Jump to content

sgl_imaging_challenge_2021_annual.thumb.jpg.3fc34f695a81b16210333189a3162ac7.jpg

Newbie and Eyepieces


Recommended Posts

Hi

I hope this is the best place for advice for some one who is baffled by terminology.

Very new to this and am pleased to say I got out last night with my Skyhawk 114 (my bestest XMas pressent ever!) and got some great views of the moon, and even got some great snaps with my point and shoot camera, but I could not see any stars through the scope at all??

The scope came with a 10mm and 25mm wide and 2x barlow and I tried each and every combination but to no avail!

Am I being impatient, thick or what?

Also I was thinking of making a bargain purchase...

"Kit Comprises: 2mm, 5mm, 15mm & 20mm Long Eye Relief Eyepieces, Four Threaded Light Filters (Amber, Blue, Neutral Grey & Moon Filter) Dual - Beam LED Night Vision Torch, Astronomical Telescope User Guide, in lockable, foam-padded Aluminium Case "

All for £69 (RRP£149), I wondered do I need all of the above? what difference will the filters make and what do the filters do.

Any help and advice would be fab.

Heres hoping there are many more clear skies over frosty Gloucester to come!!

Jo

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi

I hope this is the best place for advice for some one who is baffled by terminology.

Very new to this and am pleased to say I got out last night with my Skyhawk 114 (my bestest XMas pressent ever!) and got some great views of the moon, and even got some great snaps with my point and shoot camera, but I could not see any stars through the scope at all??

The scope came with a 10mm and 25mm wide and 2x barlow and I tried each and every combination but to no avail!

Am I being impatient, thick or what?

Also I was thinking of making a bargain purchase...

"Kit Comprises: 2mm, 5mm, 15mm & 20mm Long Eye Relief Eyepieces, Four Threaded Light Filters (Amber, Blue, Neutral Grey & Moon Filter) Dual - Beam LED Night Vision Torch, Astronomical Telescope User Guide, in lockable, foam-padded Aluminium Case "

All for £69 (RRP£149), I wondered do I need all of the above? what difference will the filters make and what do the filters do.

Any help and advice would be fab.

Heres hoping there are many more clear skies over frosty Gloucester to come!!

Jo

My experience is that the supplied ep's are mediocre (probably of the modified achromat type). The 25mm wont be completely worthless but the barlow certainly is and the 10mm will need a replacement (a super plossl or baader orthoscopic (small eye relief but excellent on planets)).

As for ep kits, the ones I've seen at the budget end of the market £100 or so are just the bottom of the range plossl sort. You are much better off buying individually what you want. Having said all that is your scope worth

a decent ep upgrade? Yes if you dont go mad. :-) I wouldn't spend more than £80 on a couple of ep's if I were you.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Skyhawk 114 is 114mm dia and focal length of 1000mm. Giving an f number of 8.77. Scope doesn't state parabolic so I am assuming it is not.

The 25mm EP will give 40x mag the 10mm will give 100x mag. Both EP's should be usable if they are of fair quality since neither goes too high a magnification. Good start so far.

Last night and anytime around a full moon the stars "disappear", basically any that are not so bright get swamped by the moon.

If you get the chance point the scope at Casseiopia, it lies in the milky arm so even if close there should be stars in the field of view. Go looking for stars with the 25mm as the field of view is bigger so they are easier to locate, then change to the 10mm.

If you upgrade the EP's then get some decent plossl's, usually around the £25-30 mark these days. Also check the used sales. A 32mm is possible for wider views and say a 15. You could go down to 8mm but not sure how the scope would handle it. Wouldn't suggest smaller. Ignore the advertising that say Max Mag = 228x. Thats garbage!

Have you a finder scope and is it aligned?

What is the collimation like? You may have to collimate it to get better/sharper views.

The 2 and 5mm EP in the kit you mentioned will be useless to you. Please don't bother with it.

Edited by Capricorn
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Firts of all, welcome to SGL. kjmorg66.

I'm sure you'll find yourself buried in astrospeke within minutes but fear not, it'll all make sense soon enough.

As Capricorn says, get your collimation (mirror alignment) checked first. This is easy to check, and almost, but not quite, as easy to set.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've tried some of those "Long Eye Relief" eyepieces (the ones in that kit) and I was not very impressed I'm afraid. As has been said, you are better off spending your money on individual eyepieces.

The Revelation & Celestron eyepiece sets are better quality but cost more of course.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

My "classic" scope is 114mm reflector f/8.9 and I can get nice views of stars and some DSOs with it. I like it so much, infact, that I have just recently acquired a few (cheapo/free) 0.965" eye pieces for it.

I can only collimate this scope roughly, as my cheshire collimator is for 1.25" focuser, so I followed Astro babys collimation guide Astro Babys Guide to Collimation, but without using a collimator. I'm searching all the wee plasic caps at work for a suitable collimation cap, this evening.

With your scope a rough collimation, if that's all it is, will make all the difference.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think it has to be remembered, that for experianced astonomers, top shelf plossls etc. are the danglies, and anything less just ain't worth havin'.

But for beginners surely even the bargain bucket stuff can be used. Of course I'm not suggesting that anyone needs to buy a huge bag of EPS, but a varied range of "ok" lenses to get started might be better than 150 quid on one EP.

Forgive me if you think I'm talking out of my hat, but some folk could be on a rather tight budget for their astro gear (like me, for instance).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm with the less is more philosophy!

I have found 2/3 EPs and a barlow, if well chosen, is all you need to cover all your bases. I use a 31mm widefield for DSOs, 15mm for smaller DSOs, a 10mm for planets and a 5mm for planets under good seeing conditions.

If you get the chance go to a star party so you can peek through lots of diferent gear and make your mind based on 1st hand experience.

Edited by pvaz
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thank you all for your comments and advice, like they say if its too good to be true it probabaly is - as I suspected.

So the 2 EPs supplies should be OK as a starter. I havent got a great deal of spare cash (who has at the moment!) but will look into maybe picking up an EP or two.

Surely the collimation is OK if I can get fabulous view of the moon?

I will keep trying with the 2 EP I have and fingers crossed and a bit more patience I might get to see something other than the moon!

I have got a red dot finder and think it is aligned.......

Star parties sound really daunting to a total novice but can see the benefits of the knowledge and advice I could pick up - I shall look for clubs in the Gloucestershire area - if anyone knows of any I would love to know about it

Thanks once again

Jo

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's a bit of a learning curve. Take your time and don't splash out money right away. The 2 EPs you have are ok to start with.

On the collimation, the moon tolerates bad collimation well. Point at a star, using the 10mm, and get it out of focus, if you see a circle of light, with a black hole in it (like a donut) then it's fine. If the circle is oval then you need to collimate.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think theres not much wrong with a kit of EPs - the Celestron ones are rather good I found. They give you a chance to see what you like.

Theres another thread running where I pointed out the dangers of high power EPs. Beginners to the hobby almost always assume they want massive magnification so if you told a beginner to buy one decent EP theres a real danger they'd go and buy a 2mm Orthoscopic which would get zero use.

A kit of halfway decent EPs like the Celestron and Revelation sets gives the tyro a chance to try different things, get some experience with fiters etc and find out what they want to spend the big money on later.

If you shop around the sets can be sold 2nd hand in good nick (mine sold for £90) and you would almost certainly get the kit sold on later.

I dont disagree entirely with the 'get one good EP' philisophy and its undoubteldy the cheaper way to go in the long run BUT - you end up with a great EP for seeing wide views of nebulas and no EPs at all for anything else. Thats great assuming you never want to look at the moon or any planets.

I think the halfway house apprach has its advantages. I quite quickly realised with the Celestron set that I'd never get on with high power Plossls, I also realised what EPs I would most likely need which refined my choices.

Thats just personal opinion of course - hope its useful to you.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

After a bit of research I think I will look at investing 15mm and 20mm which is somewhere in between the 2 I have. Im not sure if I can go for an 8mm with my scope. Also there was a comment from Jim M that my 2x barlow would be completely worthless is that because of the max magnification I can see or because it is a Rubbish make? Wondering if there would be THAT much difference if I replaced that also?

I am sceptical as at this rate the EP's will cost more than the scope itself.

I apprecaite its not a cheap hobby but am I wasting my money buying decent EP's on a low cost scope?

Thanks

Jo

Link to comment
Share on other sites

\...I am sceptical as at this rate the EP's will cost more than the scope itself.

Generally, the eyepieces supplied with scopes do not fully do justice to the capabilities of the scopes optics. So replacing them in due course is worthwhile. Also good eyepieces will work well with any scope you may get in the future.

I reckon a good rule of thumb is to budget 50% of the cost of your scope to spend on eyepieces. Sounds a lot I know but good eyepieces (as you are finding out) are expensive. If they gave you good ones with the scopes the list price of the scopes would be a lot higher .....

You can get good eyepieces used which can really cut the cost of a decent collection - see the SGL classifieds for details !

Edited by John
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thank you all once again for your hints, tips and advice.

I am pleased to report that I have managed to see stars with my 2 EP's and even got a view of Mars - albeit a wobbly image but none the less I feel I have finally come to a mututal understanding with my scope.

I have been out every night since Friday and am loving it. I cannot believe where the time goes and Im looknig forward to many more nights to come - although Im sure the family think they have been abandoned.

Once again many thanks

Jo

Link to comment
Share on other sites

..... none the less I feel I have finally come to a mututal understanding with my scope....

What a great way to put it ;)

I'm glad you are starting to see some stuff - I suspect the bug is biting :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

. I cannot believe where the time goes and Im looknig forward to many more nights to come - although Im sure the family think they have been abandoned.

I know the feeling! Maybe if you can get them involved they will enjoy/understand it better. I suggest you use Saturn as a lure. It rarely fails to impress.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Then hit them with M42, such an easy target and rarely fails to fill one with awe.

Set yourself personal targets too, something which is barely, if at all, visible to the naked eye, then hunt it down. Most rewarding to nail such things.

Edited by yeti monster
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The 2 and 5mm EP in the kit you mentioned will be useless to you. Please don't bother with it.

Agreed. As stated above the Celestron and Revelation EP kits are pretty good (i have the Celestron kit). They give you an all round good range of magnifications at quite low cost. They are more then enough to be getting on with until you learn whats best and know what exactly you want to purchase as individual EP's.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm having the same kind of problems. I registered especially to get advice.

I just got a Sky-Watcher Classic 90 (90mm x 900mm) refractor and am completely baffled by the eye pieces. I'm pretty lost by the whole thing to be honest. I hate to sound like a such a newb, but the website said I'd be able to see Mars as half the size of the moon would appear with the naked eye but I couldn't get it to appear any more than a bright pixel, exactly the same as it appears through the viewer. The ones I was supplied with were the Barlow (but that's useless apparently?) 10mm and 25mm. I tried them all the combination and I just can't figure it out. I just fumbled around like an idiot child, I feel pretty stupid at the moment :) If anyone can give me any advice at all I would be so appreciative. I don't understand the jargon behind powers and aperture and magnification, the instructions were pretty dire. I just need to know what combination results with me fulfilling my life long dream of seeing Mars.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm having the same kind of problems. I registered especially to get advice.

I just got a Sky-Watcher Classic 90 (90mm x 900mm) refractor and am completely baffled by the eye pieces. I'm pretty lost by the whole thing to be honest. I hate to sound like a such a newb, but the website said I'd be able to see Mars as half the size of the moon would appear with the naked eye but I couldn't get it to appear any more than a bright pixel, exactly the same as it appears through the viewer. The ones I was supplied with were the Barlow (but that's useless apparently?) 10mm and 25mm. I tried them all the combination and I just can't figure it out. I just fumbled around like an idiot child, I feel pretty stupid at the moment ;) If anyone can give me any advice at all I would be so appreciative. I don't understand the jargon behind powers and aperture and magnification, the instructions were pretty dire. I just need to know what combination results with me fulfilling my life long dream of seeing Mars.

Hi and welcome to SGL :)

Can I give you a little tip - if you start your own threads you will get many more reponses. If you tag your question onto the end of an existing thread it may well not get noticed ;)

Here is a link to a really good introduction to eyepiece selection which I hope will help:

http://stargazerslounge.com/beginners-help-advice/80772-eyepieces-very-least-you-need.html

PS: you can see Mars with your naked eye of course !

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Get the best ep's you can afford - within reason. Personally I'd put a limit

at about £40 - £60 per ep . Observing with the crappy supplied modified achromat type is just one huge disappointment. I'd say a beginner doesn't need many ep's - just 2 or 3 to start with.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm having the same kind of problems. I registered especially to get advice.

Glad Im noit the only one that is confused, although I will say that everyone that has replied has been very helpful and I would have problem posting even the daftest of questions in future. :)

Dont give up

Jo

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A simple way to think about eyepieces and magnification is - the shorter focal length EPs, say 5mm or 7mm give much higher magnification than longer focal length EPs of maybe 15mm or 20mm or above.

Take the focal length of your telescope - in the case of MissMars, 900mm and divide it by the focal length of the EP you are using...that will be the magnification.

So a 20mm EP would give (900 divided by 20) 45X mag while a 6mm EP would give (900 divided by 6) 150X mag.

Hope this is clearer :)

Edited by Saturnalia
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue. By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.