in the amount of light that it can capture coming from those far away light sources. A 20" scope at x150 magnification will produce a much brighter image than a smaller scope at x150 magnification. That brighter image should reveal details not seen in the smaller scope.

Magnification is the enemy of the observer believe it or not! If you consider the total light from my examples above produces an image of BRIGHTNESS Y at the eyepiece then every time you increase the magnification you reduce the brightness of the image (Y/2, Y/4 etc)

Therefore a big aperture scope and mid/low magnification should produce a highly detailed bright image...

Then we have to throw in the factor of the earths mushy atmosphere that impacts that view, the bigger the scope the more susceptible to the atmosphere it becomes as the big scope can "see" the atmosphere and this impacts the view, another reason to keep the magnification low.

Its a complicated equation and magnification is just a factor within it. Seems obvious that all I need is x1000 magnification to see "the Apollo mission leftover equipment on the moon surface", but all you will see at that magnification is a "mushy fuzzy image thats impossible to bring to focus" at the eyepiece.

This is why we need many eyepieces at our disposal so we can play to the strenghts of (1) the scope (2) the conditions (3) the target.

You should look to get x50, x100, x150, x200 & x250 magnifications covered for your scope

Manufacturers like to quote the "aperture rule" which says the maximum magnification for your scope if x50 per inch (25mm) of aperture - this is never achievable (nor desirable) in real life.

HTH,

Alan

Yes, I had to do this so don’ t panic

Here are some user instructions from members of teamcelestron (incl. me) who have had this same scenario

Background info

There are 31.5 full turns on the thread. I plan to do a manual align, so the telescope waits for me to decide where to point it before each capture, but leave it pointing at the same patch of sky each time. If exact focus isn't required I'm assuming start at one end then if "too few stars" turn it 360 before trying again. Once I've identified the range where it's finding stars I guess I can try and get a more exact focus i.e. Using quarter turns...
 

Steps of original poster

Started with it screwed right in and repeated the first step of a manual align until stars were identified, each time unscrewing the lens by half a turn. Each attempt took about 15 seconds; stars appeared after 15 half turns, then disappeared at 19. Difficult to get the optimum position in terms of numbers of stars, so ended up with it midway between those two points. Took about 15 minutes in all.

What I did

based on the above info. When my camera was out of focus after I removed the lens cover for cleaning. To start, I screwed the cover all the way in then backed it out 15 half turns. I ran the camera align and noted the number of stars reported as found. Then I unscrewed a further half turn and repeated the test align. I found that unscrewing by 17 half turns reported the maximum "100 stars found" and left it at that!

HTH,

Alan

Pluton,

What is your budget?

Best bargain at the moment is this 2nd hand LS60 (much better than either LS50 or PST!)

http://www.astrobuysell.com/uk/propview.php?view=130323

- this is a good deal for someone!

- assume you are in the UK?

Otherwise, look out for a good 2nd hand Lunt, you do find the occasional good deal but most people still ask too much for a LS60 tilt tuned unfortunately. There are good savings to be made 2nd hand especially now the sun is dropping in the sky and daylight hours are reducing...

Alan

I think that binoviewing a double stack ls50 will give a very dim image. Probably a step too far. 

My experience with binoviewing the double stack ls60 (with 60mm DS) is that it is very good. I never use single eye anymore for solar.

i also recommend people with ls60 scopes and  ds60 double stacks look into the m90 rotators that allow you to turn the DS unit while looking through the eyepiece- more detail can suddenly appear as you rotate the front DS unit based on the conditions.

its a case of matching both etalons to the conditions to tease out the extra filament or too.

https://www.teleskop-express.de/shop/product_info.php/info/p4295_TS-Optics-360--Rotation-with-M90-thread.html

just rotate the inner section (where the 3 finger holes are) to REVEAL the hidden screws

i do not mean the outer rim - this holds the whole secondary assembly to the front corrector glass plate

On 01/08/2017 at 14:28, Bigwings said:

If it works well with SkySense?

Will it work with Wifi AND the SkySense handset or do you have to use one or the other?

Me thinks my order will be in soon..

Sky safari 5 works with star sense and no handset so I would expect this mount will too. Leave the starsense handset in the box and let sky safari control the starsense hardware.

1 hour ago, Mark at Beaufort said:

Some advice about this new mount please. I have never owned a goto mount nor do I have any real experience with them. I have used my little tablet (Android) and I think I have downloaded the correct App - picture below. Tell me if this is the wrong App.

So if I purchase one of these mounts I assume I use the settings on the tablet to connect to the wifi on the mount? Once connected I use the tablet to pick a star for alignment? Then I can open up the DSO list and let the scope goto the object?

As regards power supply I just wonder how long the 8 AA batteries will last? If I take the mount to the United States I don't want to take a large power supply hence the info on 8 AA batteries.

 

Nearly correct. Here are the steps with Nexus... (on my dob)

Search for wifi signal with phone/ipad and connect to it (in the settings menu on the ipad for example) - hopefully it has no password needed.

You will need at least a 2 star alignment I would expect if you want decent accuracy. So, select your chosen 1st alignment star in the app & manualy align the scope to the star (in finder then in eyepiece - use mid to high power EP for better accuracy). Choose a star above 60 degrees.

Click "align" in the app once the 1st star is centered in the EP.

Move the scope to the 2nd star (at least 90 degrees away from the 1st and above 60 degrees) - Maybe you can goto the 2nd star and then just manually adjust (celestron auto-2 star is auto on the 2nd star - I have never used skywatcher)

Select the star in the app (the app may have tracked the manual movement and be close to the 2nd star anyway (Nexus does this))

Center in the finder and EP once again

Click "align" in the app once you have it centered in the EP.

You should now be ready, test out the alignment by goto an object.

HTH,

Alan