Pedestal mount DIY

[Mark2022]

I'm beginning to plan an observatory shed for build, not in a garden (I don't have one) but on a "terrace" about  5x5m square above a car port. It's built on an iron bar structure on one side and brick (my outer house brick wall) on the other. The floor is then wood battens (I don't know what size exactly since I didn't build it but 'inherited' it with buying the house.) and, while not a lot, there is some play in the floor as I walk across it.

So, when I think of piers, I can't think of concrete poured into a hole dug in the garden (with Piers Morgan in it ;-)), however, so I don't need to negotiate around a tripod (Skywatcher EQ5 pro with StarTravel 120) in a shed I wish to keep to minimal dimensions (approx 4x6 ft), I would like a pedestal to mount the EQ5 on. However, looking at prices for pedestals and adapters, I just groan (again) and simply cannot justify, in my head, these costs. Paying £200 to £400 for a few lumps of iron just doesn't cut it for me.

To deal with some of the play I spoke of, I have a few heavy concrete slabs which I will lay down but I am wondering if anyone has ever built their own DIY pedestal, knows dimensions and what's needed to allow solid fitting of the Eq5? I'm thinking I just want the height to be about 1m or thereabouts. Cost wise, I was hoping for no more than £50 - perhaps £75 at a push.

PS: I don't have a machine shop!

[Peter Drew]

A "Todmorden" pier will cost around £50.       🙂 

[Mr H in Yorkshire]

Not sure about your pier but I had a similar flexing problem which I dealt with by shoving two removable props under a pair of joists in the centre of garage. If I wanted to house the car I just took out the props. Simple woodwork is all that's required, or a couple of scaffold poles. Merely loading the roof will deflect it but can't see how that will stop it being bouncy. From your post I can't tell if you can even put props direct to joists so I may be talking out of my Piers Morgan!

PS You might have planners on your back by putting something on top of the existing garage roof, just a warning.

Edited March 26, 2023 by Mr H in Yorkshire

[mikeDnight]

 A lot will depend on what sort of observer you are. If only low power visual you may get away with resting a pier on the existing floor, but as you say there is flexure in the floor, I can't see how you'd build a solid enough pier on the budget you suggest. Ideally the pier should be built on a solid base, which would mean either build from the ground up, going through your suspended floor, or building a sub floor from the wall to the steel girder. The first will mean you lose your car port, but either would cost substantially more than £75.   You could however lessen the flexure if the observatory you intend to build has a floor, while the pier rests on the carport roof. If you decided on a block pier you'd really need a solid base or flexure would eventually fracture the joints. A sheet metal worker may be able to construct a pier to your specifications quite cheaply, but again £75 may be too little considering both time and materials. 

[Mark2022]

On 26/03/2023 at 18:31, Peter Drew said:

A "Todmorden" pier will cost around £50.       🙂 

How do you build such a thing and what do you use for a mounting plate for attaching the EQ5?

[Mark2022]

On 26/03/2023 at 20:00, Mr H in Yorkshire said:

Not sure about your pier but I had a similar flexing problem which I dealt with by shoving two removable props under a pair of joists in the centre of garage. If I wanted to house the car I just took out the props. Simple woodwork is all that's required, or a couple of scaffold poles. Merely loading the roof will deflect it but can't see how that will stop it being bouncy. From your post I can't tell if you can even put props direct to joists so I may be talking out of my Piers Morgan!

PS You might have planners on your back by putting something on top of the existing garage roof, just a warning.

LOL, yes you're talking out of your Piers Morgan I'm afraid.

Unfortunately, the "car port" belongs to my neighbour at the  back of me and he drives his cars in under the "terrace" on top (which I own and  I have a door from my first  floor leading out to it). So, the idea of using joists doesn't fly as I'm sure my neighbour would be rather upset when he found, one day, he couldn't drive his car in.

[Mark2022]

On 26/03/2023 at 20:16, mikeDnight said:

 A lot will depend on what sort of observer you are. If only low power visual you may get away with resting a pier on the existing floor, but as you say there is flexure in the floor, I can't see how you'd build a solid enough pier on the budget you suggest. Ideally the pier should be built on a solid base, which would mean either build from the ground up, going through your suspended floor, or building a sub floor from the wall to the steel girder. The first will mean you lose your car port, but either would cost substantially more than £75.   You could however lessen the flexure if the observatory you intend to build has a floor, while the pier rests on the carport roof. If you decided on a block pier you'd really need a solid base or flexure would eventually fracture the joints. A sheet metal worker may be able to construct a pier to your specifications quite cheaply, but again £75 may be too little considering both time and materials. 

It's not my car port.

I intend to do photography. 'Ideally' the pier should be built on a solid base but there is no way of achieving that. The 'play' is minimal but it is enough to cause problems. I intend to build a floor for the obsy and 'spread' my weight when walking around then have holes (or a hole) in the floor to allow the tripod or pier to sit on the large, heavy slabs deflecting some of that play. It's the best I can do, unfortunately. That said, at least the rig will be safe from theft or vandals since there is no way to get  to it except through my door on my first floor unless they use ladders. Unlikely to even have such a problem however since nobody (except my direct neighbours) will know what that 'shed' has in it and it will not even be seen from street level (except perhaps the roof).

[doublevodka]

There are pillar mounts that may be suitable, sometimes the Vixen GP ones appear on the second hand market which may be in your budget, they look like this and I believe they fit EQ5's - https://ensoptical.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=10594&search=vixen&page=2

Sky-watcher do a modern one, but it's well over your budget - https://www.firstlightoptics.com/sky-watcher-mount-accessories/skywatcher-pillar-mount-support-for-heq5-eq6-series-mounts.html

[Peter Drew]

47 minutes ago, Mark2022 said:

How do you build such a thing and what do you use for a mounting plate for attaching the EQ5?

A basic "Todmorden" pier is essentially a 600x600x50 paving slab and a couple of standard hollow building blocks.  The items are bolted together with 12mm stainless steel screwed rod.  A hole drilled in the top of the top block will allow bolting through to the base of the EQ mount.  A piece of tubing equal to the largest diameter of the EQ base will spread the load.  Images on other threads.     🙂

[Mr H in Yorkshire]

Before investing time, effort and money in the whole project, would it help to do a test run to see if the idea is even likely to yield a positive result? Use some slabs, a tripod sandbagged a bit say, and attempt a photograph. See what the results are.

[Mark2022]

1 hour ago, Mr H in Yorkshire said:

Before investing time, effort and money in the whole project, would it help to do a test run to see if the idea is even likely to yield a positive result? Use some slabs, a tripod sandbagged a bit say, and attempt a photograph. See what the results are.

Yes, if there were an alternative but there isn't. I can only set up a rig where I've said.  There's no option. Now, I don't see any advantage in retaining the tripod for better stability  over some sort of pier unless someone corrects me. I just have to do the best with what I've got.

[Mark2022]

4 hours ago, Peter Drew said:

A basic "Todmorden" pier is essentially a 600x600x50 paving slab and a couple of standard hollow building blocks.  The items are bolted together with 12mm stainless steel screwed rod.  A hole drilled in the top of the top block will allow bolting through to the base of the EQ mount.  A piece of tubing equal to the largest diameter of the EQ base will spread the load.  Images on other threads.     🙂

Have searched and the only results which come up is this thread.

[Mr H in Yorkshire]

13 minutes ago, Mark2022 said:

Yes, if there were an alternative but there isn't.

I obviously didn't express my thoughts well enough. I meant before you made the observatory shed and the false floor etc, test the inherent stability of the deck level that will hold the scope.

[Peter Drew]

49 minutes ago, Mark2022 said:

Have searched and the only results which come up is this thread.

 

[Peter Drew]

One of 6 that form part of one of my observatories.     🙂

[Tiny Clanger]

2 hours ago, Mark2022 said:

Have searched and the only results which come up is this thread.

The default setting for the search box on the page is search 'This Topic'

If you search 'everywhere' instead, there's plenty of information:

https://stargazerslounge.com/search/?&q=todmorden pier&quick=1&item=408273&search_and_or=and&sortby=relevancy

 

 

[Mark2022]

On 28/03/2023 at 17:36, Mr H in Yorkshire said:

I obviously didn't express my thoughts well enough. I meant before you made the observatory shed and the false floor etc, test the inherent stability of the deck level that will hold the scope.

Mr H: No, I understood you, it's just I have no option regarding where I build and what on.  The only "test" I've done is walking on it and, when I am close to my Meade 8 inch, or looking through it and moving my centre of gravity, there will be movement I observe in what I'm observing. What I intend doing, therefore, is creating/building a deck which will possibly be around 8 x 8ft with the shed on top (perhaps 6x4 or 5x5) and a Todmorden set onto two large slabs - one on top of the other - which will be set on the deck floor. When I walk around on the new deck, my weight will be spread significantly which should, I imagine, reduce the play (and movement in the eyepiece or camera) to near zero. That's all I can hope for anyhow. Then, once polar aligned, I will be inside, remote from the scope and there will be no movement.

[Mark2022]

On 28/03/2023 at 19:41, Tiny Clanger said:

The default setting for the search box on the page is search 'This Topic'

If you search 'everywhere' instead, there's plenty of information:

https://stargazerslounge.com/search/?&q=todmorden pier&quick=1&item=408273&search_and_or=and&sortby=relevancy

 

 

Thanks Tiny. All I can say to that (to myself) is "Duh!"

[Mark2022]

On 28/03/2023 at 18:14, Peter Drew said:

One of 6 that form part of one of my observatories.     🙂

I've just seen one of the threads with a guy who simply used a strong glue to bond  the blocks to paving slabs and then his old tripod head to the top block. Easy! That's what I intend to do. Cheers.

[Mark2022]

On 28/03/2023 at 12:24, doublevodka said:

There are pillar mounts that may be suitable, sometimes the Vixen GP ones appear on the second hand market which may be in your budget, they look like this and I believe they fit EQ5's - https://ensoptical.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=10594&search=vixen&page=2

Sky-watcher do a modern one, but it's well over your budget - https://www.firstlightoptics.com/sky-watcher-mount-accessories/skywatcher-pillar-mount-support-for-heq5-eq6-series-mounts.html

I vowed I would never buy from ENSOptical.

[doublevodka]

53 minutes ago, Mark2022 said:

I vowed I would never buy from ENSOptical.

I wasn't recommending you did, just used the link as an example of the vixen pedestal and couldn't see any anywhere else at the moment, they have occasionally appeared in the for sale items here over the past couple of years, maybe worth a wanted and if the idea takes your fancy 👍