Cosmic Geoff

23rd Feb, full moon, Bortle 6. M81, M82 and NGC2403.  Smartphone images.

9 minutes ago, GasGiant said:

I think they're great. A planetary version would be incredible !

The Seestar does image planets, if you can find them in the object list, and some members have published images.  But to get decent planetary images it would need a much bigger aperture.  There are smart scopes with larger apertures, but they are wincingly expensive.

I had my Seestar out last night (23rd Feb) and tried imaging some galaxies (previously I have prioritised nebulae).  Full moon, semi-urban sky.  I got a pleasing and better than expected image of  M81 and M82 in 36 mins. Getting both in frame was a faff.  Got a pleasing image of NGC2403, again better than expected.  

Next I tried for the full Moon, after picking up the Seestar and moving it into the moonlight.  I tried to make it find the Moon but it just wouldn't. It seemed to be trying to find it by plate-solving. Gave up and re-calibrated the compass. It then found the Moon (just) stopping with a sliver of Moon in frame, which I then centred.  I see there are digital x2 and x4 zoom options here - not very useful.  Somebody else complained about the Moon-finding with the latest software, and it certainly worked better with the earlier software.

Also tried for M66 with about 11 minutes. It was a bit rubbish (very small), but it was close to the full Moon.

In conclusion, the Seestar performs well on large galaxies with high surface brightness even under less than ideal conditions.

The Celestron C6 is not really the ideal OTA for deep sky imaging (which I assume you are contemplating). 

ADM do a range of kits for fitting an accessory bar to the side of SCTs of various sizes, using adapter blocks and the existing holes (but not for the C6, so far as I can see). 

I don't think it matters which side the focuser is on.  It's to the side on one of my SCTs and to the bottom on the other.

we mount??

I couldn't say, but I would not worry overmuch about its age. They can last a long time, and some people are using Celestron SCTs that are over 40 years old (but they are not on the original mounts.) With such a long history, they have been made in the USA and in China under different ownerships.  According to some reports, the models churned out for the last appearance of Halley's Comet weren't so great. Unless you can deduce the year of manufacture of this one and do some research, your options are:

1) Buy it if it looks clean and undamaged and the mirror looks shiny, and the price is right.  Note that used SCTs generally sell for far less than the cost of a new one, and well under the 66% of new price guide.

2) Don't buy it.  

For reference, my C8 SE came with the older Nexstar handset, making it at least 12 years old, and there is noting optically wrong with it at all. 

1 hour ago, PhilB61 said:

Be aware that that telescope will be a hard learn for astro photography even on that mount due to it's size and bulk, a smaller widefield scope might be a better choice for learning and keep the dob for visual, at least for now.

Very true.

Sorry if this is not what you want to hear, but the SE mount is not designed for mounting long refractors.  You could avoid aiming at the zenith by setting limits in the mount, or  use a SCT telescope on the mount, or get a different mount. 

If you have a Seestar S50 for imaging, you don't have to struggle with cables, software and tech and don't have to spend hours processing, unless you really want to.

As stated above, using a mosaic is a no-cost option for the Moon.

A Celestron f6.3 focal reducer can be used to advantage with various Celestron SCTs, e.g. my C8, to increase the field of view and the imaging speed. 

However, the  4SE is not a SCT - it is a Maksutov and I don't know what focal reducer is specified for it or which of the readily available ones will work well.  Given the unusual construction of the 4SE with its built-in flip mirror you should consider just how a focal reducer might be fitted.

I hope the OP was not upset by my questioning his telescope's provenance. (I see that High Point Scientific are offering this telescope bundled with a generic eyepiece & filter kit). 🙂 We usually advise newbies not to buy these eyepiece & filter kits as many of the contents will get very little use, and the money would be better spent on two or three mid-price eyepieces. These kits usually include a neutral density filter which can be used as  Moon filter, so if he wants a Moon filter the OP should not have to buy one separately.

Since this is a new telescope, I anticipate that the problem is purely down to user lack of experience.  With the  powered 'tracking' not activated, the sky objects will as likely as not drift out of field while the user is struggling with the focus, and he may be trying to focus on the 'near moon' glare rather than the Moon itself.  As I mentioned above, it is actually quite difficult to get a totally out of focus telescope to focus on the Moon, and a point source target would be much easier.  The range of focus knob rotation where any Moon detail can be seen is quite small.  

An experienced user would figure out how to set the telescope to track by using the red dot finder only, but I suggest the OP tries to focus on Polaris (which does not move much) or a high contrast daytime target some distance away.

In addition to the suggestions above,  tree branches silhouetted against the bright daytime sky make a good focusing target. 

Finally, just check that something changes when the focus knob is turned, lest all the end to end twiddling has deranged the mechanism.

10 hours ago, craig34220 said:

and looking through the scope with star diagonal and  the focal reducer it has been crystal clear,

That is normal.  You just need to take the f6.3 focal reducer off, and find the focus with an eyepiece inserted.  

No comment. 😒

We still have no explanation as to why Craig34220  recieved the above mentioned accessories with the scope and had to buy a star diagonal.

Here is part of the spec from the Celestron site, and shows that a 40mm eyepiece, 13mm eyepiece and Celestron diagonal should have come with the scope: 

 So what happened to them and why were a 20mm eyepiece etc and Barlow supplied instead? If we get a sensible answer to this and confirmation that the scope is brand new and not a customer return, pre-owned etc we will be better placed to advise on how to sort the problem.

I also confirm that a f6.3 reducer is an imaging accessory. It is possible to use it with eyepieces but for troubleshooting it is best removed. I also point out that a Moon filter is NOT necessary - I have never used one.

The moon is a poor target for focusing, as unless it is almost in focus, all one can see is a bright blur with no clue as to which direction to turn the knob to improve focus.  Try again using a bright point source (star or planet) as I suggested above.

2 hours ago, craig34220 said:

that came with a lens kit ( 4mm-20mm and a Barlow lens ) I also purchased a Celestron star diagonal

A new Evolution would come with one low power eyepiece, probably 25mm, and a Celestron diagonal, so what's been going on here?? A 4mm eyepiece would give far too much magnification with this scope, which has a focal length of about 2000mm.  Likewise there is no need to use a Barlow lens with these scopes.

If this scope is used and has lost its original diagonal and eyepiece, there is no telling what state it is in.  It could be severely out of focus AND out of collimation, meaning that even if it is in focus nothing will be seen clearly.

If possible, it would be wise to hand this over to someone (either a professional telescope repairer or an experienced amateur from your nearest astro society), who knows what he is doing. 

If it is in fact new and it doesn't work (rather than just being out of focus) you should return it to the seller.

To attempt focus, as others have suggested, fit the 20mm eyepiece, aim it at a bright star or Jupiter and wind the focus knob slowly. You  should see a glowing donut at some point. If so, wind the focus knob in the direction that makes the donut smaller.  You should eventually  get a bright point (star) or small disc (planet).  If the best you can do is something that looks like a badminton shuttle, the collimation is bad, and this is something a newbie is unlikely to be able to fix.

8 hours ago, Vinnyvent84 said:

does that make sense?

You have clearly gone to a lot of trouble and expense, but do you think you can do anything I can't do with regard to planetary imaging using my much simpler setup?

I don't see what you gain by using this mini PC. I did planetary imaging with my C8 SE and my CPC800 (both Nexstar models functionally similar to your C8 Evolution) with a planetary camera plugged directly into my laptop, which runs Sharpcap.

People do use mini PCs (or ASIAIRs) strapped to their scopes, but they appear to be needed only if one is doing deep space imaging and wanting to control a slew of gadgets like filter wheels, electronic focuser, camera, and one supposes the mount and autoguider, and maybe controlling the whole thing remotely from indoors.  I certainly have not experienced any need to do anything of the sort. 

I have seen comments about the Evolution wifi, but I don't see why you need to be using it if you have the handset.  If you are trying for deep space long exposure imaging with the Evolution, you have set yourself a tough target and it might be better to get an equatorial GoTo mount and a smaller more manageable refractor (or a Seestar S50 🙂). 

3 hours ago, borgs said:

I'm about to purchase a Seestar S50. Interested to know how you got on with using the clear focusing filter as a protector and if you are still using it. 

The Seestar S50 incorporates a dew heater. I mostly have used it with the heater off and it seems the unit's internal heat discourages dew formation.  Actually short of pausing it and shining a light on the lens, it is hard to judge whether any dew is accumulating.

4 hours ago, Flame Nebula said:

I'm interested in visual and planetary AP, and I understand that seeing won't impact on the latter to any significant degree. So, my question relates to visual. I'm located in the Nottingham area, if that helps. 

My experience is that seeing has a marked effect on planetary astrophotography.  From what I have read, C9.25 is a 'sweet spot' for planetary imaging in the UK, in that beyond that aperture you are increasingly unlikely to ever be able to use the scope to its full potential. Allowing time for cooling would be beneficial, but I have never been able to quantify this.  If possible, store it somewhere cool and not high up in a centrally heated room. In any case, storing it indoors will give you half an hour's cooling during the setup time.

Wesdon1 - Fine, but I think we have too much mention of the narrow FOV of SCTs and Maks. It would be equally useful to novices to point out which telescope designs (fast achromats) do not work well on planets and double stars, or need  more sophisticated eyepieces to do so (f5 reflectors). And warn them about wobbly entry level mounts. 

20 hours ago, wesdon1 said:

Just one thing, are you aware that SCT type telescopes are only really good for Planets, splitting stars, Globular Star Clusters and the smaller Galaxies and Nebula? They won't do much for large Nebula or large galaxies? That aside, Celestron are great quality and the Starsense tech looks brilliant for beginners, helping them find their way around the sky without needing a GoTo setup.

This argument about the small field gets trotted out almost every time SCTs and MAKs are mentioned.  But let's ask, how many objects are there, that you can see with a small telescope in the kind of environment where most of us live, but will not fit into the field of view of a small SCT or Maksutov?  I think, not many at all. 

When I acquired my 127mm Mak, focal length 1500mm, I found that a handful of large and bright open clusters would not fit into the field of view, but thousands of other objects did.

As for large galaxies, quite a few are big when imaged, but do they look big when seen through a small telescope in Bortle 6 skies? No, they don't.  All you see is a fuzz of the central nucleus. Same with small and large nebulae which asides from M42 are basically invisible in an urban environment.

An aside about the Celestron C6 - this is a long-established design and is available as a bare optical tube and also with an unusual variety of mounts, from serious mounts valued at around £1000 to starter mounts which depending on the deal on offer may be included at almost no extra cost.

12 hours ago, ObscuredView said:

The one that comes with the Evolution 8”Edge hd.

That doesn't tell me much.  If it's the same as the Heavy Duty tripod (with the massive cast alloy spreader + folding low level spreader) that came with my CPC800, and also supplied with the CPC925 & CPC1100, the suggestion that it needs extra stabilisation, to be frank, makes me fall on the floor laughing.

The single arm Evolution mount is another matter. Read the second review of the C9.25 Evolution on the FLO site.  That might be your problem.

You may need to provide more information for a helpful answer. Why do you want to upgrade, what do you intend to use the scope for, why would you want the f4 rather than the f5?

And what mount do you intend to use? A mount just adequate for the 150P is unlikely to support an 8" weighing perhaps 1.7x more.

If you look at the user manual for the C8 SE it will tell you the required amperage, which IIRC is about 1.5 amps.  You can use anything to power the C8 SE, provided it delivers a regulated output between 12 and 14 volts, can deliver sufficient current, and has the correct polarity. 

The specifications of some of these power banks need to be read with a critical eye. 30000mAH sounds more impressive than 30 Ah, and does it mean 30 AH at 12v, or 30 AH at 5 volts (if it has any 5v output) which would represent much less energy? 

I mainly use a Celestron LiFePo power tank for my C8 SE.   Car engine starters (with a lead-acid battery) can be cheap, do the job, and are often multi-function so that they can also e.g. start your car, pump up the tyres, or provide light.

I also found that a 7 AH sealed lead-acid battery, when new, would provide enough energy for several evening's viewing with the C8 SE or 127 SLT.

The dovetail used on the C6 SE and C8 SE (known as a Vixen dovetail) is a standard size, so will be the same width on the 6 SE and 8 SE OTAs.  I don't know why your 6inch tube should have a 8" CGE  dovetail on it , or what size that is.  

If you buy a 8 SE tube it will have a Vixen dovetail on it because that is part of the C8 SE kit.   (unless the seller has removed the dovetail to annoy you).  If the 8" tube is actually from some other Celestron package, it might be fitted with the wider Losmandy dovetail.

I don't know whether the HEQ5 Pro accepts the Vixen or the Losmandy dovetail - maybe both. You will have to look it up.

BTW the colours of the Celestron SCT tubes usually indicate which kit they were bundled with when new, e.g. SE = orange. 

19 hours ago, ObscuredView said:

So I have ordered a dovetail rail I got to thinking that it might be wise to add some weight under the tripod.

Which tripod do you have?

Buyer regret after an expensive purchase is very common.  Shouldn't I have bought 'x' instead?  Did I really want a car with more electronics than a Stealth bomber?  Sometimes the regret wears off, and one comes to appreciate the new purchase, otherwise you can always sell it on.