Star field 102 Reducer recommendation

[Ratlet]

I'm going to get a Star field 102 fpl53, primarily for visual but it's also going to replace my 130pds for imaging and for a foray into EAA as that basically what my imaging is as I don't do much processing.  I'm having a look at flatteners/reducers and I was wondering if anyone has any recommendations.

I see there is a wide range, from 0.6 to just a flattener.  Anyone got any experience or advice?

Is there an advantage to the matched adjustable one?  I've got a fairly wide range of m48 spacers so getting correct back focus shouldn't be an issue I'd have thought.

[WolfieGlos]

Love my Starfield 102, used only for imaging I purchased mine last April with this adjustable reducer and it hasn’t let me down. Using this and imaging at f5.6 is better than the flattener and imaging at f7, which you would find to be really slow compared to the 130pds at f5.

I had several issues achieving backfocus with my previous scope (Evostar 72ed) with a non-adjustable flattener - and spacers were the bane of my life for that. Hated them. The adjustable version for the 102ed made it a lot easier.

I didn’t realise there was a 0.6 reducer though? That might interest me…

Edited February 24 by WolfieGlos

[Ratlet]

3 minutes ago, WolfieGlos said:

Love my Starfield 102, used only for imaging I purchased mine last April with this adjustable reducer and it hasn’t let me down. Using this and imaging at f5.6 is better than the flattener and imaging at f7, which you would find to be really slow compared to the 130pds at f5.

I had several issues achieving backfocus with my previous scope (Evostar 72ed) with a non-adjustable flattener - and spacers were the bane of my life for that. Hated them. The adjustable version for the 102ed made it a lot easier.

I didn’t realise there was a 0.6 reducer though? That might interest me…

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/stellamira-telescopes/stellamira-2-06x-reducer-field-flattener-with-m48-adapter.html

Not a matched one, but I think it would work?

I' hadn't really thought too much about speed thus far, but right enough I usually stop my vintage glass down to 5.6 so Ive unintentionally been imaging about the same f ratio on everything I've got.

You've got some absolutely cracking images with your canon posted.  Is it astro modified?  Might have to dig mine out, I've got a 533 sensor which can be a smidge restrictive on the fov, but zero dark current to worry about 

[Second Time Around]

The Stella Mira 0.6x reducer wouldn't come to focus with my 72ED.  However, FLO will refund you if it doesn't work with your scope.

[step_hen]

I use the same reducer as WolfieGlos on my Starfield. Works very well. The 0.6x reducer looks interesting. Anyone got any real world experience of using it with the Starfield? 

 

[Veej]

Ive been using both the Starfield adjustable 0.8x reducer and the Stellamira flattener with my 102ED - both are great and have never caused me problems.

I do keep eyeing up the 0.6x reducer from Stellamira - i think i might have a go on one of these this week.

[WolfieGlos]

1 hour ago, Ratlet said:

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/stellamira-telescopes/stellamira-2-06x-reducer-field-flattener-with-m48-adapter.html

Not a matched one, but I think it would work?

You've got some absolutely cracking images with your canon posted.  Is it astro modified?  Might have to dig mine out, I've got a 533 sensor which can be a smidge restrictive on the fov, but zero dark current to worry about 

Thanks 🙂 Yes, it is Astro modded - I purchased directly from Astronomiser, he bought a second hand 800d from MPb, then modded it and had it to me in 1 week.

Dark current and noise are a bit of a pain, I have a 585 and the loss of that noise is incredible. As a result I’ve been looking at a 533 or 2600 for much later this year. Would prefer the 2600, but at that cost a 533mono with filters comes into play too… 

On the reducer…

15 minutes ago, Veej said:

Ive been using both the Starfield adjustable 0.8x reducer and the Stellamira flattener with my 102ED - both are great and have never caused me problems.

I do keep eyeing up the 0.6x reducer from Stellamira - i think i might have a go on one of these this week.

Interesting, the 0.6 would bring the Starfield down to circa f4 at 430mm focal length! It says it’s designed for scopes of f7 and slower so in theory it would work…

Does it attach to the starfield 102? The scope has an M63 connection and the Stellamira flattener has m48, so it appears that an adapter would be needed. This would certainly get my attention if it works…

Edited February 24 by WolfieGlos

[Veej]

the Stellamira ones dont use a screw connector like the official Starfield one, they have a 2" nose piece that is clamped in place by the scope. the M48 / M42 connector is on the camera side of the adaptor. On the plus side, it makes it very easy to rotate the camera as required and i havnt had any issues with loosening or movement.

[WolfieGlos]

14 minutes ago, Veej said:

the Stellamira ones dont use a screw connector like the official Starfield one, they have a 2" nose piece that is clamped in place by the scope. the M48 / M42 connector is on the camera side of the adaptor. On the plus side, it makes it very easy to rotate the camera as required and i havnt had any issues with loosening or movement.

Ah, good point.

I’m always dubious with the nosepiece/clamp, do you suffer any tilt or other issues using that type of connection? I used it for my 585 with a Barlow for some planetary, but I felt like the screwed fit is more robust. If you do try the 0.6, I’d be interested in seeing what you achieve 👍 

Edited February 24 by WolfieGlos

[Veej]

I must admit, a screw makes me happier ( as it were! ) The nosepiece / clamp combo seems solid - I've had a Qhy268m with QHY 7 slot filter wheel hanging from it with no issues and it gives me nice round stars across the field on long exposures.

[Elp]

I've used the SM 0.8x one fine.

[Ratlet]

38 minutes ago, WolfieGlos said:

Thanks 🙂 Yes, it is Astro modded - I purchased directly from Astronomiser, he bought a second hand 800d from MPb, then modded it and had it to me in 1 week.

Dark current and noise are a bit of a pain, I have a 585 and the loss of that noise is incredible. As a result I’ve been looking at a 533 or 2600 for much later this year. Would prefer the 2600, but at that cost a 533mono with filters comes into play too… 

On the reducer…

Interesting, the 0.6 would bring the Starfield down to circa f4 at 430mm focal length! It says it’s designed for scopes of f7 and slower so in theory it would work…

Does it attach to the starfield 102? The scope has an M63 connection and the Stellamira flattener has m48, so it appears that an adapter would be needed. This would certainly get my attention if it works…

Weirdly I've though of the opposite direction, I've have the 533 colour from Altair and have often thought I'd have been better getting the 535 as I don't really look for that much out of my images and certainly don't spend more than an hour processing.  Just not really using it to its full potential.

I'm kind of drawn to the 0.6 not so much the speed but the focal length which would be quite nice for a lot of nebula with the 533.  

[Elp]

The SF102 I find is an odd focal length, not quite long enough for the small stuff, not quite short enough for the common nebulae no matter the reducer being used. I guess it depends on the camera being used.

[WolfieGlos]

On 24/02/2024 at 12:39, Ratlet said:

I'm kind of drawn to the 0.6 not so much the speed but the focal length which would be quite nice for a lot of nebula with the 533.  

Hi Ratlet, did you ever try the 0.6 reducer with the Starfield 102? Or @Veej? 

I’m back to considering a 533mm/2600mc, and having looked at framing targets I see exactly what you mean now, which makes the 2600mc a little more appealing. 2600mm is out of the question based on cost, so a 0.6 reducer helps the cause for the 533! 

[Ratlet]

5 hours ago, WolfieGlos said:

Hi Ratlet, did you ever try the 0.6 reducer with the Starfield 102? Or @Veej? 

I’m back to considering a 533mm/2600mc, and having looked at framing targets I see exactly what you mean now, which makes the 2600mc a little more appealing. 2600mm is out of the question based on cost, so a 0.6 reducer helps the cause for the 533! 

No, nights have been too short that it wasn't a priority.  Need to get looking again myself.

[Elp]

0.6x might be extremely difficult to get flat, I've tried with my Z61 and still haven't got there.

[Ratlet]

1 hour ago, Elp said:

0.6x might be extremely difficult to get flat, I've tried with my Z61 and still haven't got there.

Aye, one of the comments on FLO said as much.  Probably for for an x0.8.  still got a canon t3i which would do for a wider view.

[WolfieGlos]

Starfield actually have a 0.6x reducer available on their website, along with a whole host of other scopes, accessories, etc.

It does say it’s compatible with f6 or longer refractors with a 2” focuser. It looks like it clamps in, so could be an option.

[Elp]

That flattener/reducer comes in all sorts of guises so it's a generic one. The one I'm using is 0.65x, and it still doesn't get quite flat, I'm only using a 183 mainly, getting the outer flat is extremely difficult or next to impossible. There's a reason most brands don't go beyond 0.8x. It may be possible, but I havent tuned it yet and don't really expect it to. If you're willing to accept you may not get a flat field, and can make use of a crop then it's useful, I certainly like the 234mm FL FOV I get out of my Z61 from the native 360mm.

[Ratlet]

16 minutes ago, Elp said:

That flattener/reducer comes in all sorts of guises so it's a generic one. The one I'm using is 0.65x, and it still doesn't get quite flat, I'm only using a 183 mainly, getting the outer flat is extremely difficult or next to impossible. There's a reason most brands don't go beyond 0.8x. It may be possible, but I havent tuned it yet and don't really expect it to. If you're willing to accept you may not get a flat field, and can make use of a crop then it's useful, I certainly like the 234mm FL FOV I get out of my Z61 from the native 360mm.

What sensor are you using?  I've found the 533 to be pretty good at self cropping due to the small size of the sensor.  In my 130pds I don't need to use a coma corrector and maintained decent stars.  Well decent enough.

I'll need to have a think!  Not too keen on the T2 fitting to the scope, prefer to go for m48 but flo are out of the the m48 variants for the next couple of months.

[Elp]

3 minutes ago, Ratlet said:

What sensor are you using?

A 183 mainly, it's 13 x 9mm sensor isn't far off the 11 x 11 of the 533, the sqaure sensor on the latter is actually the ideal sensor shape in the absence of circular sensors.

You can see the elongation here, one of my first with this reducer but you can see the problem I have with it:

What fitting/adaptor are you after?

[Ratlet]

7 minutes ago, Elp said:

A 183 mainly, it's 13 x 9mm sensor isn't far off the 11 x 11 of the 533, the sqaure sensor on the latter is actually the ideal sensor shape in the absence of circular sensors.

You can see the elongation here, one of my first with this reducer but you can see the problem I have with it:

What fitting/adaptor are you after?

Going to be honest mate, stars look fine to me.  Might take a punt on a 0.6.

Was thinking about how to attach the reducer to the 102.  Will need to try and remember what I've got.  Currently at Alton Towers after driving down from Brechin lol.  Need to look up what is on the 102 as well.  Would rather not use compression adapters just to make sure everything is square.

[Elp]

Mines compression 1.25 and 2 inch I recall as the reducers/flatteners I use with the SF102 are push in and compress fit, though I assume something can screw off from somewhere.

Edited August 4 by Elp

[Ratlet]

59 minutes ago, Elp said:

Mines compression 1.25 and 2 inch I recall as the reducers/flatteners I use with the SF102 are push in and compress fit, though I assume something can screw off from somewhere.

That makes it easier.  I got distracted on my imaging journey by vintage glass, but now I've got a proper ed doublet I figure I should at least keep it busy on nights I take the dob out.  Was concerned about potential tilt in the imagination train, but it's not like I'll be hanging a huge amount on it.

[Elp]

Mines a bit of an odd focuser, don't know if it's non standard or an earlier version. Theres only two compression screws, but haven't seen tilt with it, as you say with a smaller sensor you can likely get away with it.