NGC 1502

Firstly a warm welcome to SGL😊

It’s always a tough call giving advice…

A 12 inch Dob is a very capable scope for deep sky and all types of observing.  If you’re young and strong maybe you can manage the weight?   How far from where you will store it to where you will use it?  If it’s too far you may struggle but some users fit locking castor wheels on the base to help.  But that means the storage shed needs no step at the door.

Both those scopes are good.  I wouldn’t let the supplied eyepieces sway your choice, you will likely upgrade those later on.  One advantage of the Bresser is that the tube can be rotated to bring the eyepiece to a comfortable angle.

See what others may say, not just me.  Happy observing whichever one you choose!
 

Ed.

I had a similar moment to the above.   Several years ago I was at Kelling Heath star party in north Norfolk. During the day I had seen Liverpool Astronomy Society’s 30” Dob, it had attracted a great deal of attention😁. The secondary mirror was 8” !!!

That night was clear, so myself and clubmate Jim went over to the 30” hoping to get a peek……the 30” was aimed at M33 the well known face on spiral galaxy in Triangulum.  Those in charge of the scope were allowing folks to have a look, the few minutes I waited seemed like forever……

My turn came….obvious spiral arms…..a moment like no other for me……never ever to be forgotten.  That view beats any image no matter how stunningly detailed.   It’s that direct connection across the void of space, those photons of light from so far away hitting my retina and perceived by my brain and consciousness…..just totally fabulous.

Diehard visual observers will understand.   Not knocking those fabulous images, but for me the visual view will always be king.

Ed.

Hi Alan, good idea to plan ahead….

One alternative to a push away shed-

A fixed shed with a wide enough door without a step.   The scope can be on locking castors and wheeled out when required.   The scope will be much easier to move than a shed.  This would also mean a large Dob is suitable, pulling in more light to those aging eyes😊

A further thought-  Almost every garden has a shed, so your scope shed will not raise more unwanted interest to villains than any other shed.

Ed the Shed😊

Astrophotography is a steep learning curve. Whilst some are very proficient and produce great images, many give up and find other ways to do astronomy.

My own astrophotography is as simple as it gets, I do an online search for whatever object I want. Almost instantly I see fabulous images done by others.

Whatever floats your boat, I hope you find it.

Ed.

Following with interest👍

Ed.

Hi Francis, can you say what eyepieces you already have please?

Top solution if your car is small- Get a trailer for the wife and all her stuff.

This gives you 100% of the car for you and your scope.

Can’t see any problems with the above, can you?

43 minutes ago, John said:

  I've seen NGC 6207 with my ED120 refractor on a decently dark night here.

You have better skies than me. I’m not envious……I’m VERY envious…..😁

Update on opening post.  The clear sky on the evening of Saturday 4th May was correctly forecast.  Sunday night 5th all forecasts said don’t bother, but they were all wrong….

So I was pleased to be out again with the 10” Dob. A bonus was the sky looked more transparent, at the zenith without optical aid I could see mag +4.2 Chara, the Beta star in the Hunting Dogs. Not too bad for a town backyard.

I again observed M13 and this time NGC 6207 was better seen. My iffy sketches are below in the hope this will help others locate galaxy 6207.

The left sketch is at 44x with approximately 1.5 degrees actual field of view.  Alongside M13 are 2 obvious stars of about Mag +7.  If you take a line from the left hand star through and beyond M13 it takes you in the direction of the galaxy.  Look for 2 obvious stars and a fainter one. Once you’ve spotted those, use medium power to darken the sky background and hopefully spot the elongated smudge of 6207.

Points to note-  the galaxy and aforementioned stars form a “keystone” similar in proportion to the very prominent “Hercules Keystone” easily seen in the chart in the opening post. Also note, there are much fainter stars, not included in the sketches.

My hope is that this description will help, not confuse and hinder😊.  If you can get to a dark site your chances will increase, but if you’re stuck in town like me, DO NOT give up!   Best to make the most of these moon free nights before the May full moon and then June arrives without true astronomical darkness from UK latitudes.

If you cannot find the galaxy, just enjoy the blizzard of stars that is M13, crank up the power, see what you get!

Happy hunting, Ed.

When observing Messier 13 and being enthralled by a blizzard of stars don’t forget that just half a degree northeast is a galaxy.

From M13 in a low power eyepiece pan northeast to leave M13 at the edge of the field of view. NGC 6207 is now within your field of view.  If you cannot see the galaxy then increase to medium power and carefully look. The higher magnification darkens the background sky, increasing the contrast with the smudge of light.

Last night using my 10” Dob from my light polluted back yard I did just that.  I had to wait until after 11.00pm BST for full astronomical darkness. M13 was lovely and globular clusters look best at medium to high power. Don’t be afraid to crank up the magnification and see what you get. Using a 5mm eyepiece at 240x was best- the fore mentioned blizzard of stars was revealed.  From a dark site 6207 is a walk in the park, under a town sky it’s doable with a bit of persistence.

From deep sky M13, to very deep sky NGC 6207…..never forget the magnificent privilege of observing the universe we are actually a part of…..we are starstuff as Carl Sagan once remarked.

Star chart attached.

Clear skies to you, Ed.

3 hours ago, John said:

These days I'm happy to sacrifice a little in performance for comfort 🙄

Comfort is a very important point, more especially as you get older, also convenience is a big factor.

If your scope is easy to set up, comfortable in use, your eyepieces are not challenging to get a good view then you’re much more likely to take advantage of any clear skies.

BST Starguider do an 8mm. I have used one and found it excellent, especially considering the price.

On 25/04/2024 at 10:58, John Parr said:

I am interested in purchasing the Geoptik Nadira observing chair and was looking for vendors that will ship it to the USA. Any help would be appreciated. Clear skies and thank you.

SGL sponsors First Light Optics deliver internationally.  From their home page click on INFO to see that they ship to USA.

Ed.

2 hours ago, Wulfrune said:

I've been a member here for months now, but to be honest with you all, I've felt too embarrassed to ask for help, mainly because, like most things in my life, I can work things out for myself and I don't want to burden anyone with stuff which ultimately comes down to "RTFM", but I'm stuck and it's holding me and my hobby back.

About 18 months ago I purchased a Celestron 8se telescope and even though I'm disabled due to a bad motorbike accident where I lost the full use of one of my arms, I can still prep the telescope for work, however, what I can't seem to do is correctly set up the telescope for the auto tracker to work and it's led me to mothball my gear. 

I know there are countless "How to" videos that show you how, but I just keep getting it wrong and I've become disillusioned and discouraged.

I would ask, is there some kind soul who might consider helping me over this hurdle?  I live in Sutton, South London, but I'm willing to travel a reasonable distance to get help, should I be lucky enough to receive the offer of it.

I am a friendly guy, medically retired and married with 2 girls.

If there is someone who has the required knowledge and is willing to be a good samaritan, please get in touch with me.

And if nothing else, thank you for at least reading this far, I am grateful.

Kind regards

Steve.

So sorry to hear of your problems.   A way of getting help might be to contact a local astronomy club and ask for help. Almost all astronomy clubs I’ve had contact with have been a friendly bunch.

 Hoping you will find a way forward.

Best wishes from Ed.

Good work, a Dob with smooooth movements is a joy to use😊

BTW your workshop is a whole lot tidier than mine!!

Cheers from Ed.

On 21/02/2024 at 20:43, ScouseSpaceCadet said:

I thought hanging around with middle class nerds might rub off...

 

 😀

Please don’t forget that nerds can be found in all social classes, and if you’re a nerd like me I couldn’t care less about so called social classes anyway😊

As a long term owner of an Orion Optics UK f4.8 Dob I find it no problem at all to collimate.  And even when transporting it by car it rarely needs a collimating adjustment.  As mentioned above an important point is that the tube assembly will fit across the back seat of most cars.

Mine is an early model made in 2006, the 2” focuser is a basic Chinese unit. With a bit of tweaking and Teflon strip it works to my complete satisfaction therefore I’ve not bothered to replace it. Having said that, later and current models have an upgraded 2 speed 2” focuser.

Recommended especially if you can find one second hand. If buying new it’s expensive and the depreciation is high if you sell it on.  Mine was in mint condition and was £400 back in 2011.

Ed.

21 minutes ago, Alan White said:

With all these replies and my look through and at a t4,
no surprise I am in the state of Paralysis from Analysis!

Hmmmmmm.

It’s the common curse……paralysis by analysis……..been there, done that way too often😳

23 minutes ago, Chaz2b said:

Oh!please stop it! I sold my pronto and now I wish I hadn’t. It’s not top notch optics but still a damn well built scope that is as good to look at as to look through.

Sorry, didn’t mean to stress you😊.    The Pronto’s 2” focuser is great if you’re a fan of very low power wide field.  On the other hand the Ranger is half the weight so a lighter mount makes for a very portable travel scope. And with a 24 Panoptic you get 20x and well over 3 degrees field of view, adequate for most!

Your findings are very similar to my Pronto with the same objective.  Some years ago I bought a second hand ED80 and initially it became my favourite small refractor.  The ED80 does have better glass……however that’s definitely not the whole story…….

What frustrated me with the ED80 is collimation is close but not spot on. At high power on doubles the first diffraction ring is not concentric with the Airy disk. That might not bother some, but it bothers the heck out of me😳. I  did try loosening the 3 focuser to tube screws and “jiggling” to attempt better collimation, but without success. The problem must be within the mass produced objective.

The conclusion is….the Pronto is put together with care and attention. At high power on doubles the clean and well defined Airy disk sits perfectly within the first diffraction ring…..sooo beautiful to behold.  A great example of that at this time of year is Izar in Bootes…..the star colours are well seen too….

The Pronto remains my favourite small refractor, sets up in a jiffy for grabbing a gap in the cloud cover.

Ed.

I’d like to add-

Observing the proper motion of Barnard’s star.

I’ve been doing that since 12th June 2008. Although it’s the star with the highest known proper motion it takes years to visually observe that.  A very careful sketch every year will reveal the motion and also confirm you have definitely found it😊

It’s mag +9.5 and therefore doesn’t need a dark site. But first learn the star hop. The closest bright star is 66 Ophiucus……..observable from the northern hemisphere from summer into autumn….

Worth the multi year challenge!

Ed.

Way too much hassle mate…..just eyeball stuff and enjoy😁

I think that Olly’s low tech DIY fix is what I’d do.  Depends how much of a DIY person you are…..

Hope you sort it, Ed.

22 hours ago, Chaz2b said:

 

why buy an old (1990s) type semi-achromat ? Like those who buy fancy cars, the finish and craftsmanship.

chaz

I can answer your question “why buy an old 90s semi achromat”.

I have had my Pronto for many years having bought it second hand at Kelling Heath star party.  Then I bought a used SW ED80.  The ED80 has better glass, but as a double star fan I find it frustrating.  On bright doubles the ED80 shows obvious Airy discs but the first diffraction ring is NOT concentric with the Airy disc. For some this may not bother them but it does bother me greatly, once seen I cannot unsee it😳

The Pronto shows an obvious Airy disc but with absolutely spot on first diffraction ring, perfectly concentric. Quite simply it was put together with great care and attention. I find it very satisfying to use and that’s why I love it to bits!!

I wouldn’t mind a TV85 with better glass and with a similar build quality. They are expensive compared with mass produced scopes for a reason😊

Ed.

My previous observing seat was, quite literally, a pain in the posterior. The seat was adjustable from high to low, however it was held in place by friction alone.  Sometimes all was ok, but occasionally when I shifted my weight slightly, the seat would plunge unpredictably downwards. A nasty shock in the butt😡

Then I saw my good friend on SGL advertising what looked like the answer, and at a nice discount from its new price. The adjustable seat slotted into position rather than held by friction.

However, as a confirmed tinkerer with an incurable condition that most Dobsonian users will understand, I thought a few mods would improve things to the great benefit of my grateful posterior.

The seat on the Geoptik Nadira is a bit small, much smaller than my backside- but any pics of my butt and I’d get banned for sure😊.  And also the upward angle (of the seat not my butt) is not ideal…..  So I removed from my old observing chair the only bit they got right, the padded seat itself.

Using a timber offcut from my shed (all REAL blokes and lasses have a shed!) plus an hour in my workshop sorted it. Pics below show the original before the mods. Second pic shows the adapted padded seat attached. The timber batten alters the angle to near horizontal, more comfortable than the original. Final pic shows the result.

The modified seat still fits completely into the slots and stores on the backrest for transport. And it’s much more comfortable according to reports from my grateful rear end👍

The old observing chair is destined for the metal bin at my local tip, no way would I inflict it on anyone else😊

Probably more mods to come……

Ed.