Help Please - new mount quest. CQ350 vs CEM70

[AstroGS]

I want to setup a permanent pier that, that will not be in an observatory but, it will be carry a permanent rig (Stellamira ED90 Triplet + camera, filter wheel and etc.) and it will be covered by a Telegiszmo cover throughout the year. Currently, I have a ZWO AM5 but, I will be using it as a grab-n-go mount rather than a main mount.

 

Over the next 12-18 months, i will be investing in a RASA8 and probably at a newtonian reflector so, I will need to cater for a heavier rigs than the one o have today. For the foreseeable future, I will be managing everything via Asiair and I am not thinking of moving into Ascom, NINA an etc. any time soon.

 

For this reason, I am after a new mount that will be able to cater for all the above and track well - I am based in Northampton at Bottle 5/6 skies.

I have shortlisted the following mounts:

SW EQ6R-Pro

SW CQ350 Pro

iOptron CEM70

 

I used to have an EQ6R Pro and it was very good (but, stupidity enough I sold it) and was working seamlessly with Asiair. I am not after the specs of each mount and load capacity - I am probably interested to find out from users of these mounts about their thoughts, if anyone has done anything similar (outdoors permanent pier) and how well it works with asiair. 

 

 

Edited March 25, 2023 by George Sinanis

[Cosmic Geoff]

I have an EQ-5 garden mounted on a Sky-watcher tri-pier (search for 'pillar mount').  It works well, and being able to start from Park is a huge gain in convenience over having to set up and align each time. No need for an expensive pier foundation or mount-pier adapter. I keep the telescope indoors.

There is (or was) a variant of the Sky-watcher tri-pier that takes the EQ-6 mount.

I saw the SW CQ350 Pro at the Practical Astronomy show. Looked like a big mount.

Edited March 15, 2023 by Cosmic Geoff

[Adreneline]

On 12/03/2023 at 21:36, George Sinanis said:

anyone has done anything similar (outdoors permanent pier) and how well it works with asiair.

My permanent pier is one of the best things I ever did. The combination of AZEQ6+ASIair-Pro (or Plus) works flawlessly with hard-wired network and pretty well on wifi, but I am on the range limit.

The combination of TG cover and pet-warming pad keeps the mount dry at all times; I always remove the OTA assembly at the end of a session.

 

Typically takes me 5-10 minutes to be setup and ready to start an imaging session.

HTH.

 

[AstroGS]

@Cosmic Geoff @Adreneline many thanks for your input. May I ask why are you taking in the rig? Is it because you are (rightly) afraid that might be stolen or because the rig might be susceptible to damage?

 

also, @Adreneline do you have more info on your pier and how you set it up?

[Adreneline]

4 hours ago, George Sinanis said:

May I ask why are you taking in the rig?

Purely because I don't like the idea of leaving out, although I am sure the TG would protect it well enough.

4 hours ago, George Sinanis said:

do you have more info on your pier and how you set it up?

As I have no intention of mounting large telescopes on my pier I didn't go mad with a concrete mount - I settled for a modest block just 600 x 600 x 300 mm - that is still a big chunk of concrete! I kept disruption to the surrounding soil to a minimum. To me it feels completely solid and more than up to the task of providing a steady platform for the AZEQ6 and RedCat/SharpStar telescopes. I also routed a mains supply to the mount and a network cable - nothing fancy - just a mains lead with a moulded twin socket. The pet-warming mat is powered from the mains cable and switched to operate 6 hours ON - 6 hours OFF. I did have approval to build a permanent enclosure but this arrangement works more than well enough for me.

I will PM you more photos of the build.

Adrian

[Lumos]

On 12/03/2023 at 21:36, George Sinanis said:

Over the next 12-18 months, i will be investing in a RASA8 and probably at a newtonian reflector so, I will need to cater for a heavier rigs than the one o have today. For the foreseeable future, I will be managing everything via Asiair and I am not thinking of moving into Ascom, NINA an etc. any time soon.

 

For this reason, I am after a new mount that will be able to cater for all the above and track well - I am based in Northampton at Bottle 5/6 skies.

I have shortlisted the following mounts:

SW EQ6R-Pro

SW CQ350 Pro

iOptron CEM70

 

 

I have the CEM70G and have used it with the RASA 8 and the Esprit 150. I find it to be rock solid, great guiding and even the 150 is not affected by wind. I do like the convenience of power and USB distribution being available on the saddle. When I first got the RASA 8 I did not even bother guiding as it was so fast and the CEM70 tracks so well.

Any other questions do not hesitate to ask or PM me.

 

Edited March 18, 2023 by Lumos
reply hidden

[AstroGS]

Still debating between the CQ350 and CEM70 - price wise both are close to each other, payload again very close. Is it a matter of either will be good or the general consensus is that one could fit better my needs. I have to go with the info I get online as, I have never seen either in action.

Again, there is a good possibility to buy a SW 190MN for starts and move to a RASA8 on later stage and when funds allows it.

 

[drjolo]

I am currently testing CQ350 and waiting for the clear sky to do tracking, guiding, and PPEC tests. I have read reports about CQ350 with RMS guiding error between 0.3-0.5" without PPEC and that looks very good. Other than that both mounts are quite similar with regard to specifications. So it may be a matter of other factors, like for example software you use. I personally prefer GS Server which works with Sky-Watcher mounts, than iOptron software. 

I used to have three iOptron mounts (ZEQ25, CEM26, and Smart EQ Pro) and was not happy about them due to the motor downsizing (balancing issues). The same problem is for CEM45, however, I do not have any experience with CEM70. I wanted to have it once in my shed, but it turned out my current EQ6 is perfectly enough for my setups (the largest load was ACF10" with equipment that was about 13kg). 

[AstroGS]

2 hours ago, drjolo said:

I am currently testing CQ350 and waiting for the clear sky to do tracking, guiding, and PPEC tests. I have read reports about CQ350 with RMS guiding error between 0.3-0.5" without PPEC and that looks very good. Other than that both mounts are quite similar with regard to specifications. So it may be a matter of other factors, like for example software you use. I personally prefer GS Server which works with Sky-Watcher mounts, than iOptron software. 

I used to have three iOptron mounts (ZEQ25, CEM26, and Smart EQ Pro) and was not happy about them due to the motor downsizing (balancing issues). The same problem is for CEM45, however, I do not have any experience with CEM70. I wanted to have it once in my shed, but it turned out my current EQ6 is perfectly enough for my setups (the largest load was ACF10" with equipment that was about 13kg). 

I will be super interested to hear your thoughts when you get a sec to test it. Looking forward for the good, bad and ugly (if any) areas of the mount. I’m using an Asiair - it seems that me and ASCOM are not compatible.

[Grant Fribbens]

@drjolo I am interested in you PPEC results as on the GreenSwampServer board someone has asked about the CQ350 which does not report a PPEC capability to EQMOD or GSS and I think the author has contacted SkyWatcher and they have said that it is not supported. I have found the manual online and it does state that it has 200 segment container for PPEC data so am confused. Maybe you can only do PPEC training via the Synscan Handset and not controlling the mount via PC direct.

If it does not support PPEC then this would be a backward step.

[AstroGS]

20 hours ago, Grant Fribbens said:

@drjolo I am interested in you PPEC results as on the GreenSwampServer board someone has asked about the CQ350 which does not report a PPEC capability to EQMOD or GSS and I think the author has contacted SkyWatcher and they have said that it is not supported. I have found the manual online and it does state that it has 200 segment container for PPEC data so am confused. Maybe you can only do PPEC training via the Synscan Handset and not controlling the mount via PC direct.

If it does not support PPEC then this would be a backward step.

This is indeed interesting if that is the case and it could be a stopper for me of buying the CQ350. I do wish to get a future proof mount. I might then go for a CEM70. 

[Starflyer]

I've owned a number of Skywatcher EQ6 variants over the years, the quality of these was quite varied, the AZEQ6 GT being the best performer.

A few years ago I bought a CEM60 EC and it has performed flawlessly since then, so much so that I now own two of these mounts. People complain about the difficulty in getting the CE mounts balanced, personally I see it as a benefit, an EQ mount can be just as much out of balance but you'll never know it due to the axis resistance.

All mounts can have problems out of the box, I'd guess I see around an equal number of reports of problems between Skywatcher and iOptron mounts.  I'm biased, I regularly get a guiding rms of below 0.4 arcsec at 17KGs / 1200mm focal length with an OAG, but I'd always buy iOptron now.

[AstroGS]

12 minutes ago, Starflyer said:

I've owned a number of Skywatcher EQ6 variants over the years, the quality of these was quite varied, the AZEQ6 GT being the best performer.

A few years ago I bought a CEM60 EC and it has performed flawlessly since then, so much so that I now own two of these mounts. People complain about the difficulty in getting the CE mounts balanced, personally I see it as a benefit, an EQ mount can be just as much out of balance but you'll never know it due to the axis resistance.

All mounts can have problems out of the box, I'd guess I see around an equal number of reports of problems between Skywatcher and iOptron mounts.  I'm biased, I regularly get a guiding rms of below 0.4 arcsec at 17KGs / 1200mm focal length with an OAG, but I'd always buy iOptron now.

Thanks for your feedback - any chance you are using the mount with Asiair?

 

[drjolo]

On 31/03/2023 at 13:00, Grant Fribbens said:

@drjolo I am interested in you PPEC results as on the GreenSwampServer board someone has asked about the CQ350 which does not report a PPEC capability to EQMOD or GSS and I think the author has contacted SkyWatcher and they have said that it is not supported. I have found the manual online and it does state that it has 200 segment container for PPEC data so am confused. Maybe you can only do PPEC training via the Synscan Handset and not controlling the mount via PC direct.

If it does not support PPEC then this would be a backward step.

Yes, the same appears to me - both GS Server and SynScanApp after connecting to CQ350 show that PPEC training is not supported. The only way to start PPEC training is to select the proper option in SynScan HC, but according to the manual the mount LED should then blink periodically during the training, and it does not in the mount I test. I asked the manufacturer about it but did not receive any answer yet. 

I totally agree that mount of that class needs to support PPEC. 

[Starflyer]

8 hours ago, AstroGS said:

Thanks for your feedback - any chance you are using the mount with Asiair?

 

Afraid not, I value my ability to choose cameras not made by ZWO, and to run software of my choosing. I run a mini PC and power box mounted on top of my OTAs.

There's an iOptron Facebook group that's quite active, you should get some answers there. 

[AstroGS]

@Starflyer how are you getting along with the CQ350? I am still in the market of an mid level observatory class mount, that can manage a 20kgr payload with ease.