New Lights, less pollution?

[Timi09]

Hey,

in Derby where I live, the council are putting up some new white street lights, apparently on one of their leaflets they have said this cuts down light pollution. just wondered if anyone has had these new lights and how much of a difference they made. (I saw some the other week and they look very bright!)

as a side note there was an article in the local paper a while back about them dimming the lights at night but not sure if they have gone for these new ones instead (obviously it's about saving money and not light pollution at all as light pollution is not mentioned at all on their website)

[IanC11]

As for your side note, Essex County Council announced last week that they would be turning off most street lighting between midnight and five am from next April.

Bring it on.!!!!!!

Ian

[Hypernova]

Probably depends if they are going to be shielded as well, no point in having new light encased in a conventional housing that scatters light above the horizontal.

[Timi09]

ha, lucky you I am going to cross my fingers that they go through with it here too!

[Timi09]

Probably depends if they are going to be shielded as well, no point in having new light encased in a conventional housing that scatters light above the horizontal.

I'm not sure, I managed to find a picture though (on their website). I know next to nothing on the subject however (apart from that the current ones ruin my viewing) so I couldn't say:P

[Hypernova]

It looks like that the new lighting has a flat glass bulb cover, not a conventional curved one, so I think there will be very little annoying scatter from these because nearly all the light is directed downwards and none will be shining out of the sides.

[Timi09]

that's great news! thanks a lot:)

[Tddun]

As for your side note, Essex County Council announced last week that they would be turning off most street lighting between midnight and five am from next April.

Bring it on.!!!!!!

Ian

Could you please give a link or something to a source?

[Timi09]

Hey, I know i'm not the one that mentioned it but I did some searching for you cause i'm up and it's cloudy

Essex council turns off the lights | boakes.org

Essex County Council - Street Lighting

just two examples google came up with.

[Doug]

We all know that leaving lights on when most of people are a sleep. the rest are working and 1% looking up what a waist of money , is there anyone out there that would know how much this country would save by turning them off ? the saving must be 10's of millions weekly if the goverment can't see this they are not the right people in power, go green.

[Timi09]

I couldn't agree more Doug,

The only realistic argument I can see is crime, although there are certain stat's that look to disprove this, I don't see why its still not more efficient to have simple IR sensors or such to detect movement and turn on, I know this is cheap and easy as i've done such things myself for a project. The government would still save their precious money,the planet would suffer less, people would feel safe and I'd get a better view of the night sky!

Buckinghamshire is apparently trying this scheme and I found a quote "The council claims the scheme will save £100,000 and nearly 600 tons of carbon dioxide emissions every year.", I would say the benefits are obvious especially when you consider the "savings" over many years, there would be a need to consider peoples safety however, some people just don't feel safe in the dark. we have the technology to do this but it seems some just wouldn't pay out, even if it means a saving in the future and environmental advantage.

just consider how much is spent on CCTV and speed cameras for peoples supposed safety, surely IR sensors or timers are not that big a spend?

the good news is more and more councils seem to be considering this and may have finally seen sense.(I will admit I am biased but even I still possess common sense!)

there you go, you got me started now! (sorry for the rant there)

[Beulah]

is there anyone out there that would know how much this country would save by turning them off ?

Well a local town of mine of a population of 130,000 needs £1m a year to light it's streets.

[acey]

The new streetlights in my area are full cut-off design and the council boasts they are approved by the Campaign for Dark Skies.

But they are brighter and there are more of them, hence more light is reflected from road surfaces into space. The result is increased light pollution, and I have to drive even further to reach dark skies.

[Doug]

Thanks Timi

Rant away mate if we can get more people behind this by having a rant then rant on It maybe ,just maybe we will see some results , I have driven on motorway with no lighting and find that it make no differance with or with out lighting ,all car have good headlights nowdays even 15-20 year old cars are fine if there is a accident turn them on say junction 30to31 it can,t be that difficult, Scotland has dark area so should we

Doug

Essex

[IanC11]

Essex Council reckon they can save £ 2 Million per year to start with, they are also working in conjunction with the police to high light areas of high crime and will leave the street lighting on in these locations.

Ian

[Timi09]

Cheers Doug, as I don't drive I can't really comment on the road lighting(doesn't help me get to dark skies either ), but like you say if its a problem turn some back on, or maybe just dim them in accident prone areas? There are results coming through and changes seem to be being made and making your views heard certainly don't hurt (at worst they will go unheard, but at least we tried).

I wrote to my local council regarding street-lights outlining the above (politely) and had no response just yet. My missus reckons I am getting old before my years complaining about such things!, but to me its not petty, and the thing I think that matters even more than dark skies is the environment, it really rubs me the wrong way when selfish people ignore this because they want to complain about driving or crime, there are ways around that but for the environmental issues there are not.

We have also lost the most important (imo) and beautiful scientific resource we have, to learn more about ourselves and the universe, i'm going to have a cup of tea now before I go into a blind rage!

acey, your comment worries me a little, I certainly hope that's not going to be the case here, Best wishes finding dark spots mate

[acey]

Good luck, Timi09. I've written to the council, my MP and MEP about the new lighting and the only response I've had is that everything complies with EU legislation etc etc. Really the only answer is light dimming or switching off, and in my area that isn't considered an option.

Interesting to note that the company who put up the streetlights is a subsidiary of the company who provides the electricity.

And the problem isn't one for council tax payers who for years have lived in a city too brightly lit for serious astronomy; it's a problem for people in outlying rural districts who see the light dome climbing steadily higher in their sky, and don't have any say in the matter at all.

[Beulah]

And the problem isn't one for council tax payers who for years have lived in a city too brightly lit for serious astronomy; it's a problem for people in outlying rural districts who see the light dome climbing steadily higher in their sky, and don't have any say in the matter at all.

I concur.

[Timi09]

Interesting to note that the company who put up the streetlights is a subsidiary of the company who provides the electricity.

well, imagine that! I would never have guessed!

[PortableAstronomer]

Street lights exists due to several decades of the irrational majority being scared of the dark. You only have to read articles like this

Return of the blackout: Crime fear as councils switch off streetlights to save the planet | Mail Online

to see how typical UK sensationalist journalism is written to scare readers. The woman who said [after the lights went out] it's like a "criminals haven" in her town was trying to make the readers believe that crime had increased, whereas in fact it was just her own feeling of insecurity.

Scaremongering by just a few individuals does wonders to dictate local government policy.

[Hiddenharry]

only if we had less light pollution it would be easier to star gaze

[ncjunk]

I was also wondering, as i drove down a road full of street lights but no pedestrian path, if every other light could not be removed or turned off. It seemed to me as if the number of lights was too high for the amount of light required..

[Hiddenharry]

I was also wondering, as i drove down a road full of street lights but no pedestrian path, if every other light could not be removed or turned off. It seemed to me as if the number of lights was too high for the amount of light required..

good point i had never thought of it so they should turn off or even better remove every other street light

[Beulah]

I think the whole insecurity thing about the lack of street lights is pathetic. I remember walking the two miles back home from a friend's house along pitch black country lanes at 8:30pm in the winter at the age of nine.

Guess what....

I had a torch.

What annoys me is the amount of Urbanites who move to the country and miss that orange glow so much, they install outdoor lights to mimic that effect, all night, even when they are in bed. There's a few of 'em up my road...

[tom.yates]

Yes they are putting the same lighting in my area and i would say yes they are much better the light only seems to shine downwards