Farm fields and Astonomers?

[astroimpulse]

Just wondering if any of you have had experience of using, or asking to use, a nearby quiet farm's field for long sessions?

I'd like to get an idea on the general attitudes farmers have.

There's loads around my place and they're often on crop rotation and just sitting there gagging to be Astroimpulsed

[ampleamp]

Hi Sy,

my entire business revolves around farmers (stock farmers; have little experience with the arable lot) so hope have someting to say, but just general comments.

If possible get a personal introduction - eg, farmers wife working in town, a doctor, a minister, a vet etc; farmers are by nature very wary, even suspicious of someone asking them for anything and will initially think that you are there to case the place or worse. Having that introduction breaks down most initial barriers if someone he knows will vouch for you. A random letter of introduction from some other townie will get you nowhere.

If that option isn't available i would contact the local NFU branch who will be able to put you in touch with some friendlier ones as a starter and may even be able to introduce you to someone who has an interest.

Having a little knowledge/interest of their business will definately help that initial conversation, eg, lambing season, breeds, crop type, milking times etc etc

If you turn up too smart they will think you are a rep and tell you that they are too busy and to leave, if you turn up too scruffy they will just tell you to leave. Maybe take a portable setup for them to have a look at; it is all about that first impression. Above all be very polite, most are conservative (small and captial C) and will appreciate that. Most farms are under-staffed and the people there usually are running around so your first visit may coincide with some important job and maybe no-one will have time to speak to you, just quickly arrange a more convenient time, most will appreciate you coming straight to the point.

If i may say, don't under-estimate them, the (our) modern farmer is typically very bright with a huge practical knowledge and would likely be quite interested - many of our clients are intrigued with the thought of me looking up although most think that i must have too much time on my hands.

Hope this is the sort of thing you are after, maybe you will get some direct experience of farmer attitudes - i have never had to ask as i am lucky enough to live in a fairly dark area anyway

Alistair

[astroimpulse]

It's not what I was looking for...it's FAR more!!! :icon_salut:

Excellent reply and everything is definitely noted

The first impression thing is something I would have done and I'm aware of what people think of random knockers of doors...but it's great to see it confirmed from experience. So thanks for that.

The point about introduction from someone they know is excellent too. Not sure how I'll achieve it but I get on well with the local PO owner and she's bound to know farmers etc as they'll pop in all the time.

I'm going to bend her ear tomorrow if I go

Excellent reply Alistair. Many thanks

[chris connolly]

Our local society has the use of small paddock owned by a farmer and has even allowed us to put a small concrete slab down,so give it a try.

[JamesM]

I understand where you're coming from Ampleamp but I can only speak from my own experience in that I have never had a problem with a farmer/land owner be they young/old and I've never needed a letter or any other means of introduction etc. All I have ever done is to work out who owns the land, where they live and pop along late in the afternoon to see who is about. If the farmer is not there I leave a message to say that I called and to ask when the best time would be to make contact. Without exception (...maybe I'm lucky) but I have never had an awkward experience, always found them generous, helpful and interested in what I'm doing. Maybe its me, my manner, I don't really know for sure but as I am an honest and straightforward person perhaps this comes across in some way.

What I always make sure with any arrangements is to agree a protocol with the farmer/landowner, whereby I will ring and leave a message saying when I will be at the agreed spot, how long I'm staying for and if anyone else is with me AND to offer an invite for them to come and have a look if they want to. This is to ensure that I can prove to anyone who needs to know what it is I'm doing and that I have permission to be there. It also has the benefit of showing the farmer that you respect his/her generosity in being allowed to use their land and so the telephone call provides evidence of your appreciation. Although I have an idea of the spot that I would like to use, more often than not, the farmer actually comes up with a better solution. To be truthful, I think farmers quite like having another pair of eye/ears about the place and it certainly doesn't do any harm.

Just to finish, every Christmas I always ensure that I offer a bottle or two as a way of saying thank you and in reality to ensure that the arrangement can continue into the next year. Again I can only talk about my own experience and I'm sure there will be others who will offer stories of being chased into the sunset accompanied by a shotgun but it hasn't been mine. All you can do is ask and be yourself Sy and I'm sure any reasonable person hearing your request will do what they can to help.

Clear skies

James

[sbooder]

I would just trespass! There nothing to match the thrill of being chased by a 12 bore wielding farmer while carrying all your kit.

Only joking.

I have a good relationship with most of the farmers near me as I know most of them from shoots. They have all said they would not mind me being on their land as long as I give them a bell first and also tell the local police, this will make life a lot easier.

[Alkaid]

Very interesting thread, thank you.

I have a question please - how does one find out who owns the land?

Is there a land registry website or something like that? Or does one approach the council?

Thanks Steve

[sbooder]

Most times asking anyone who has lived near a farm for sometime knows who the farmer is, just ask around.

[brianb]

There nothing to match the thrill of being chased by a 12 bore wielding farmer while carrying all your kit.

That's a lot less dangerous than being trampled all over by a field full of bullocks ... cleaning the slobber off your precious optics would put you off trying it again.

Seriously, though, if a farmer is receiving set-aside grant for land that is doing nothing and can get a few quid off an astronomer in "rent" (especially as a tax-free backhander) then he's going to jump at the chance.

[astroimpulse]

Excellent replies guys.

And yeh, being chased with a shotgun is not a good idea

I'll start asking around and see where I get. I don't think rent will be asked for someone just jumping over a wall into the edge of a field. At lest I hope not

[brianb]

I don't think rent will be asked for someone just jumping over a wall into the edge of a field.

Does you no harm to offer a few quid, & may soften his heart. Finding you on his ground without asking previously is very unlikely to result in being allowed to stay.

[astroimpulse]

Of course not. Hence the thread on asking.

But yeh...the offer of a few quid could be a decent ice-breaker.

If I get to the PO today I'm going to start my investigations

[umadog]

Much useful advice here. Thanks!

[JB80]

It may not work for everybody or be to your tastes but you can always try the local pubs, surely farmers still enjoy a pint or two still. A good friendly social setting with locals could be a good in, if your friendly with the barmen that's normally a good reference.

Don't know, the other replies have been really good so I thought I'd add something different.

[ampleamp]

prompted by this question, i asked the 8 clients on whose farms i was on today what their attitude would be - these have been a mixture of dairy, beef and sheep farms.

Only one said categorically not, didn't want people trampsing about etc etc (but he is a grumpy oik so not really surprised). Another was very cautious but I was pleased to hear that the rest were fairly open to astronomy as an activity, two offered to show me what they thought would be good spots there and then (echoing JBM's experiences) but all said that they would agree or not just based on how they felt and conduct the first couple of times.

Sy, in my highly unscientific study, you have at least a 75% good chance, so go for it ;-))

[mikeknowle]

Alistair, top points.

I drive about the UK, and often pull over if the sky is clear and have a hours gaze. Now planning to get a portable dob. to keep in the car for that very purpose.

So really the only place suitable if you don't know the area and ar passing through is in front of a field 5-bar gate. I'd never drive in/climb over of course (esp. carrying a scope), but your post got me thinking....that wouldn't cause any prob. would it? Obviously can't really go knocking on farmhouse doors after dusk, and wouldn't want some unsuspecting Farmer thinking that car over by his field gate is parked up to rustle sheep, steal his quad-bikes etc. etc. etc.

Mike

[michael.h.f.wilkinson]

I have not set up my scope on farmland yet, but I have asked farmers if I could dig for fossils (in Germany and Wales), which of course is far more intrusive. They first give you a VERY suspicious look (especially as you come along armed with picks, hammers, and all the paraphernalia of the trade), and after some explaining of what you want to do, i.e., NOT dig up their crops, just have a look in their abandoned quarry or some rocky outcrop on their land, they usually become very interested. I always showed them what I had found afterwards, and thanked them for their kindness. Whenever I found a couple of similar ones, I would always offer them one to keep.

Asking to set up the scope in an empty field should not be a problem, especially if you invite them to have a look.

[sbooder]

I always give my local farmers samples from the fossils I collect with their permission, some even give me a bell to tell me that they have just ploughed a particular field, if I wish to get down and hunt for rocks!

[BinocularSky]

It's been over a decade since I've needed to ask permission to use farmland, but one advantage to the farmer is that there will be a periods of dark night-time during which there will be people awake and on site and, hence, a deterrent to the increasing number of lowlife that thieve from farms.

[michael.h.f.wilkinson]

I always give my local farmers samples from the fossils I collect with their permission, some even give me a bell to tell me that they have just ploughed a particular field, if I wish to get down and hunt for rocks!

As we have little rock where I live in the Netherlands, all a ploughed field would show here is clay. The city of Groningen itself is built at the northern end of a ridge of boulder clay, left over from the last ice age. It does contain fossils so it is more productive to ask permission at a building site in the appropriate area to scrounge for fossils whenever they dig deep enough. You generally get permission without difficulty.

As so often in life, ask politely, and you shall be given

[sbooder]

As so often in life, ask politely, and you shall be given

So true! I am never sure why people are rude, it seems such a waste of the day. I always offer something in return for the farmers, for letting me either go observing or fossiling, even if it is just litter clearing in the field I am in.

[Alkaid]

Is there anything wrong with someone setting up their equipment on a public footpath that goes through a field?

Bit of a grey area that one I'm sure....

[BinocularSky]

(Caveat: IANAL)

Not grey at all.

Section 137 of the Highways Act 1980 states:

137 Penalty for wilful obstruction.

(1)If a person, without lawful authority or excuse, in any way wilfully obstructs the free passage along a highway he is guilty of an offence and liable to a fine not exceeding level 3 on the standard scale.

In the terms of the Act, a footpath is deemed a highway. A level 3 fine was increased to £1000 by the Criminal Justice Act 1982.

[michael.h.f.wilkinson]

Is there anything wrong with someone setting up their equipment on a public footpath that goes through a field?

Bit of a grey area that one I'm sure....

Even if it is a public footpath, I would still ask for permission, just as a matter of courtesy. So long as you do not obstruct the right of way you may legally be OK, but remaining on good terms with a landowner is never a bad thing. Don't forget, even if it is a public footpath, there may be cattle in the field. Especially younger cows are very inquisitive (and quite boisterous at times), I shudder at the thought of having a cow lick the corrector plate of my SCT.

[RogerTheDodger]

I used to metal detect, and on a local dairy farm the farmer would often let the cows into the same field as me and then stand laughing as they followed me around the field... cows are quite inquisitive