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Review of the APM TMB 105/650 Triplet Apo with LZOS made optics

DirkSteele

By DirkSteele
in Member Equipment Reviews

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DirkSteele

DirkSteele

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Many of you will have read posts on here where I mentioned my APM TMB 105 f/6.2 triplet Apo which is primarily my travelscope as it is airline portable.  Well after about 2 years of ownership, I have put pen to paper, well fingers to keyboard, and written a detailed review.  I hope you find it interesting and would love to hear any feedback.

http://alpha-lyrae.co.uk/2014/01/01/the-apm-tmb-105-f6-2-triplet-apochromatic-refractor/

Clear Skies,

Matthew

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Alma

Alma

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Lovely review of a great scope Matthew - I have one myself and will never part from it!

One thing I would just mention however; there is one diagonal that doesn't work without a corrector or barlow - the light path of the Baader Click-Lock diagonal (the white body one) is too long even with the Feathertouch racked all the way in, for my Denk II to work without a corrector. Every other 2" diagonal I've tried (i.e. William Optics dielectric and Astrophysics maxbright) works just fine.

Alan

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DirkSteele

DirkSteele

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Lovely review of a great scope Matthew - I have one myself and will never part from it!

One thing I would just mention however; there is one diagonal that doesn't work without a corrector or barlow - the light path of the Baader Click-Lock diagonal (the white body one) is too long even with the Feathertouch racked all the way in, for my Denk II to work without a corrector. Every other 2" diagonal I've tried (i.e. William Optics dielectric and Astrophysics maxbright) works just fine.

Alan

Very interesting, thanks for sharing that information. I will add an edit to the review to include that.

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  • 3 weeks later...
Vega26

Vega26

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Had another read of the review. While day dreaming about owning one of these scopes I decided to take a look at the different models on offer so clicked on the APM Telescopes link at the end of the review. Your 105/650 was not listed. Any idea why? Has it been discontinued? Not that I could really afford it.

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GuillermoBarrancos

GuillermoBarrancos

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This is the one the OP has and reviewed:

http://www.teleskop-express.de/shop/product_info.php/info/p6420_LZOS-APM-APO-Refraktor-Telescope-105-650mm---3-5--FeatherTouch.html

This is a more affordable Version:

http://www.teleskop-express.de/shop/product_info.php/info/p4950_APM-APO-Super-107-700mm-with-3--PHOTO-focuser-and-FPL53-lens.html

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michael.h.f.wilkinson

michael.h.f.wilkinson

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I gather they do not have the same optics. The LZOS version has a very good reputation, and that comes at a price.
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GuillermoBarrancos

GuillermoBarrancos

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I gather they do not have the same optics. The LZOS version has a very good reputation, and that comes at a price.

No ofcourse. LZOS versus FPL53 Ohara.  4500,- versus 1995,- euro.

But both are APM Scopes. So if you cannot afford the LZOS Version, the cheaper FPL53 is a nice alternative from APM.

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michael.h.f.wilkinson

michael.h.f.wilkinson

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No ofcourse. LZOS versus FPL53 Ohara.  4500,- versus 1995,- euro.

But both are APM Scopes. So if you cannot afford the LZOS Version, the cheaper FPL53 is a nice alternative from APM.

As many others have said, the presence of FPL53 means little. Many cheaper triplets and quadruplets sport FPL53, but that says nothing about optical figure or construction of the lens cell. Some quadruplets in particular suffered from optical pinching at low temperatures due to shortcomings in the design of the optical cells. The LZOS lens cells are reportedly built like a tank in terms of ruggedness, and that is vital to the performance of the scope. The alternative from APM is bound to be good, I agree, but I would like to see a side-by-side comparison to fully appreciate the differences in performance (or lack thereof).

My own APM 80/480 is a cheap one (same as the TS triplet of same specs), and performs very nicely indeed, but I am not sure it would compare directly to the LZOS variant (been tempted by a second-hand one recently).

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DirkSteele

DirkSteele

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Had another read of the review. While day dreaming about owning one of these scopes I decided to take a look at the different models on offer so clicked on the APM Telescopes link at the end of the review. Your 105/650 was not listed. Any idea why? Has it been discontinued? Not that I could really afford it.

Interesting question and one I asked APM  when I first published the review.  Though the 105/650 is not currently listed, it is still available should anybody want to purchase one.  However, for LZOS lenses of this type of aperture, APM have to place an order for at least 10-12 at a time which if they do not have orders for in advance, is a big drain on working capital.  Combined with the number of models in this aperture range, the 100/800, the 105/650, the 107/700 (not LZOS made) and the 115/805 and the fact that the Massimo Riccardi designed reducer will make the 100/800 scope for example a 100mm f/6 means they no longer believe that it makes sense to offer the 105/650 (f/6.2).  When I pointed out that the primary attraction for me was the 105/650 was airline portable where as the other models will not fit in cabin baggage, they said while a valid point, that market was too niche to keep it the line up solely for airline portability.  The final decision on the 105/650 has not yet been made, but it may be officially dropped after the next order of lenses are delivered so if you are interested in one, keep that in mind.

I gather they do not have the same optics. The LZOS version has a very good reputation, and that comes at a price.

Also good points.  As Michael can attest I am sure, the non LZOS made 80/480 is an excellent scope and what you do get is the APM quality control.  While the 107/700 is Chinese made with FPL-53 (which as I mentioned in my review, the ED element by itself does nothing), APM are a premium brand and cannot afford to have poor scopes out there with their name on so unlike some other re-sellers, they will not sell one which does not perform to the expected standard.  Though having never looked through one I cannot say how the performance compares.

Would love to see a comparison.  The price difference would suggest there will be a performance gap, but as has been discussed so many times before, it will not be 4x the scope despite the 4x price difference.  Law of diminishing returns and all that.

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  • 1 year later...
petevasey

petevasey

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I  have a similar model to the one reviewed, from 2003.  Preceded the teflon runners, but was modified to stabilise the long draw tube and does a great job.  See

http://www.madpc.co.uk/~peterv/astroplover/equipnbits/TMB.htm

Still available at

http://www.apm-telescopes.de/en/telescopes/refracting-telescopes-ota/apochromates/apm-lzos-telescope-apo-refractor-105-650-lw-photo.html

I've been toying with selling mine to buy a flat field apo, possibly a TS100Q, but now I'm using a TS2Flat flattener it's performing well with my QSI683, so I'm hovering on the brink.  The objective is immaculate and the Feathertouch focuser a dream to use....

Cheers,

Peter.

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