ASIAir first impressions

[Swoop1]

Had my first session learning about my new ASIAir Plus tonight.

initial thoughts are a bit hit and miss.

All went well to start with and I found that polar alignment was quite easy as was finding targets and, running an autofocus routine with my new EAF was a joy but, when I went to set up the guide scope and camera, things started to go south. The unit kept forgetting the guide camera was on and also kept dropping the wireless connection, eventually consistently being unable to join the unit’s wireless network.

 I tried a reset, uninstalled and reinstalled the app etc. with no joy so I packed everything away. 

There is definitely something to look forward to once I have it nailed down but the teething troubles frustrate.

[Mr Spock]

Aye, technology. The more complicated the plumbing the easier it is to stop up the drain 

I've watched a few YouTube tutorials and it does seem intuitive. I'm sure you'll get it sorted.

[Ouroboros]

6 hours ago, Swoop1 said:

The unit kept forgetting the guide camera was on and also kept dropping the wireless connection,

Re. Guide camera - could that be a cabling problem? Might be worth swapping cables. 

As for dropping wireless connection, how far are you from the ASIair?  My iPad loses contact intermittently beyond about 7 metres.

I regularly get wireless dropouts anyway, even if I remain within the wireless zone.  The workaround for me is to go into settings on my phone or iPad. Disconnect from ASI Wi-Fi by changing to my home wifi, then swap back to Air’s Wi-Fi. Then go into the ASIair app.

Losing wireless contact isn’t a problem as such, apart from being a nuisance. The ASIair carries on doing whatever it was doing regardless. 

[Elp]

If equipment keeps disconnecting this usually points to a cabling or power issue. The cables provided with zwo equipment isn't the best, but I've also had my own cables do unexpected things. You don't need to wait for night to test this, just try it during the day with everything plugged in.

What is connected to the air and how are you powering it?

[Ouroboros]

7 minutes ago, Elp said:

You don't need to wait for night to test this, just try it during the day with everything plugged in.

Good idea - apart from that weird thing about kit working fine in daytime tests but play up in imaging sessions. Gremlins sleep during the day.  

[Vroobel]

I can recommend an antenna replacement if you have problem with the WiFi range. 

https://www.dewcontrol.com/details/p3099125_21560791.aspx

 

[globular]

2 hours ago, Ouroboros said:

I regularly get wireless dropouts anyway, even if I remain within the wireless zone.  The workaround for me is to go into settings on my phone or iPad. Disconnect from ASI Wi-Fi by changing to my home wifi, then swap back to Air’s Wi-Fi.

Phones and iPads tend to prefer to connect to Wi-Fi's that have an internet connection. So after you connect them to your Air’s WiFi they go looking for one with internet and swap to that instead.
Just before connecting to my equipment's WiFi, I change the setting on my iPad to turn off auto connect for my home WiFi. This way there are no other WiFi’s that the iPad can automatically change to once it realises it has no internet.  I turn auto connect back on after my session is over. 
Never had a dropout since doing this. YMMV.

Edited August 17 by globular

[900SL]

OP, Are you connecting directly to the AsiAir or using Station mode and your home wifi network?

If connecting directly, I have to 'forget' my tablet wifi connection, then connect to the ASI Air (using an Android tablet).

You seem to have two issues here, wifi dropout and guide camera disconnecting 

I have ongoing issues with the guide camera disconnecting randomly (which shows in the app as the guide graph freezing, then the guide cam icon greying out) which then drops the mount connection and the tracking stops. I've changed cables to good quality, installed a Slate GL-AR750S mini router directly connected via LAN to the Asi Air Pro to boost the wifi, you name it, I've trouble shot it, all to no avail. Doesn't happen all the time, may go a session without an issue, drives me nuts. 

Good luck, hope you find a quick fix

 

 

Edited August 17 by 900SL

[Ouroboros]

1 hour ago, Vroobel said:

I can recommend an antenna replacement if you have problem with the WiFi range. 

https://www.dewcontrol.com/details/p3099125_21560791.aspx

 

I bought one of those a couple of weeks ago. It has made no difference whatsoever to the number of dropouts I see. 

[Ouroboros]

1 hour ago, globular said:

Phones and iPads tend to prefer to connect to Wi-Fi's that have an internet connection. So after you connect them to your Air’s WiFi they go looking for one with internet and swap to that instead.
Just before connecting to my equipment's WiFi, I change the setting on my iPad to turn off auto connect for my home WiFi. This way there are no other WiFi’s that the iPad can automatically change to once it realises it has no internet.  I turn auto connect back on after my session is over. 
Never had a dropout since doing this. YMMV.

This sounds like a good idea, and I will try it. 

What’s confusing me though is that when I get a drop out and go back into my iPad or iPhone’s Wi-Fi settings it shows they are still connected to my ASIair’s wireless network. And yet they will not talk to the ASIair. I get a message in my ASIair’s app as follows.  That seems to want an ip address, but it still won’t connect even if I put it in. The only thing I’ve found works is to disconnect from the Air’s wireless network and then re-connect. It’s then hunky dory until it disconnects again. 

[saac]

23 minutes ago, Ouroboros said:

This sounds like a good idea, and I will try it. 

What’s confusing me though is that when I get a drop out and go back into my iPad or iPhone’s Wi-Fi settings it shows they are still connected to my ASIair’s wireless network. And yet they will not talk to the ASIair. I get a message in my ASIair’s app as follows.  That seems to want an ip address, but it still won’t connect even if I put it in. The only thing I’ve found works is to disconnect from the Air’s wireless network and then re-connect. It’s then hunky dory until it disconnects again. 
 

Forget the IP address, as far as I am aware you only connect via IP when you are using an ethernet connection to the ASiAir. I connect by ethernet almost all the time  - remote connection to the observatory from the house. I only briefly use the wif connection if I'm setting up at the scope and there I will use my tablet or laptop to make the connection. Whenever I get wifi drop outs I just go through the routine you described, disconnect and reconnect. Poor wifi just seems to be part of the ASiAir's party tricks and you will get used to it - at least the ASiAir continues working in the background without the connection. Regarding your guide cam drop out, I'd echo swapping out the usb cables to the camera and also make sure you have the correct power supply to the Air, it can be sensitive to undervolt.  Persevere with it because it is a great bit of kit when you have it dialled down and working, good luck  

Jim

Edited August 17 by saac

[Ouroboros]

Thanks, @saac.  Actually it’s @Swoop1 we’re helping here as the ASIair newbie.  I just sort of high jacked the thread with my personal grief about dropouts. I’m used to them after several years. Still annoying though. The Plus is better than the Pro it must be said. 

[Elp]

34 minutes ago, Ouroboros said:

The Plus is better than the Pro it must be said. 

And the mini is better than the v1 plus. I've owned all of them, the mini has the best WiFi, but maybe V3 plus is now just as good (the mini was the newest version until zwo started making their own PCBs and updated the plus to V2 then 3, think that's the latest).

[Elp]

2 hours ago, 900SL said:

I've changed cables to good quality, installed a Slate GL-AR750S mini router directly connected via LAN to the Asi Air Pro to boost the wifi, you name it, I've trouble shot it, all to no avail

What is connected to the air?

I used to use a WiFi extender with my pro, the usb power being drawn from the air. During plans my camera would disconnect randomly. The power draw of the WiFi extender was the culprit. It why I also don't use the air to power dew heating (though funnily enough it works fine with my Celestron C6 dew ring via 12v, usb ones for my refractor type optics not so much).

To properly diagnose you should connect a power meter between the input power and the air to find out what your max power draw is, and input power or connect accordingly. Mine was around 3A when the mount is fully slewing in Ra and Dec, cameras taking images and cooled to minus 10 indoors (so cooler is working harder than it would normally).

Edited August 17 by Elp

[saac]

1 hour ago, Ouroboros said:

Thanks, @saac.  Actually it’s @Swoop1 we’re helping here as the ASIair newbie.  I just sort of high jacked the thread with my personal grief about dropouts. I’m used to them after several years. Still annoying though. The Plus is better than the Pro it must be said. 

Ooops, sorry @Swoop1 and @Ouroboros , I really should read through the thread 🤭

Jim

[900SL]

2 hours ago, Elp said:

What is connected to the air?

I used to use a WiFi extender with my pro, the usb power being drawn from the air. During plans my camera would disconnect randomly. The power draw of the WiFi extender was the culprit. It why I also don't use the air to power dew heating (though funnily enough it works fine with my Celestron C6 dew ring via 12v, usb ones for my refractor type optics not so much).

To properly diagnose you should connect a power meter between the input power and the air to find out what your max power draw is, and input power or connect accordingly. Mine was around 3A when the mount is fully slewing in Ra and Dec, cameras taking images and cooled to minus 10 indoors (so cooler is working harder than it would normally).

I use a regulated 13.4V PSU (5A up to 8A) feeding a Pegasus power box, so the issue is not the power draw. The mount is also powered from a separate 12V battery. Doesn't matter if I swap around, and the main camera or accessories don't disconnect.

It's specifically guiding stopping, guide camera disconnecting, then mount being dropped. I'm not the only one having this issue, there's a few similar on CN. I've also checked total power draw with a ammeter before. I'm pretty certain its either a shonky internal connection somewhere or a driver issue in the Asi Air (Vixen starbook 10 mount)

If only I wasn't so lazy to switch to my PC/NINA set up, which Ive never used in anger..

[bosun21]

7 hours ago, Ouroboros said:

Good idea - apart from that weird thing about kit working fine in daytime tests but play up in imaging sessions. Gremlins sleep during the day.  

Most definitely!

[Elp]

39 minutes ago, 900SL said:

I've also checked total power draw with a ammeter before

It doesn't matter what input power you're using to a point if it's over the output capability of the air, the air will only output a fixed ceiling, if all the connected items are drawing more than that they'll start to disconnect. But it seems you've addressed this by powering separate items. I'd do a test with connected items one at a time for a while, then add another and another see what happens.

But if other people are having the issue it points to something else. Does the air restart at all, you'd only notice this if you stay with the rig whilst it's running. I've had an issue where the input 12v power pin was shorting against the port outer shielding which caused it to stop mid plan, but probably isn't your issue.

If you've got another air at hand you can also test to see if it affects the second unit.

[900SL]

1 hour ago, Elp said:

It doesn't matter what input power you're using to a point if it's over the output capability of the air, the air will only output a fixed ceiling, if all the connected items are drawing more than that they'll start to disconnect. But it seems you've addressed this by powering separate items. I'd do a test with connected items one at a time for a while, then add another and another see what happens.

But if other people are having the issue it points to something else. Does the air restart at all, you'd only notice this if you stay with the rig whilst it's running. I've had an issue where the input 12v power pin was shorting against the port outer shielding which caused it to stop mid plan, but probably isn't your issue.

If you've got another air at hand you can also test to see if it affects the second unit.

I don't use the power outputs of the ASI Air. Perhaps I didn't make this clear, but I have separate 12V feeds from the Pegasus powerbox to the ASI Air Pro, 533MM Camera, dew heaters and mini router. The powerbox is rated at 10A, and the dropped guidecam is not indicative of an overcurrent issue

[Swoop1]

Last night, the Air was supplying power to my cooled 533MC PRO and the guide cam. The mount was separately powered. 
I did have the mount connected to the Air for driving via a EQMod cable.

 I need to check the amp output of the brick as I used two, one for the mount and one for the Air. My bricks are 8 amp and 5 amp I think so I suppose I should use the 8 amp one for the Air.

[Swoop1]

I have just done a daytime reset of the cables and power and this time, I was able to connect via wireless to the Air and also keep connected to the guide cam.

As per @Ouroboros though, I’m not counting my chickens until I prove it works after dark. There is no doubt in my mind that our hobby attracts a certain breed of nocturnal gremlins.

@900SL I am connecting direct to the Air via wifi.

[Ouroboros]

6 hours ago, Swoop1 said:

I have just done a daytime reset of the cables and power and this time, I was able to connect via wireless to the Air and also keep connected to the guide cam.

As per @Ouroboros though, I’m not counting my chickens until I prove it works after dark. There is no doubt in my mind that our hobby attracts a certain breed of nocturnal gremlins.

@900SL I am connecting direct to the Air via wifi.

Good luck. It looks like it’s going to be clear tonight so I’ll try the “don’t autoconnect” setting as suggested by  @globular

[Ouroboros]

Ah … looks like I spoke too soon.  So much for the clear night forecast. 

[Elp]

1 hour ago, Ouroboros said:

Ah … looks like I spoke too soon.  So much for the clear night forecast. 

There were supposed to be three forecast over the past five days, all a washout.

[Swoop1]

I'm out having my second practice and all seems to be going well. No connection dropping and PA, GoTo etc all working as I would hope.

It was suggested elsewhere that I try BlueStacks emulator to run the ASIAIR app on my laptop- gave it a go but it keeps autoclosing. Perhaps I will have to invest in a cheap tablet that is robust enough for the app.