plossl/super plossl ?

[rory]

difference's please. is it just better glass? thanks for any advice.

[great_bear]

Super Plossl is just a marketing term - it has no technical significance whatsoever.

[rory]

Super Plossl is just a marketing term - it has no technical significance whatsoever.

really? okay so if im looking to buy a 32mm plossl,id be no better off with a super as opposed to a standard plossl ?

thanks .

[JamesM]

If you were thinking of improving on the viewing experience of the plossl's that come with your scope, then the 5000 series of 'super' Plossls from Meade are great with much larger glass to look through and an adjustable eye cup that can help you locate that that sweet spot and protect your eye from stray light. I believe that FLO have them on offer at the moment.

James

[Falcon]

There are companies that sell both the plossl and the super plossl series eyepieces with a price difference about 10 to 20% between them. In these cases and more generally the difference consist of fully-multi coated optics or multi coated optics (SP) instead of only coated (I think - maybe not every glass to air surface) for the pure plossl. Other differences that may be found are blackened lens edges for SP and presence of eyeguard, filter thread and not at the end - bigger FOV (but the last ones are deviate from standard plossl design and have FOV>52deg and more than 4 lenses).

So within the one brand, super plossl EPs should be preffered because of better light transmission and viewing comfort.

[Ad Astra]

"Plossl" refers to a 4-element lens design created in the late-1800's by Georg Plossl (German?) astronomer.

The lens design gives good eye relief and sported a 50-degree apparent field (wider image at the eyepiece) than the then common Ramsden, Huygens, and Orthoscopic eyepiece designs.

"Super Plossl" is a marketing term that refers to an improved design, mostly with better glass, coatings, etc. than a common standard lens. Super Plossls are also often 'edge blackened', meaning that the edges of the glass elements have been painted black to minimize internal reflections and help contrast. (you can do that part yourself on almost any eyepiece!)

I hope that helps,

Dan

[great_bear]

"Super Plossl" is a marketing term that refers to an improved design, mostly with better glass, coatings, etc. than a common standard lens.

This is simply not true.

There is no such thing as a "common standard lens" that a "Super Plossl" is superior to. There are no such standards. Let's take an example: Tele Vue make only one Plossl, considered by many as the best 'Plossl' currently in production. They are not called "Super" and are quite expensive at around £85 each. But hey! Super Plossls must be better right? - cos they've got the word "Super" in their name yes? - and they're only £19 from Sky-Watcher!

The truth is you can find fully multi-coated lenses and blackened lens edges on pretty much all "Plossl" eyepieces on the market today - "Super" or not.

[Ad Astra]

The truth is you can find fully multi-coated lenses and blackened lens edges on pretty much all "Plossl" eyepieces on the market today - "Super" or not.

I only wish this were true. Many bargain and off-brand eyepieces have elements that are either singly or non-coated on the interior of the eyepiece, and very few manufacturers blacken the edges of their lens elements as a standard procedure, certainly not on their basic lines such as those they distribute included with a scope or in their 'beginners' eyepiece set. Take one of your own eyepieces apart (carefully!) and check - you might be surprised at what you find.

Making an excellent eyepiece is a process with many steps - and only a few of those are immediately obvious from the outside. There are lots of places to cut corners. This is why one should listen carefully to reviews and discussions here and at the local astronomy club, and stick to the better known manufacturers and dealers. Even if you do go wrong, a reputable dealer will make an exchange for a proper product to keep you happy.

Your local club is your best resource - "talk to the fellow who bought one" is always good advice - and even better when you can see the item and try it out first hand!

Good luck in your search - let us know what you decide to get.

Dan

[Merlin66]

There is/was a five element "Super" plossl design - based on a Masuyama design and manufacture - Meade had a limited release but didn't maintain them in the product range. These 5 element designs can indeed give better performance than the "standard" plossl.

I've used the Masuyamas - "the Holy Grail", I have a set of the Meade 5 element and a box of TV plossls.

[rory]

nice thread ,interesting and helpful, thanks all.

i got a 10 and 20 mm e/p with a celestron astromaster 90 refractor. however im unsure of what they actually are, even instructions dont tell me. but i was assuming they are basic plossl or kellners. but im after a lower power e/p,so this has been helpful.

clear skies...

[great_bear]

Many bargain and off-brand eyepieces have elements that are either singly or non-coated on the interior of the eyepiece

Ah, well - if you're going unbranded then of course all bets are off. I'd assumed however (from the nature of the question), that the OP had moved beyond the realm of £9 bargain-basement eyepieces.

very few manufacturers blacken the edges of their lens elements as a standard procedure

I'd say most manufacturers do these days. You may be thinking of eyepieces from a few years back.

not on their basic lines such as those they distribute included with a scope or in their 'beginners' eyepiece set.

Perhaps the most popular eyepiece set in the UK is the "Revelation (GSO) Photo/Visual Eyepiece Kit" and its derivatives. All eyepieces in that kit have edge-blackened lenses and fully multi-coated optics.

Take one of your own eyepieces apart (carefully!) and check - you might be surprised at what you find.

I take apart almost all of my eyepieces for inspection, and perhaps the biggest surprise is that some of the most expensive - and most revered - eyepieces have neither edge-blackened lenses nor multi-coated optics.

Brandon eyepieces for example. They're not edge-blackened. With regard to coatings, their website says: "The truth is we made several sets using 7-layer multicoatings and found no improvement whatsoever. One reason not to multicoat is to eliminate or greatly reduce a phenomenon known as "narrow angle light scatter". Multicoatings have more narrow angle scatter than standard eyepiece coatings. You can see this effect on bright objects like Venus, Mars or Jupiter, which greatly interfere with low contrast detail"

Whilst - in the absence of scientific data - the above statement is questionable, and whilst it's also true that complex eyepiece designs require multicoating in order to be technically feasible, it's nonetheless also true that multicoatings are not a requirement for a quality eyepiece - even the venerable and ubiquitous Circle-T Orthoscopic is not fully multi-coated.

For edge-blackening, this is in some cases a bit of a marketing gimmick. One of the most respected contributors on Cloudy Nights confessed to me in a private message that on the occasions when he has personally blackened the lens edges on eyepieces which he'd found were not, he noticed that it made no difference to performance in practice. Personally I think that many simple eyepiece designs simply don't need edge-blackening anyway. People assume it's a requirement because they "read it somewhere" in an article about choosing eyepieces. It's no doubt needed in some designs, but by no means all.

[great_bear]

There is/was a five element "Super" plossl design - based on a Masuyama design and manufacture

Yup - still exists - except Antares call it an Elite Plossl

It's also available as the Baader Eudiascopic

Meade had a limited release but didn't maintain them in the product range.

Some say the 5000 Series Plossls are of a similar, 5 element design (6 in the short focal lengths).