Cosmic Geoff

I rcommend you buy and read "Making Every Photon Count" the definitive guide to deep space imaging, available from forum sponsor FLO. If you want to do deep space imaging with your C8-N (probably not the best telescope to start with) you really need a HEQ5 or EQ-6 GoTo mount.

The C8-N and your existing mount (+RA motor) may suffice fpr planetary imaging.

The Supatrak mount was never very popular.  Note that in stability it is the same as the Synscan GoTo mount in the same series, same stability as the Celestron SLT and a lot of other entry level mounts. On the plus side it is very portable.  If you decide you don't like Supatrak you can upgrade it to GoTo by purchasing a Synscan GoTo handset.  If you want a more stable class of mount you could be spending a lot more money.

The 127mm Mak (similar to the one I own) is a good scope.

I was at our local astronomy club last week when a dad brought along his lad and a small table-top Dob - clearly a very budget one of about 3 inches aperture. he wanted us to help the boy get sorted re. how to use the scope. The lad, about 6 years old, seemed a bit clueless, trying to look in the wrong end, etc.

I have the 127mm SLT GoTo Mak and it's a nice piece of kit, but for a 9 year old I would avoid GoTo. Such systems almost certainly require normal vision to set them up. We get a few adults on the forum who are baffled by GoTo so...   The 127mm Mak scope is chubby and quite awkward for me (an adult) to handle and I am always careful with it.  My 4" refractor by contrast is slim enough for me to get a hand around it, or I can use the dovetail as a handle.

For a 9 year old I would suggest a classic refractor ("looks like a telescope") of about 70 to 80mm aperture and longish focal length, mounted on a manual alt-azimuth mount.  The operation of this should be self-evident and the instrument should be capable of showing some detail on the Moon, split double stars, etc.

If you can show your daughter how to use a planetarium app on a tablet etc she should soon be able to use it herself to find things. Some tablets have an internal digital compass that will align the sky map with the sky.

On 15/08/2021 at 21:15, CBear said:

read one answer that said the 127SLT couldnt’ perform well enough out of the box to view Saturn,

Utter nonsense. I managed to image the Great Red Spot on Jupiter with mine. Admittedly the 10mm eyepiece that came with it was not great and needed an upgrade, but that isn't unique to this scope.  ALL scope kits as sold come with one or two basic eyepieces and owners need to do an upgrade.

There is an error in the printed instructions IMHO. My printed manual includes a handwritten note to press ALIGN after step 2. above, then do the coarse centering.

I don't know if this will necessarily fix the ERROR NO SOLUTION but I follow my procedure and I don't get that message and the calibration is effective.

On my C8 I suspect the camera is catching some of the OTA and dew shield in its FOV but it does not appear to matter.  Your camera axis should be parallel to the OTA axis. If it isn't, by a large margin, that could cause a problem if the above procedure does not tune it out.

You should look at your requirements, and the kit necessary to achieve them, and any special difficulties you may encounter, with great care.

Deep sky widefield imaging: you could try this with your existing camera equipment + a sky-tracking mount or GoTo equatorial mount.

Deep sky narrow field imaging: - a suitable telescope + DSLR + a tracking equatorial mount (a substantial GoTo mount is strongly preferred.)

Planetary imaging - a telescope of as large an aperture as you can afford or handle + a planetary video camera + a suitable tracking mount (motorised equatorial, GoTO equatorial or GoTo alt-azimuth will all work), Stability of the mount is less critical than for other imaging applications.

Visual observing, including looking around the sky visually without GoTo: The choice of possible scopes is wide and a matter of personal preference, budget, ability to handle etc. Some people prefer the simple approach. 🙂    Note that any object you may wish to observe will be in a GoTO mount's database, and if it isn't (e.g. a nova or comet) you can find it if you have the object's RA and Declination to be entered with the handset.  Note also that all-manual mounts may be fitted with manual slow-motion controls, while GoTo mounts are intended to be used in GoTo mode only, and even if the GoTo has 'Freedom Find' or releasable clutches, no manual slow-motion will be available to you. You can usually move the Goto mount around via the handset without setting the GoTo, but TBF it is usually less bother to just use the GoTo system as intended.

Astro Rose - Of the telescopes you cite, the Explorer 130m would be suitable for visual use and some basic planetary imaging (with planetary camera), and the Nexstar 102 SLT would be suitable for visual viewing (under GoTo only), and some basic planetary imaging. The alt-azimuth mount will restrict its usefulness for any small-deep-space object imaging.

9 minutes ago, Starslayer said:

I have just 'acquired' a 102 on eq mount and I am pleased with it. However, I was sort of also hoping that I could use my 2" celestron xlt diagonal on it only to find that the thread on the diagonal connecting ring is  too small.  Is there an adapter of some sort that will screw to the 102 and then allow me to screw my xlt to that?  Not sure what the sizes are in mm. 

It would be simpler to get a different diagonal.  The Srartravel 102 focuser will accept 2" diameter items, and the thread on the end of the focuser accepts T-thread devices (e.g camera adapters).

1 hour ago, TheTeenThatLovesAstronomy said:

i have done a fair bit of research and also i am still interested can you link me tutorials on all the bits to do 

You can find tutorials yourself using that online thing called Google. Also, any telescope you are thinking of buying should have a manual you can download and read - usually quite informative. If you don't know what you want to buy, visit a telescope dealer and let them sell you something. That's their job.  But the more you know about telescopes before you go, the more likely you are to like the result.

You will learn more if you educate yourself about telescopes, or just buy one and see what it does, than if you keep asking us.

Most of us have a low opinion of eyepiece kits. I wouldn't buy one. 🙂

Stefan - "Making Every Photon Count" is available from FLO the forum sponsor for £20.

7 hours ago, Stefan87 said:

Where I live is basically zero wind most nights, however dew can be quite an issue. This is one of the reasons I'm moving away from SCT. 

A dew shield should be considered an integral part of a SCT, just as on a refractor. Manufacturers don't like to supply them as standard because it makes their product look big and ugly.🙂

What targets do you have in mind? For many famous objects, a small widefield refractor would be far more suitable than a 200mm Newtonian.  A 200mm Newtonian would be more suited for imaging planets, planetary nebulae and small distant galaxies. 

15 minutes ago, Percivel said:

The meade 14 inch is a bit heavier  (apparently) than the celestron. The  cgxl  may take it  but just cannot get a definitive  answer. Don't want to buy it  and find its not up to it 

Ultimately you would need to ask someone who has used a SCT with the same all-up weight on the mount in question.  It would make some difference whether the mount is on a tripod in the open, or on a pier in an observatory, and whether you are doing planetary imaging, where a bit of movement is not critical, or deep-space imaging, where rigidity would be essential.  

Your final image looks a bit soft to me. Try 5000 frames, use 20% and crank up the Registax to the point where the image starts to go grainy. 

Definitely use the ADC.

I have seen a 16" Meade SCT on a LX200 - it looked like a suitably massive piece of kit.  Given the cost of replacement mounts, is is feasible to refit the mount with a new, custom drive?

I assume you want to image with the new mount, which makes some constraints.  Celestron offer a !4" SCT on the CGX-L mount.

I suggest you get the book "Making Every Photon Count," the  essential guide to deep space imaging, which may save you from making some expensive and unsuitable purchases.

By 'ds' I assume you mean the PDS imaging version?

A 200mm Newtonian is reckoned to be near the limit for a HEQ5 for visual use.  For deep space imaging, a small refractor or a smaller Newtonian like the 130PDS would be a better match for the HEQ5.

With the same f-ratio, a bigger scope just gives a bigger image - the exposure times etc remain the same.

Trying to use one scope for everything never ends well.

The length of possible exposure depends on various factors - accuracy of polar alignment, periodic errors in the gear train, accuracy of the drive box settings etc. You should get the Enhanced set as IIRC it allows you to do guiding, which you will probably want to try sooner or later.

And yes, it will be suitable for planetary imaging (a less demanding task).

Ideally you also want a f5 Newtonian modded to allow a DSLR to come into focus without use of a Barlow.

29 minutes ago, Xgaze said:

Am I too ambitious? Is it possible to view it with my Heritage 150? I was switching between a Plossl 32m and BST 8m. Trying to spot that lovely blue green colour, I guess it would be very small?

It should be identifiable with a 150mm Newtonian.  It's small and dim, but at high powers will look less starlike than a star. I have only ever found it with a GoTo.

I have a C8 SE and the only item on your wish list that I have is a Celestron LiFePo power tank. It works well and also gives enough light for servicing under my car.🙂

As you apparently live in an area with bad skies a carry case (for the OTA) could be a worthwhile purchase.  (I actually used a large plastic storage box and some scrap foam etc). 

The C8 is f10 so exotic eyepieces will not confer the same advantage they would in a f5 Dobsonian.

15 hours ago, Ryan85 said:

We have this telescope that has the name E. L berthon the English inventor...... Made by Ross Ltd serial number in the pics can anyone fill us in with more information please 

It looks like a genuine Ross. I can't read the serial number from the photo.  As far as I know, they are numbered in order of manuafacture and so the number will give some clue to its age. There is a list online that gives a few sample serial numbers and dates.  I can't get more than a rough idea of its size from the photos but it may be an 'officer of the watch' model that has lost its original leather sheathing.

Visually, galaxies appear as cloudy puffs of dim light with little resolvable detail. That's just how it is.   Also, there is nothing wrong with using a f5 scope as such.

38 minutes ago, Giles_B said:

I'm considering getting some 2" eyepieces. Ideally I would like to use them for high magnification if possible.

I think you may be misunderstanding the purpose of 2" eyepieces.  They are used when a 1.25" eyepiece format cannot accommodate the size of glass needed for low magnification/wide field in a particular scope.   Typically, the lowest power eyepiece you can get in 1.25" format is a 32mm Plossl.  For higher powers, the cheaper, lighter and more widely available 1.25" format eyepieces are almost universally used.  The scopes with 2" focusers can accomodate a 2" to 1.25" adapter.

The only way to see galaxies as shown in photographs is to image them.  Or at least try EEVA (q.v.)

47 minutes ago, etsatlo said:

I went for this one. The right angle helps save the neck and matches the view of the telescope but does mean the image is flipped vs the book. 

I did consider this as well but decided the right angle would be comfier (happy with that choice!)

You could have got a RACI (correct image right angle finder).  Sometimes you have to quiz the supplier to distinguish between a RACI and non-RACI angled finder.  Skywatcher for instance do both and they look the same and sell for similar prices.

It's a matter of choice, but a finder upgrade is not really necessary for a Goto scope.  My C8 SE has the stock red dot finder, which I only needed to use for setup at the beginning of a session.   One can usually pick a couple of alignment stars that avoid neckache. And now I have fitted Starsense on this scope I don't use the red dot finder at all.

The 130mm EQs are not awful, if they are all you can afford.  But beginners often find the EQ mount more of a liability than an asset.  A manual alt-azimuth mount would be much easier to set up and manage.

A 200mm Newtonian should be a fine scope, and the (manual) EQ-5 is a fine and useful mount.  But the combination is awful - I should know because I used to have this combo.  The eyepiece can be hard to reach and gets into awkward positions - potentially including 7 feet off the ground! - and needs a careful choice of finderscopes if you want to find anything near the zenith.  The last straw was never being able to find the M81 & M82 galaxies with it.

11 hours ago, Andrew_B said:

The nature of an SCT means that they're inevitably much more prone to dew than a Newtonian design

True, but a dew shield should be considered an integral part of a SCT, just as it is on a refractor. Manufacturers don't like to include a dew shield on their SCTs as it makes them look big and clumsy in the promotional photos. 🙁

56 minutes ago, GalaticBoba said:

With the diagonals, I was researching this, is upgrading to a 2" going to be beneficial? I'm assuming the TV everbrite is the best for the job here. Although I might wait until my dob arrives and switch those around to see if I notice a difference between the stock skywatcher and celestron.

A matter of opinion. All the 2" bits add extra cost. The 2" diagonal will provide a more solid base for attaching accessories, but if you are going for more field width than you can get from a 1.25" 32mm Plossl, IMHO maybe you should have bought a different model of telescope.  The SCT is really designed for narrow field stuff. Even less point if you are also buying a Dob.

Putting the SE mount on a wedge is a terrible idea, and I don't see how it will help as you suggest.

The (hardware) Starsense works well with the C8SE and speeds up alignment, making the whole thing a quick-deploy setup.

I briefly mounted my C8 on my EQ-5 mount and it worked fine, even for planetary imaging.  It should be well within the EQ-5 weight limits, whereas the 8" CC is I understand significantly heavier.  Note that used C8 SCTs quite often appear second hand, and they sometimes went for a lot less than the ~£1000 price of a new one.

With visual and Bortle 5 skies you are probably going to find galaxies etc a disappointment.

Where I live is nominally Bortle 6 and looking at galaxies with an 8" SCT is mostly a waste of time.  But I got nice results with a much smaller 102mm f5 refractor + ASI224MC camera +GoTo mount.

With galaxies, dark skies rule.

For deep space imaging, most people find it far easier to begin with a small refractor rather than a large SCT etc.

Trying to make one scope suit everything is a really bad idea.  With a £5000 budget you can afford a scope and mount for each task (within reason).

I suggest that you try, borrow or hire a scope before spending thousands of pounds on a large Dob.

Did you buy your C8 used? I think the source of your confusion is that the previous owner fitted a 2" diagonal that screws straight onto the SCT thread at the back of the scope, eliminating the need for a 'visual back' (which is basically a circular metal adapter). Some people like a 2" diagonal (etc) because it offers a slightly wider FOV, and a more solid base on which to mount accessories.

If you are confused about whether the setup is inverting or reversing, try aiming it at some distant signage.