lawsio

Hi guys, thought I'd give a bit of feedback!

The astronomy gods smiled on me and I had clear skies the day it arrived! Only a relatively short first session but managed to get my head around the GTI alignment and app pretty quickly. I've only used the 1 star alignment so far but that was good enough to keep Saturn in the eyepiece all evening with a bit of adjustment every now and then. Seems pretty stable, as mentioned elsewhere manually focusing is a bit tricky as it wobbled a bit but I gather you can get auto focusers now? May be a worthwhile investment at some point. 

As for the Mak I'm very impressed so far, Saturn Looked great in it! Probably looking its best thought a 6.3 or 7.5mm eyepiece but a 10mm + 2x Barlow looked good as well, albeit with less definition. 7.5mm with the Barlow was messy but I was viewing early in the evening over rooftops so maybe it's better with steadier skies. I'm not used to using a diagonal and there was a lot of early frustration with the fact the red dot sight kept poking me in forehead when I was looking in the eyepiece but it occurred to me several hours later I could rotate the diagonal around a bit to stop that from happening 🤣 Doh!

Now I've got something small enough to transport easily I've got a few trips to darker skies planned with it. I'm thinking I may even try to pick up a small newt to stick on it for when I'm feeling fuzzyish and CBA with lugging the Skyliner about. Thinking probably an Explorer 130p as the 150 seems a bit heavy for it. Any thoughts on this? Used to have a Skyhawk 114 which was great so I'm sure a 130 will be decent enough too. I'm thinking the trade off of smaller aperture with but darker skies and tracking over using the 200p in my garden is worthwhile for a couple of hundred quid on a third scope!

The camera is still in the box but will come out to play once I've got the laptop sorted out!

Thanks all for your help so far, as always its much appreciated!

Are you sure you're aligning it to the correct stars? Reason I ask is that I've just been playing with this mount for the first time tonight and the red dot finder was so far off I thought I was aligning it to polaris and it was something else altogether. Didn't realise how far out it was untill I tried finding Saturn (harder to confuse with other stars in the eyepeice!) and it was a nighmare as the finder was aligned worse than the sights at a fairground shooting gallery.

One I had the finder properly calibrated I used a one star alignment on mizar and it seemed to work alright after that. I assume 2 star or 3 star alignment is better but the one sar (only in the SynScan Pro app) was good enough to track Saturn all evening.

Good luck!

Look what's arrived!

Biggy has a friend!

11 minutes ago, Jules Tohpipi said:

There's three main parts to this.

1. Updating AZ-GTi firmware

The AZ-GTi ships enabled for alt-az mode only. To run in EQ mode you need to update its firmware using a computer. This is a one-time-only action.

Firstly download the Sky-Watcher software that runs and manages the whole firmware update process on your computer. Secondly download the EQ firmware file. Both files are found at the link below. Open the first file on the computer and follow the brief on-screen instructions - then it will beam the EQ firmware file from the computer over Wi-Fi to your AZ-GTi.

Choose the correct files at the link carefully! The first file (which runs the process) is called 'Windows Program : Motor Controller Firmware Loader, Wi-Fi' and the firmware file is called 'Firmware : AZGTi Mount, Right Arm, AZ/EQ Dual Mode.'

http://skywatcher.com/download/software/motor-control-firmware/

 

2. Extra hardware required for EQ mode

General purpose here is to convert the AZ-GTi and its bundled tripod to physically behave and move like an EQ mount. Obviously not needed when doing a quicker alt-az session set-up.

a) You'll need an EQ wedge to put on top the tripod (or its extension pillar) and under the AZ-GTi. One example of such a thing being:
https://www.firstlightoptics.com/skywatcher-star-adventurer/skywatcher-star-adventurer-equatorial-wedge-white.html   

b) A threaded counterweight bar (to hold the counterweight). The AZ-GTi already has a threaded socket to screw a bar into.

c) A counterweigth for the bar.

There are many buying options for b) and c) items. Some DIY a bar and weight. Or there's this to buy as a unit (though needs a simple M8 to M12 adapter according to one review at the bottom of the page).
https://www.firstlightoptics.com/skywatcher-star-adventurer/skywatcher-star-adventurer-counterweight-kit.html

 

3. SynScan Pro app for phone or tablet
Install this on your phone or tablet to control the AZ-GTi. It has a button for toggling between AZ and EQ modes.

That's perfect, really appreciate the help!

Right then - I've bought the discounted one FLO had and the ASI 224 to get me going. Nobody is allowed to tell me I've ballsed this up now, if I have you'll find out soon enough!

I'll save the info above, I'll almost certainly buy the EQ kit at some point but probably not right away. 

Thanks all for the advice, we've been on a journey (an expensive journey) here and I'm looking forward to the new kit arriving! Might show the newt some love between now and then so it doesn't feel bad!

I'll share some pics when I've got some worth sharing!

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/zwo-cameras/zwo-asi224mc-usb-3-colour-camera.html

This badger seems like it gets good reviews everywhere and is the best sub £200 camera before a big price jump to the next bunch. If I put one of these on the StarMax am I going to have a good time or have I lost the plot at this point?!

Right I've gone down a rabbit hole here. 

I'm on FLO looking at ZWO cameras. There's a million of them and they all look the same. What am I looking at?

Argh every time I come on this forum it costs me another £100 🤣

I'm now researching ZWO cameras having woken up not know what they are. 

If ever there was a hobby where there was a reason to always spend a little bit more, this is it!

41 minutes ago, Jules Tohpipi said:

Yes absolutely. And there's different levels you can start/go up the EAA or full AP ladder. Of which I'm currently on the very bottom rung (having been pure visual for decades until this year).

I'll keep this brief and in general overview.

Bottom rung is using the AZ-GTi as supplied in alt-az mode. I remove the eyepiece from the diagonal and put my camera in same diagonal (ZWO ASI585MC). USB cable from the camera to a laptop. Use either the supplied ZWO software or third-party SharpCap software to either 'Live View' the camera or 'Live Stack' the images there and then in real time on the screen to observe planets, DSOs (at a stretch with the mak) etc. All very easy and rewarding with a relatively simple learning curve. This relies on short exposure times - approx 10 seconds each and when live-stacking the software auto-corrects for any field rotation of alt-az mode. I see more detail and brightness in DSOs than I ever saw in my 10" dob with this technique (I use a cheap 4" refractor for DSOs). 

Middle rung: add counter weight and counter weight bar and eq wedge to AZ-GTi. Then run mount in eq mode. Obviously permits longer exposure photography, be that for EAA or a stab at serious astrophotography

Top rung: as above but include guiding and integrate plate-solving and a host of other extra expert stuff (which I don't fully understand) be that with a computer using SharpCap or a dedicated astro box like the ASIair range. The imaging results of which - from other forum members - I would not have believed possible at amateur level even just 10 years ago.

 

By the way, I'm not necessarily trying to dissuade you from going the fully manual route with an EQ3 or 5 or the like. I enjoyed that kind of thing with dobs for years. But rather the AZ-GTi is a serious alternative to be putting on the shortlist if you want quick/light/non-bulky combined with reasonable price, tracking and GOTO, and upgradeable to EQ. If you see what I mean.

 

 

That's really helpful, thanks. 

I used to have a SynScan GoTo with my 114 Skyhawk and I never really bonded with it, spent far too long messing around trying to drive it from Stellarium (Ended up in a mood not dissimilar to that reviewer!) and got fed up with it and went back to a manual EQ mount until I switched to the bigger Dob. That was over 10 years ago though and the tech seems to be much better and simpler to use these days.

I'm going off my earlier idea of buying a massive manual EQ mount to stick the 200 Newt on as it seems largely pointless so maybe something like this is the better option. I guess if I did want a go at imaging some fuzzies later in the day I could get a 5" newt or a refractor as you say to mount to it instead. 

Does the GTI need a special adaptor to switch from AZ to EQ? I've read this was a firmware update but also seen pics in the owners forum of a totally different looking setup. Is the adaptor included or an extra?

9 hours ago, bosun21 said:

In that review the writer obviously had no clue what he was doing. It's a great little scope.

The "I have to manually point the scope at say Mars, I have no idea where Mars is in the sky!" part was my personal highlight!

9 hours ago, Jules Tohpipi said:

For visual, once it’s focussed and tracking, then I’ve found it to be stable. Stable enough even for decent EAA in alt-az mode doing short-exposure live stacks. The AZ-GTi has a large community following. See its enormous thread in the Mounts section here. 

However, personally, I’ve found the bundled tripod not ideal for when trying to fine focus the mak. The focusing action requires more energy input on maks than other scope types and it can take a few seconds for the bundled tripod to settle down after turning the focuser. Other people seem less perturbed by this than me. Some get astonishing images with this apparatus that I could only dream of. I yielded and bought the Sky-Watcher stainless steel tripod (3/8” version) which makes things rock solid with the AZ-GTi. When I’m feeling lazy, I use the lighter bundled tripod and a bahtinov mask to nail focus which eases the pain somewhat. 

Oh dear, that poor person in the review! As you’ll know from your own previous experience, some basic knowledge and input/effort is required 😂

FYI, that particular mount reviewed does not have the Freedom Find feature (all pointing must be done with the cursor buttons in the phone app). Plus the app communicates your location co-ordinates automatically to the AZ-GTi. 
 

Thanks Jules. It's looking like this could be the way to go. 

Imaging isn't something that currently on the agenda, but if I did want to start messing with EAA (For Solar System stuff, probably) would the SkyMax127 / AZGTI combo be future proofed for this?

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/telescopes-in-stock/sky-watcher-skymax-127-az-go2-wifi-maksutov-cassegrain-telescope.html?gclid=CjwKCAjw5_GmBhBIEiwA5QSMxNLaJaSspXTEKNYyH_Zm-QpHrSVK5qMoebPdR5BtxRaBULuD4TN-MRoCL3wQAvD_BwE

Side note - the one review on that is one of the best online reviews I've ever read 🤣

Ahh that's useful to know, thanks.

Is it stable enough? Looks nowhere near as substantial as the EQ3?

I can almost feel the collective disappointment from you all as I ask this question but I'll float it anyway.

The Celestron Astromaster 127 Mak is currently £300 with £200 off in the camera shop that shall not be named. Is this a worthy alternative to the SkyMax or should I pretend I've not seen it?

Current dilemma with the SkyMax is whether to get it with the EQ3 mount or the AZ GTI. Or neither. Puzzling.  

This has made for an interesting conundrum now. Upgrade the 200p with an EQ5 mount or buy a 127Mak GOTO. 

Or buy an EQ5 mount and a 127Mak OTA separately and have both 🤪

12 minutes ago, M40 said:

Hello lawsio and welcome back.

First off, you have the required posts so keep your eye on the for sale section, fingers crossed something will pop up.

The skywatcher skymax is great for solar system stuff and if the budget allows, the skymax127 seems to be a very well regarded starting point and will provide slightly better views that the 200. There is a field of view calculator in the astronomy tools at the top of the page, pop in your current telescope and using the same eyepiece pop in a couple of other telescopes to give you a bit of a comparison, treat it as a guide only though.

I note you say time is important, so maybe a goto is also the way to go. Initially I would look at the eq3 and 127 combo as I believe the mount can be upgraded to a goto at a later date as budget allows but please do confirm with flo.

All the best. 

 

Thanks for this. I used to have a 114mm GOTO and it drove me mad, could never get it calibrated properly and it just showed me all sorts of random nonsense! Gather the technology has moved on since I had one 10 years ago and theyre a bit simpler to use now but I'd probably start on a normal EQ for now. 

The FoV calculator is great. Looks like the SkyMax will show planets a bit bigger, but not by much so it'll come down to practicality for our location.

12 minutes ago, Cosmic Geoff said:

A Maksutov would make a good planetary scope, if you are looking for something fairly small and manageable.  You should be able to pick one with a mount that is within your budget.  A  150mm PL Newtonian and mount might be within your budget,  offering more aperture for the money but more bulky.

None of these are likely to give you planetary views as good as you'd get with your 200mm Dob (and an elevated stand).

Interesting the '(and an elevated stand)' part. Is that an option with this scope? I would have assumed it was far to big and heavy for a tripod to take it? Not sure the wife will let me get away with having it in a dome!

12 minutes ago, lawsio said:

This is why I come to the forum! I know nothing at all about these, whats a good place to start in the 400-500 mark? Is one achievable in this range?

I've found this ... https://www.firstlightoptics.com/maksutov/sky-watcher-skymax-127-az5-deluxe.html

This sort of thing? AZ mount though...

17 minutes ago, Peter Drew said:

For "lunar and planetary stuff" I would seriously consider a Maksutov.     🙂

This is why I come to the forum! I know nothing at all about these, whats a good place to start in the 400-500 mark? Is one achievable in this range?

Hi all,

Firstly - long time member of the forum but, while I knew it'd been a while since I'd last been on, it seems my last post was 2015 so ... hello again! This forums always been a source of inspiration (and expenditure!) so I'm back for more...

I currently have a Skyliner 200p which I've had for a while (since 2015 I imagine since you guys sold it me!) and, although it's a great scope, I've moved a few times with it and for where I am now it probably isn't the most practical to use. The skies aren't quite as dark as they once were and I have high sided garden fences so it sits a bit too low to see a lot of the sky. Life's changes as well, as it does, and I don't really have time/energy to spend the small hours looking for small fuzzies, so I'm thinking of getting something that going to be better for short sessions going after lunar/planetary stuff, which I find the dobs a bit clumsy for. 

Assuming I stick with what I know with Skywatcher, The ones I'm currently looking at are the EvoStar 102 and 120. Obviously less aperture than what I have now, but a bigger f/ and a taller EQ mount which I think makes plants better for viewing/tracking. 

General questions to the group really - am I on the right track here? Will I notice a difference going from one to the other? Any advice on which of the two is a better option? Alternatives?

Any comments welcome!