LukeTheNuke

Wowsers! The sun does put on a show at times. 🌞

Do you need a 2 inch reducer? Wow, £279? I think Daystar sometimes have quite a nice markup on their extras, I remember the interesting prices they had for their Quark battery packs (cough). I just used a cheapo 1.25 inch 0.5x reducer, which was under £20 I think, from Telescope House years ago. It can also screw onto eyepieces, which I sometimes found useful, I think I got some other brand too that worked fine. I guess it depends on the camera chip size, though? I was using an ASI174 and Grasshopper 3 (ICX687), and the cheapy 0.5x reducer was fine to my eyes.

If 1.25 inch is fine, I'd be tempted to try something like this, with the option possibly to send it back if it doesn't work:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Svbony-Reducer-Astronomy-Telescope-Eyepiece/dp/B078Z8ZYR8

I think I've found the answer!

2 minutes ago, Stu said:

What you clearly need is a 600mm! 🤣🤣

https://www.astrobuysell.com/uk/propview.php?view=213216

Am I reading this ad correctly - the finder scope is 150 mm? Really? Wowsers! And I'd need to change my car to a transit van. I suppose a bigger finder makes sense, as you can see fainter stuff with the scope?

150mm mirror box mounted Bresser finder scope

Oh, and I suppose a 50mm finder might look a bit silly on a 24 inch dob.

26 minutes ago, PeterStudz said:

There are also alternatives to Starsense. I’ve never used Starsense so I’m not saying that this is better, but I can locate targets quick and easy using a phone app. For me it “just works” so what more do you want 😀.

The app I use is called PS Align Pro. I think I it cost £2.99. Within that there’s a PushTo feature and I’ve been using it for about 2 yrs. The phone is strapped to the OTA with a cheap tripod adapter. I sync to at least one known star/target (there’s no other setting up, no levelling etc) and off I go. It will then locate targets within a low power eyepiece. There’s also another app that does similar called AstroHopper. Although I’ve never used it I think it’s free. 

For “tracking” I made an EQ platform for about £85. So for less than £100 you have tracking & PushTo. A simple EQ platform is fine up to a 12” Dob. Any bigger than that and it might be more complicated. 
 

Thanks, Peter. I think I'm not that bothered about the Starsense technology itself, as I quite like finding stuff manually. Whether paying more for the Celestron is silly versus say the StellaLyra, if I'm not bothered about Starsense, I dunno. I suppose I'd try the Starsense, and maybe I should try PS Align Pro, you never know unless you try!

What I like about finding stuff manually though is it makes me get to know the sky better, and I quite like that aspect. I dunno why. I am terrible at directions when driving my car! I once got lost driving to the garage down the road. Poor Sarah had just sent me out to get milk or something for our guests! They couldn't believe I got lost going to the garage down the road!

20 hours ago, Zermelo said:

Thanks, just added to my own strategy list

I'm pondering whether to suggest a 16 inch solid tube with trolley / wheelbarrow handles stored indoors, which Sarah is dead against currently, but I am willing to let her paint the OTA to help the scope add to the decor.

3 hours ago, Mr Spock said:

Size matters... Here's how big a 12" is next to an 8" f4 and 4" f7.4.

 

Very true, Michael. I've been fortunate to own quite a range of sizes and scope styles: 60mm, 80mm, 100mm, 120mm, 150mm, 200mm, 250mm, 280mm, 300mm, 400mm. And we were very lucky to look through some bigger dobs at star parties. With the really big dobs, you also need stepladders! I was just okay without a ladder for the 400P, Sarah needed to use a few steps sometimes. I think Sarah might not need steps with the VX14, so that would be a plus versus the old 400P we sold.

I think I need to check what would actually fit under the stairs, to see what the limit there is. The door opening is roughly 75 cm wide, and 130 cm tall. We got the SW 400P in there fine. Whether it could take an 18 or 20 of some type, I don't know at the mo. Perhaps not. The big scope for our two scope option must go under the stairs. I think that's non-negotiable with Sarah! For the single scope option, we think the shed makes more sense - e.g. scope already pretty much cooled down.

If we go the two scope route, I guess the aperture needs to be at least 4 inches in difference to make it feel worth the effort. I'm not sure it would make that much sense to have a 14 solid tube and the Explore Scientific Ultra Light Dobsonian 406mm. I think there needs to be a bigger reason to get the bigger dob out to make the extra setup feel worth it. So perhaps a 12 and a 16, or a 14 and an 18 or 20. But definitely, I don't want a hernia from the scope(s)!

There is still the star party aspect, but I think the big scope does need to offer something at home too. We can't justify the cost of an expensive large dob for star parties only.

1 hour ago, Ratlet said:

I'd question whether you will get much bang for your buck going from 10" to 12".  Why not look at quality of life improvements for the 10"?  Like an eq platform so it tracks targets or picking up a cheap starsense scope so you can scavenge the starsense off it for easy push to.

Thanks for the thoughts. I can see why you'd say that, and it was part of my thinking in favouring the VX14 over the 12s, so that there's a more substantial increase in aperture. The answer is that I find the optics a bit lacking on the TS GSO 10 anyway, and would actually consider changing it for another 10 inch, if I felt confident the optics would be better. They're not terrible, but I think they are not as good as the (four?) Skywatcher dobs I've had. And the 10 is my most used scope for DSO, so a replacement is likely to get a lot of use.

I do really like its mechanics, though. I'm fond of the base. The scope has a surprisingly good two-speed focuser. We usually upgrade focusers - I think we did for all of our Skywatcher dobs. But we were happy with the stock one on the TS GSO 10. I was impressed that it could handle the weight of a Paracorr and 21mm Ethos. So the StellaLyra, if I am confident it has better optics than my old GSO (> 10 years?), looks quite tempting. It appears to have a very similar base, and I wonder if the focuser is also pretty decent.

I suppose a used VX14 could still work, though, if we go the two scope route, if the price gets closer to a new StellaLyra.

And part of my thinking is that having owned a lot of different aperture scopes, the 12 inch solid tube Skywatcher was a gem, and I wish I hadn't sold it. Now with the Celestron StarSense, and Mr Spock's glowing report of the StellaLyra, I wonder if there is the chance to correct my mistake.

Sarah and I are now wondering if two scopes might be better than one! What we're thinking for Option 2 is 12 inch solid tube dob to replace the GSO 10, as our low-hassle DSO scope. Maybe the StellaLyra or Celestron StarSense, so we can spend the bulk of the budget on the bigger scope.

And something 16 inches or larger that is very portable and can cover star parties or the odd night at home when we have the energy to set it up. Maybe it's the weekend and the forecast is clear. Out comes the big dob. Midweek, might be clear, might not - out comes the 12.

For example, the Explore Scientific Ultra Light Dobsonian 406mm looks reasonable weight-wise, with the heaviest single part being the mirror box, at 23.8 kg.

I guess I could, at a push, clear the games out of the cupboard where the 400P used to go, and the big dob could be stored there, hopefully. Maybe I'll have to sell some games [gasp!] We have games stored in several locations (we have many games!), so it's not end of the world to free up under the stairs, I think, especially if we sell some of Sarah's games!

It might be possible to stretch the budget above £5K for the right big dob, we have to see how the finances work out when we have the funds. Sarah has been looking at product pages for 18 and 20 inch dobs! A 20 inch dob would be a dream come true, though I want to avoid any really heavy single part, so maybe those mirrors are just going to be too heavy anyway. Or can the heaviest part easily be carried by two people? I've never moved a mirror box. If two of us can easily move it, then maybe we can push towards 20 inches?

Wow, lovely! Do you use your MN190 Mak-Newt mainly for lunar, or for other things too? Have you had a crack at close to new moon as well?

Very nice! To me, these have a real feeling of depth.

Thanks for the ideas and thoughts! They have been very helpful, we had a big think over the Easter weekend, and did some other reading up here on SGL.

All things considered, Sarah and I think it makes sense to store the dob in our shed, which I think rules out using a trolley or wheelbarrow handles, alas. That's because the path to the shed is loose slate chippings. Also, the shed door opening has a lip at the bottom, and I think the shed may be too shallow for using a ramp (it's only 100 cm deep), and perhaps taking a trolley.

The door opening, after careful checking, is 74.5 cm wide (less than I thought!), and 169.5 cm tall (more than I thought, LOL!). The shed is about 140 cm wide, 100 cm deep. We'd like to store the dob base in the shed as well, which is where we currently store our 10" GSO dob and base. I don't think we'll be keeping the GSO if the new scope is practical enough to replace it, and there might not be space for both in the shed, as we also have a few other bits in the shed.

I tested the waters by mentioning the word "observatory" to Sarah, suggesting perhaps she could do the odd bit of crafting in there as well. I got rather a stern look back.

We think we want a solid tube. We just find them that bit less hassle. They are far less prone to dew than the FlexTubes in our experience.

OTA weight-wise, thinking about what I've used in the past and how much I appreciate the light weight of the GSO (about 12.5 kg, I think), how heavy I found the SW 400P (32 - 38 kg???), a max weight of about 22.5 kg sounds about right to me. I'm sure I could manage a bit more, but I like the idea of being a bit under what I think I am fine with, and bearing in mind that I'm not getting any younger, and we hope to keep this scope for many years...

I think the Celestron 12 StarSense and the StellaLyra 12 dobs are options, and have the plus that they're way under our budget, and the tubes are probably a bit less prone to denting than the OOUK dobs. With Celestron, I've been happy with the optics on their scopes. With the StellaLyra, the base looks like the one on my GSO, which I am fond of. It's not flashy or beefed up, but it works so well. It's very smooth.

It would be a nice plus if the scope could fit in a car so we could take it to star parties, though if not, we can always take our lovely Edge 8 SCT. This could sway us to the Orion Optics VX12 if that fits in the car (my car could be changing soon), and the XV12L or VX14 don't.

Apart from the star party aspect, the VX14 tempts the most for me at the mo because it might feel like a nice compromise between the convenience of the GSO 10 inch, and the aperture of our old SW 400P. The VX14 OTA is 20 kg, which is similar to the StellaLyra 12, and less than the Celestron 12. And 14 inches sounds a decent step up on 10 inches.

We're open to new or used, and see plusses both ways. We hope to have funds within the next three months - we're not able to buy anything just yet.

44 minutes ago, John said:

Was your 16 inch the Flextube that used to come to the SGL star parties a few years ago ? 

I can recall looking through that one and thinking that the views were lovely but the scope certainly very far from "grab and go" 😁

 

Yes, that was the one! We sold it because I was finding it too heavy, and feared for my knee or back! And I was getting into another hobby that softened the blow: board gaming. Mind you, some of those are getting pretty heavy these days!

Thanks for the further ideas and thoughts!

Ratlet, thanks for a plan B re: scope on wheels!

Paz, thanks for taking the time to go through the setup routine. I suppose really I am looking for the sweet spot between the light weight and low hassle of my GSO 10 inch dob, and the bigger aperture of my old Skywatcher 16 inch. So maybe I should stick with a solid tube.

I love with the GSO that if the forecast is clear, I can plonk it out in seconds, there's very little to do to set it up, and if the night ends up as being wall-to-wall cloud, I didn't waste much time and it wasn't much of a chore.

Mr Spock, the base of your StellaLyra looks very similar to my GSO 10 inch dob's base. I really like it, and prefer it to the Skywatcher FlexTube bases. 

So I suppose I need to set my limit on the weight. I think as has been mentioned, it's not just the weight alone really, despite me going on about 20 kg bags of slate! I think it's also the shape and size, and how the weight is distributed.

I think we're edging towards the OOUK VX14, with it perhaps between that or the VX12 or VX12L. With the 12's, Sarah wonders if the VX12L might be more practical in terms of a more comfortable height of the eyepiece when standing generally.

I went out to measure our shed. It has a width of 100 cm, and the gap where the door goes is 166.5 cm tall (and there seems to be ample width). So I think we'd get the VX14 in there fine (tube length: 154 cm).

Sweet! I love transits! That looks like an A380-300 with the vent-flaps modification and the Merlin-Centaur engines. Ahem, I just made that bit up. Mind you, it wouldn't surprise me if some brainbox here could identify the model!

Thanks for the thoughts, everyone! Much appreciated.

Stu, perhaps I should reconsider GSO. My 10 inch GSO dob might be over a decade old. I see Mr Spock was chuffed with the optics on his StellaLyra 12". Thanks for the link to the Astro Tuff Truck. I see they have a 16 inch Skywatcher shown! The dob would mainly be for deep sky.

John, that's interesting to think about the 12 inch Orion Optics as well, I hadn't really thought about that. I do like the light weight of my 10 inch GSO. I feel like 20 kg would be okay for me, based on Sarah making me shift 20 kg bags of slate chippings around for her garden project! I think our GSO tube's weight is about 12.2 kg. And it looks like the OO VX12 is 14 kg, the VX12L is 16 kg, and the VX14 is 20 kg. So I guess the VX12 or 12L looks like a compromise between what I currently find easy, and the 20 kg I feel I could handle but would feel heavy-ish to me (those slate bags never felt light!)

The Celestron 12 inch does have a useful-looking handle on the tube, though at 22.58 kg, I wonder if it might feel a touch heavy to me. Sarah tells me I'd be fine with it, thanks to the handle, but she won't be the one shifting it around! Still, I'm sure her encouragement will take 10 kg off the weight!

Phil, thanks for checking about the sky conditions. Our skies are kinda okay for DSO, and our old 16 inch definitely showed more generally than the 12 inch scopes. And it was a big step up on the 10 inch. I'd say our 16 inch at home felt a bit like using a 12 inch at a darker site, like Kelling. Our skies aren't very stable for planets, though. I've never had a view of Jupiter at home anywhere near as good as it was at Kelling one year.

Piero, you make a 16 inch scope look practical, LOL! I was thinking about some ramps, it's good to see, thanks, and to hear how well it works for you.

I hadn't really thought about where the scope would be stored! Sarah reminded me that we stored our 16 inch SW indoors in the cupboard under the stairs, which is now home to a bunch of board games! We have a shed in the garden where the 10 inch is stored. I think we'd get the OO UK 14 inch in the shed.

Hi, Folks!

My wife and I should be in the market soon for a new or used dob, max budget £5K, though if something suits us that's closer to £1K, great! I'm looking for something I can move around reasonably easily, not too much more over 20kg for the tube, and similar for the base. I have an old knee injury I need to be a little wary of, and I don't want to do my back in either hauling out the gear! We don't mind whether it's manual or goto, with a slight preference for manual.

We used to have a Skywatcher 400P Goto, which we loved, but I did find it a bit heavy to shift around on my own, and I don't want to injure myself! We currently use a 10 inch GSO solid tube, which is very easy to move around, and I'm up for something bigger and heavier. I'd prefer a solid tube. We used to have a 12 inch Skywatcher solid tube many years ago, and I wish they still made those! It was not that heavy, and the optics seemed better to me than our GSO.

We were thinking about a 14 inch Orion Optics UK dob, but these cost a fair bit new. Should I expect better optics than Skywatcher? I was happy with the Skywatcher optics, but if splashing out a lot more on another brand, I would hope to see a difference at the eyepiece.

Because of our fondness for the old SW 12 inch solid tube, the new Celestron StarSense 12 inch has caught our eye, but we know practically nothing about it. Are these being well received?

Or is it worth considering a 16 or 18 inch dob open design after all, with some DIY to make things easier, such as wheelbarrow handles? If there's a way to make a 16 or 18 inch work within budget that can be stored indoors and taken out without giving me a hernia, then we might be willing to give up on the solid tube preference.

Why solid tube? Well we just found it a bit less hassle, less prone to dew. That was our experience anyway with the scopes we've had, and in some ways, the old SW 12 inch solid tube was my favourite dob, pound for pound. I kinda wish we'd never sold it. I preferred it to the 12 inch FlexTube.

Eyepiece-wise, we have Tele Vue 21mm Ethos and the rest are Delos mostly, and we have a Tele Vue Paracorr, which seems to tidy up the optics a bit on the GSO. So I think the eyepieces can cope with a fast scope? The GSO has served us well, but we'd like to feel like we are significantly upgrading it.

Thanks for reading and for any thoughts. If you need any more info about our needs, please fire away!

1 hour ago, Steve Ward said:

Hi Luke ,

Welcome back.

Back at my childhood home these days so no more ladders and 14' piers ... 😄

Thanks, Steve! Ah, sounds like you have it very comfortable these days, and could do it in your slippers. I do sometimes think it might be nice to do some solar in winter pointing through a closed window! A bit of Baader Optical Wonder on the double glazing.

41 minutes ago, Ratlet said:

Welcome back.  My wife is similarly afflicted with boardgames.  She'll be delighted to know that the Venn diagram of astronomy and boardgames has some overlap lol.

You'll get some good feedback on dob choices here for sure.  

Thanks! I do have some games related to astronomy, so there is definitely some overlap, LOL! Luckily for me, my wife and son also share the same affliction! When I first met Sarah, she beat me about a dozen times straight at my favourite board game!

(cough), and this one...:

Hello there, Mr Ward! Good to see you back in the saddle! Yeah, I know you posted this a while ago. Did it require climbing up any ladders for the time of year?!

Very nice, Dave! So that's what the sun's looking like these days! We're past minimum?!

Hi!

I used to post on SGL years ago, under the username Luke, then later something like Drop Of Sun, and I went to some of the fab SGL star parties, along with Sarah. I'd love to get active on the forums again! I hope to get to know some of the folks who have joined in the years since then, and hopefully see some of the old gang on here again! And I'm especially looking forward to drooling over some of the solar images again!

Anyway, I am really into board gaming these days. I haven't been doing that much stargazing these past years, but I've done the odd night (probably not that much different to some of you with our UK skies, LOL!), and always make sure I get to see the Orion nebula each year, and have really enjoyed it when I've done it, and I'd like to get back more into the hobby again!

My wife Sarah and I have not bought any gear for ages, but we might be in a position to get our dream dob in the near future, which doesn't mean a 20-incher, alas, but something hopefully of a good optical quality that won't give me a hernia or do my dodgy knee in. I dunno whether that would top out at something like one of the lighter, faster 14 inch scopes (we sold our Skywatcher 400P Goto years ago), maybe something a bit posh, like Orion Optics UK. Though I am not sure how those compare optically with Skywatcher / what you get, if anything, for the extra cost (I don't want to make any assumptions or start a war!).

Or would something heavier with wheelbarrow handles be doable? Surely not a Skywatcher 18 inch?! So a new or used dob is top of my mind! I've mainly been using our old GSO 10 inch dob for deep sky, which has lasted well, though optically, I think our Skywatcher scopes were better. I wish we'd kept the old 12 inch SW solid tubes - those were brill!

I suppose a h-alpha solar scope would be rather nice, but I guess those are still ££££s. Maybe I'll have a look at the Lunts on FLO. I don't think I will get back to solar imaging (processing, maybe, but not capture), though never say never!

Anyway, it's lovely to hopefully be back, and I hope you've had some nice choccy today, or something else you enjoy!

Cheers,

Luke